Advice on first plane purchase (and first Mooney)

[BostonM20]

I’m an instrument-rated private pilot who has been living abroad for the past few years and only doing limited VFR flying (5-10 hours a year), but I am permanently relocating to the Boston area this summer. I want to take the leap and buy a first plane as I get fully back into flying…and I’ve narrowed in on a Mooney (I think!).

 

The mission is a mix of XC trips (<500 nm) and local/$100 hamburger flying. It would typically be me +1, but I want the option to take 3-4. Being in the northeast, I don’t think I need (or want the added expense of) a turbo + O2. I want it to be a solid IFR platform. I’d like to keep all-in acquisition cost (purchase + initial maintenance/avionics upgrades) <$150K.

 

With that context, here’s what I think I am looking for:

• M20F (with J mods), J, or R/S. Probably a J.
• GTN650/750
• Transponder with ADS-B in/out
• Autopilot with altitude hold + glidescope
• Engine monitoring (with fuel flow/totalizer)
• Speed brakes
• <1000 hours SMOH
• Given budget, I’m probably looking at six-pack instruments (much as I’d love a G3X). I’d like to put in dual G5s/GI275s for attitude and HSI (and remove the vacuum system), but that can come after a year or two.

 

Below are a bunch of questions I’ve been mulling; I would welcome input on any of them anyone wants to take on:

1. Is F (with mods), J, R/S a good short-list? How should I be thinking about the trade-offs between them (besides price)?
2. For these models, what are the “watch-outs” or things to screen for (e.g., I’ve heard about fuel tank reseals)? Any recurring ADs to be aware of?
3. In terms of panel/mods/specs, what other things should I have on my list? Is anything I have on there now unnecessary?
4. Living in the northeast and wanting to fly in winter, should I be considering TKS? Or can that wait for the “second plane” given budget and mission?
5. How much should a pre-purchase inspection cost? Is it safe to ask a local Mooney Service Center to do it, or is there a better way to find a mechanic (wherever the plane may be located)?
6. Very practically, how do all the pieces come together at the time of purchase (purchasing plane, getting it insured, ferrying it home, doing transition training, securing a place to park it)? What is the order of operations? I don’t have a complex endorsement or any Mooney time yet (intending to do some dual in a rental M20J I have found after the COVID situation eases).
7. What else should I be thinking about?

[ArtVandelay]

In order of importance:

1. corrosion
2. engine
3. fuel tanks

A prebuy is around $1,000 give or take depending on what you ask them to check, see #1 above.

i wouldn’t worry about #6 yet.   First step is to figure out what you want.  What flexibility will have to cancel or postpone your flights? How many passengers and weight you need to carry?

[Mcstealth]

Welcome home. Good luck on your search. 

You are in solid J territory with some room to maneuver. Some on here would advocate to purchase a run out bird and build it back up per your desires. You do seem to have the budget for it. Others would say purchase a turn key for your purposes. to me, that would depend on your time constraints and schedule. Building up a runout has its upside. 

A certain low response member here will try to influence you into an "O" but don't listen to him.:)

[gsxrpilot]

The F and the S, (along with the Encore) are the useful load champs of the whole fleet. 

[ArtVandelay]

. Some on here would advocate to purchase a run out bird and build it back up per your desires. You do seem to have the budget for it. Others would say purchase a turn key for your purposes. to me, that would depend on your time constraints and schedule.

I think it depends on whether this just a stepping stone to another plane or this is the last plane you’ll ever own.


Tom

[Mcstealth]

1 hour ago, ArtVandelay said:

I think it depends on whether this just a stepping stone to another plane or this is the last plane you’ll ever own.


Tom

That is a good observation  

[carusoam]

Welcome aboard Boston...

How much time / effort do you have to apply to this project?

You may want to reconsider your choice of home Dromes as well...

KBOS is really good if you fly a 737...  but the $10/gal fuel cost can get in the way of some MSers...

Two close by airports you might consider are Norwood and Beverly...

Some people around here have learned to fly primary in the most powerful Mooneys... that can take on a whole new level of dedication...

There are Mooneys around here available to rent... a few hours in one will open your eyes on which level you want to chase down...

Expect to want some good transition training to go with that... learning about PPIs is good for your wallet...

Three days or so can get you up to speed from whatever plane you currently fly to safely Flying IFR in a fast Mooney...

MS has members in Europe... we even have a forum specific to their needs...   getting some Mooney experience while in Europe... will be a great opportunity to see the differences when you get stateside... 

What city are you currently in?  We also have some members in the Cape Town (FACT) area... and Australia too...

PP thoughts only, not a CFI...

 

Best regards,

-a-

[Niko182]

The model variations you posted allow you to buy anything from an M20A to a bravo. All of these can be found for under 150k. However as much as aquisition cost matters, how much youre willing to spend yearly varies strongly between models. The most expensive to own is going to be a bravo. The cheapest per mile to own will be a C, E, or J. An ovation/eagle from personal experience can not be owned for 13 or 14 grand per 100 hours. A C might be able to do that. I dont know, ive never owned a c. If you plan on owning this for 5 plus years, aircraft cost tends to be a pretty small factor.

[BostonM20]

1 hour ago, carusoam said:

Welcome aboard Boston...

How much time / effort do you have to apply to this project?

You may want to reconsider your choice of home Dromes as well...

KBOS is really good if you fly a 737...  but the $10/gal fuel cost can get in the way of some MSers...

Two close by airports you might consider are Norwood and Beverly...

Some people around here have learned to fly primary in the most powerful Mooneys... that can take on a whole new level of dedication...

There are Mooneys around here available to rent... a few hours in one will open your eyes on which level you want to chase down...

Expect to want some good transition training to go with that... learning about PPIs is good for your wallet...

Three days or so can get you up to speed from whatever plane you currently fly to safely Flying IFR in a fast Mooney...

MS has members in Europe... we even have a forum specific to their needs...   getting some Mooney experience while in Europe... will be a great opportunity to see the differences when you get stateside... 

What city are you currently in?  We also have some members in the Cape Town (FACT) area... and Australia too...

PP thoughts only, not a CFI...

 

Best regards,

-a-

I'd say I have a moderate amount of time and effort. 

 

Of course I don't actually intend to base at KBOS . It will depend on where exactly I end up living, but KOWD would probably be my first choice. I assume that hangar availability at KOWD/KBED/KBVY is limited/exorbitant, but I'd prefer not to be too far out of the city. Anyways, settling the tie-down vs. hangar debate and finding a spot will be a project for another day (and another post). I grew up in the area and did some of my PPL at KPYM, so I know the options well. If anyone has a lead, shoot me a PM.

 

I'm in Cape Town at the moment, and I'm meant to do some dual in the M20J they have at Morningstar after things open back up. But if there are any MS members in the area I'd love to trade some avgas and/or a few rounds of drinks for a ride and a discussion!  

 

Edited April 13, 2020 by BostonM20

[carusoam]

Norwood is a pretty nice place to be...

MSC should still be on the field...

The MBTA has train and trolley maps on line...  A great way to commute into the city...

I went to a high school in the next town over back in the day...   are you familiar with XBHS?

Get fired up!

Go Mooney!

Best regards,

-a-

[Fry]

Instead of "maximum of 1000h SMOH", I'd place a condition "minimum of 50 flight hours in any given year in the past".

It does not help an engine to be parked on the ground. Engines live longer when running regularly.

[JT]

Get the cleanest, latest model J you can find. You will love it and remember it fondly after you've moved up to a long body.

[Mcstealth]

@BostonM20

What JT said. 

[Bravoman]

Corrosion mentioned above but have a prepurchase inspection by a mooney familiar shop, preferably a service center, check for tubular frame corrosion in particular as well as corrosion generally. My msc had an outwardly beautiful later model J in for prebuy that was corroded from mouse urine which was also on the tubes. If it was repairable at all which I understand was questionable it would have cost a ton. This is memorable to me because to look at the exterior and interior ( seats, carpet, headliner, panel, etc) of the plane it was pristine.

Edited April 14, 2020 by Bravoman

[HIghpockets]

I like your plan.  I had 500 hours in a PA28-180 and had my instrument rating before I transitioned to my J. The speed brakes are useful but if you found an airplane that met all of your other criteria I would not make it a deal breaker.  I highly recommend training with a Mooney specific CFII and/or attending a Mooney PPP.  Actually, there is a J for sale right now at KBLM. As soon as you are able I would recommend the dual G5s and the GFC 500. 

[pwnel]

23 hours ago, BostonM20 said:

I'm in Cape Town at the moment, and I'm meant to do some dual in the M20J they have at Morningstar after things open back up. But if there are any MS members in the area I'd love to trade some avgas and/or a few rounds of drinks for a ride and a discussion!  

 

Ah, my home town!  I've let my SA license lapse though - pity, would be nice to fly a J next time I'm there.

For the OP:  Sounds like a J.  Highly recommend you buy through Jimmy at All American Aircraft.  Have the pre-buy done with JD at SWTA or one of the other nearby MSC's.  Jimmy can arrange transition training - Brian Lloyd lives across they runway from All American and flew his K around the world.  Fly it home yourself.   Air-Mods in NJ is probably the closest MSC for future maintenance.  Highly recommend you stick with a Mooney expert to maintain the plane.  Finally, all the glass sounds nice - but frankly I think most folks completely overcapitalize.  Fly the plane for a year and then decide about upgrades.

Edited April 14, 2020 by pwnel

[Mufflerbearing]

There is an old saying.  "I am too poor to buy cheap things".  It was this last summer where I started to look at my first plane and after substantial study with this community and other sources, I decided to buy a plane that checked all of the boxes on my list.  It is an S with the Screaming Eagle upgrade, FIKI, a ton of electronics.  It is a rare thing to find the unicorn.  You know, the one thing you can buy where you  wouldn't do anything to or change.  Yours is out there waiting patiently for you to find it.  Take the time and it'll show itself. 

All Mooneys are amazing.  We have absolutely no buyers remorse large in part because of the plane and because of the awesome prior care taker of our plane.  They were amazing plane owners.  When buying a plane, you are buying the prior owner too.  How did they take care of it?  Did they do all maintenance and do it properly?  Were they good stewards? 

[Skates97]

45 minutes ago, Mufflerbearing said:

There is an old saying.  "I am too poor to buy cheap things". 

I have a really good friend that would say "Buy the best and cry once." 

[KWFalconguy]

Boston,

Its a shame you aren’t moving to Atlanta. I’m in exactly same boat as you in what you are looking for. Maybe we could have partnered. I can’t find any hangar space around here so I don’t know how that will affect my outcome. 

Good luck, Hope we don’t decide on same plane!

[Ragsf15e]

I agree that the initial purchase price may be a shocker for some airplanes but your cost over a few years will be less than “cheaper” ones.  It’s the annual costs of maintenance, hangar, insurance, upgrades, etc that get you.

That being said, if possible, look at an Eagle with FIKI.  They don’t sell often.  An Ovation would be next.  Absolutely nothing wrong with a nice J.  They are terrific, but you can write off a decent number of winter trips in the northeast.  I don’t wanna start a fight about icing here, and I don’t think you should be happy cruising in icing in your “invincible” FIKI Mooney, but I would kill for the ability to punch through a 1000’ layer of icy clouds to severe clear on top.  Here in the northwest, it’s very hard to use my F in the winter.

So think long and hard about FIKI... it will definitely add expense and limit useful load, but definitely add utility around Boston.  If you decide you don’t need it, the advice for a late model, clean J was perfect. 

[Davidv]

On 4/13/2020 at 3:03 PM, BostonM20 said:

I'd say I have a moderate amount of time and effort. 

 

Of course I don't actually intend to base at KBOS . It will depend on where exactly I end up living, but KOWD would probably be my first choice. I assume that hangar availability at KOWD/KBED/KBVY is limited/exorbitant, but I'd prefer not to be too far out of the city. Anyways, settling the tie-down vs. hangar debate and finding a spot will be a project for another day (and another post). I grew up in the area and did some of my PPL at KPYM, so I know the options well. If anyone has a lead, shoot me a PM.

 

I'm in Cape Town at the moment, and I'm meant to do some dual in the M20J they have at Morningstar after things open back up. But if there are any MS members in the area I'd love to trade some avgas and/or a few rounds of drinks for a ride and a discussion!  

 

Welcome aboard, I actually grew up west of Boston.  My advice is to get your name on multiple hangar lists ASAP and you may even luck out by the time you get the plane.  Check out 6B6 as well...I'm sure they are probably full but that's where I fly into when I'm back home.  They also seem to have some of the lowest fuel prices around.

[quik flite]

Buy the nicest ,best maintained and with avionics you need , one you can find ,it will soon be the least expensive one you looked at and bought. ( jimmy garrison) is very helpful and also knowledgeable , his prices are really what the market will bring and no more ,if you see one he has that you like. (Or just a few questions)