Plane down @ KERV

[m20kmooney]

RIP. Prayers for their loved ones. 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/kerrville-plane-crash-six-people-feared-dead-small-plane-crash-texas-today-live-updates/

[mike_elliott]

There was a tfr just outside the FAF of Rwy 12 today for this accident as I flew into KERV. 

RIP, it is always sad to lose one of us.

[Mcstealth]

Not far from the airport, coming in from a trip, no fire at impact, the plane looks like it just plopped down, no large debris field, from the pics I've seen it looks survivable but no one did.. armchair quarterback tells me it ran out of fuel but what the hell do I know.

[gsxrpilot]

In Memoriam: Jeffrey Carl Weiss  All of us at Angel Flight South Central are heartbroken at the news that we lost one of our own yesterday. Jeff Weiss—who from 2002–2016 had volunteered so generously to fly Angel Flight patients to life-saving treatment—died on the morning of April 22, 2019, when his plane crashed outside of Kerrville, Texas. Jeff was an investment banker, and yesterday was flying several members of the Houston real estate community to view a potential property purchase. The Beechcraft BE58 took off from West Houston Airport in Katy at approximately 7:30 a.m. and crashed at 8:50 a.m., about 10 miles away from its destination, Kerrville Municipal Airport, according to the FAA. The cause of the crash is still under investigation. Jeff had 42 years of experience as a pilot and an exemplary safety record at Angel Flight South Central. He used his considerable talents and generosity to fly patients to medical appointments with us for nearly 15 years. He also financially supported the 1940 Air Terminal Museum at Hobby Airport in Houston and was generally a committed philanthropist. Our hearts and prayers are with the families and loved ones of all who were on board.

[Mcstealth]

Cabin was flattened pancake style I am sorry to say. Come to find out this happened next to my parents acreage right over rhe fence, so went and took a look. 

No skid marks, plane was basically intact, minus 24 or more inches of height.

Prayers to all the families of those involved. 

[tigers2007]

How would it rest down intact like that?

 

** Edit**

 

I found a photo via Katheryns Report. It really does look like it fell flat to the earth. Terrible loss of six lives.

 

https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-BEN14CUEjfk/XL51A7K9HnI/AAAAAAACbTg/Cfwsfoy8X8wBsmq1BgJ2ASB1sDAIYVc_ACLcBGAs/s1600/KathrynsReport.jpg

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[peevee]

Vmc spin maybe?

[Mcstealth]

1 hour ago, tigers2007 said:

How would it rest down intact like that?

 

** Edit**

 

I found a photo via Katheryns Report. It really does look like it fell flat to the earth. Terrible loss of six lives.

 

https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-BEN14CUEjfk/XL51A7K9HnI/AAAAAAACbTg/Cfwsfoy8X8wBsmq1BgJ2ASB1sDAIYVc_ACLcBGAs/s1600/KathrynsReport.jpg

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

That photo was taken after the first responders took off the roof and door.

Can't help but notice how the wings look a little askew from the fuselage in that picture. @peevee is probably on to something. 

[carusoam]

Twins don’t have CO challenges like singles do, or do they?  Cabin heat exhaust leak?

Looks kind of like a ghost ship... kept flying the AP program until power decreased... that would lead to landing at cruise speed in cruise configuration...

Sorry for the speculation, hoping it helps...

Solid plane, skilled pilot, tremendous loss...

Prayers,

-a-

[M20F]

2 hours ago, carusoam said:

Twins don’t have CO challenges like singles do, or do they?  Cabin heat exhaust leak?

Most have a heater in the nose that is essentially a blow torch in a tube.  They can leak C02. No speculation my end just answering this question.  

[Yetti]

One witness said spiral.  Wondering if one engine stopped turning would cause flat spin.   straight in approach.  1200 AGL ceiling.  

 

https://www.click2houston.com/news/officials-to-give-update-on-fatal-kerrville-plane-crash

Edited April 25, 2019 by Yetti

[steingar]

6 pax?  Burn enough fuel to move the CG aft?

[peevee]

6 hours ago, carusoam said:

Twins don’t have CO challenges like singles do, or do they?  Cabin heat exhaust leak?

Looks kind of like a ghost ship... kept flying the AP program until power decreased... that would lead to landing at cruise speed in cruise configuration...

Sorry for the speculation, hoping it helps...

Solid plane, skilled pilot, tremendous loss...

Prayers,

-a-

they use something like this

https://janitrol.aero/aircraft-heaters/

[orionflt]

with out seeing pics of the surrounding area, the lack of impact marks and the twist of the plane make me think he came down in a flat spin. definitely curious what happened. sending prayers to the families and friends.   

[Shadrach]

1 hour ago, orionflt said:

with out seeing pics of the surrounding area, the lack of impact marks and the twist of the plane make me think he came down in a flat spin. definitely curious what happened. sending prayers to the families and friends.   

My thoughts as well. The NTSB will be able to tell from the impact marks. Determining the impact scenario will be relatively easy compared to the cause. Does anyone know if they were IFR at the time? hopefully the pilot gave ATC some insight into the nature of the problem.

[gsxrpilot]

1 hour ago, Shadrach said:

My thoughts as well. The NTSB will be able to tell from the impact marks. Determining the impact scenario will be relatively easy compared to the cause. Does anyone know if they were IFR at the time? hopefully the pilot gave ATC some insight into the nature of the problem.

I believe they were IFR.

[mike_elliott]

6 hours ago, gsxrpilot said:

I believe they were IFR.

It was IFR that day. I had to come in on an approach shortly after the accident, right over the accident area, There was a TFR for the accident, but we couldnt see anything as we were in IMC then. THe TFR was for 1K feet and just below the glideslope.

RIP, so sad. without speculating, fuel is suspect.

[jonhop]

12 hours ago, Yetti said:

One witness said spiral.  Wondering if fuel exhaustion on one engine would cause flat spin.   straight in approach.  1200 AGL ceiling.  

 

https://www.click2houston.com/news/officials-to-give-update-on-fatal-kerrville-plane-crash

In the article comments section, one reader speculated that "it looks like the propeller on the starboard engine is feathered. He must have lost this engine. He was probably too heavy to maintain altitude while flying on one engine. He probably got below Vmc (min air speed to maintain control on one engine) and flat spinned into the ground." Seems logical. 

[thinwing]

I agree flat spin

[carusoam]

Is there a flightaware track of the flight? A tail number to go with that?

Logic may indicate, one of the engines stopped.  It may be fuel related.

But, the cause for the fuel challenge interests me...

What kept the skilled pilot from keeping control of the aircraft?

There would be a radio conversation with ATC that would request assistance, at least a declaration...

Something happened that kept the PIC from being PIC...?

A topic that I would like to share with @DanM20C   A potential CO sensor/alarm situation...

Thanks to the guys that posted Janitrol heater info above. I remember their history from a ways back...

Best regards,

-a-

 

[Yetti]

Pretty warm in Texas that day.  NTSB said they had already switched to CTAF.

[Danb]

No sign of fire also makes one wonder... if it was associated with an engine out and after the Duke accident engine out on take out depicts the reason training is essential when driving a twin 

[Dan208]

Very sad sad situation.  The Duke video was enough to keep me from wanting a ride in a piston twin . King Air , sure. Piston twin , not so much.

Be safe out there Aviators. 

[aviatoreb]

38 minutes ago, Dan208 said:

Very sad sad situation.  The Duke video was enough to keep me from wanting a ride in a piston twin . King Air , sure. Piston twin , not so much.

Be safe out there Aviators. 

...as said many times.  Its the plane and the pilot training.  I know Cape Air has been flying the Cessna 402 for years and years as scheduled air service with dozens of planes and countless of hours.  As far as I know, never a major accident.  (They did have a runway over run I know of a few years ago - in the very same exact airframe that starred in the tv show Wings - they repaired it).  I have known some of the pilots and they are proud of this record.  And they are highly trained in twin emergency ops, as that airline has a really well oiled pilot training system.

I am doubtful I personally would fly enough to maintain such currency.

[tigers2007]

2 hours ago, Dan208 said:

Very sad sad situation.  The Duke video was enough to keep me from wanting a ride in a piston twin . King Air , sure. Piston twin , not so much.

Be safe out there Aviators. 

Cessna 337?