QUESTION: Throttle Quadrant vs Push/Pull

[Jpflysdfw]

As I'm sifting through planes on trade-a-plane, barnstormers etc, I notice some have throttle quadrant type controls and some don't.  Having not used one before, my intuition is they are not as precise when trying to lean to some specfic ROP/LOP position. Because of this view, I've been disregarding those planes as viable purchase candidates ( currently looking at C's, E's and F's).  First question is whether there is some decoder ring regarding which models (or years) have one vs the other? Second question is whether or not my intuition is correct so I'm seeking insight from those with experience.  Last question is how difficult and/or expensive is it to convent to push/pull/vernier type controls.  Apologies for the newbie question but decided the voices of experience would be far better than what my gut tells me.

Cheers, Jeff

[Mooneymite]

My Mooney has a quadrant.  I like it.  Since all the airplanes I've ever flown for pay are equipped with quadrants, it's never been an issue.  It is more what you are used to, but if you move on to larger faster planes, you'll leave the vernier behind with no looking back.

[BDPetersen]

My lawn tractor has a quadrant. Makes me feel like I'm still flying a Boeing. Lousy engine-out, though.

[N201MKTurbo]

My plane has a throttle quadrant. I wish it didn't. It is fine for throttle and prop, it is horrible for mixture. In the Mooney the Quadrant takes up a lot of knee room. When I had my F I could sit kind of cross legged in cruise with my right knee laying across the top of the nose wheel well. The quadrant blocks that space and forces you to keep your legs straight in front of you. 

[KSMooniac]

My '77 J had a quadrant that I hated, but didn't stop me from buying the plane. Like mentioned above, I didn't like the extra volume that interferes with leg/knee space. (I have long legs)

While my engine was down for overhaul, I took the opportunity to replace the quadrant with linear controls...sounds easy? Not really. I bought a complete '81 salvage plane to get all of the parts (and many others). Everything between the panel and the floor had to be removed from both planes for the transplant since it is all different. Center console, nose wheel well (2 pieces), fresh air ventilation system, flap and trim indicators and cables (run thru the floor and aft), etc. The cutout for the nose wheel is also bigger on the 77, so I had to make a doubler to close the opening a bit to fit the newer wheel well. I'm sure I had well over 100 hours of work in that project, but it was worth it to me. I wouldn't have paid someone to do it, though.

You should at least sit in both configurations and see how much it bothers you. I overlooked it to get an otherwise great plane, and am glad I did, even if I didn't change it.

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[Yetti]

Quadrant I like it.  But I have big paws so I can manipulate all three at once

[Marauder]

The main challenge with the quadrant is the fine tuning of settings. A vernier system makes that much easier. I like my quadrant.



Especially the extra control on the throttle.




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[Vance Harral]

We have a '76 F with the quadrant.  I was indifferent when we bought the airplane, have no complaints about it 12 years later.  I agree it's easier to make fine prop and mixture adjustments with a vernier, and that might be particularly helpful in a turbocharged airplane prone to "bootstrapping" behavior.  On the other hand, go-arounds are simpler with the quadrant, and I've grown to like it in our normally-aspirated airplane.

For what it's worth, I don't have any particular trouble adjusting the prop within 50 RPM or fuel flow within 0.1 gph.  I rest the heel of my hand on the quadrant frame, and ever so slightly nudge the control, then wait (the patience requirement is the same regardless of vernier or quadrant).  I won't say it's as easy as fine control with a vernier, but it's not particularly difficult, either.  Fine adjustments are only needed in low-stress situations anyway, almost always after you level out in cruise.

[gsengle]

I don't see a downside to vernier like thinking a quadrant is faster for go around... you can shove a vernier forward too, twist is just for fine tuning...


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[TTaylor]

+1 for the quadrant.  No real difference from the vernier, just different.  I like being able to adjust all three knobs with one hand at the same time. Fine tuning is a little more difficult but I have never found it hard to get the settings I want.  Unless you are really worried about the space I would not use this as a reason to not consider a plane.

[Ron McBride]

12 minutes ago, TTaylor said:

+1 for the quadrant.  No real difference from the vernier, just different.  I like being able to adjust all three knobs with one hand at the same time. Fine tuning is a little more difficult but I have never found it hard to get the settings I want.  Unless you are really worried about the space I would not use this as a reason to not consider a plane.

I have the quadrant also.  they are not all the same.  Mine has the flap switch next to the mixture control.   One hand on the quadrant and I can move all 4 controls, including the flaps with out my hand moving at all.  I do not like a veneer on the throttle, it is difficult for small power changes on final.

Ron

[jetdriven]

2 hours ago, TTaylor said:

+1 for the quadrant.  No real difference from the vernier, just different.  I like being able to adjust all three knobs with one hand at the same time. Fine tuning is a little more difficult but I have never found it hard to get the settings I want.  Unless you are really worried about the space I would not use this as a reason to not consider a plane.

I haven't found mixture adjustment any less precise with the quadrant than with the vernier knob. Just get it close then place your wrist on the quadrant and move the lever back a very small amount a few times to get it right. Going around is easy too, just shove all the levers forward. 

[TWinter]

This topic has been tossed around a few times, but after my PPL I swapped to a Warrior (quadrant). I really like the way the Warrior flew way back then and got to where I preferred the quadrant. I've never thought of the point of view that a vernier takes up less space when climbing in and out of the pilot's side, but I guess in theory they have a point. The quad panel takes a little more room, but still my preference. Just a little disappointed mine did not come with "Guns" option.

 

-Tom

[Hank]

1 hour ago, N803RM said:

I have the quadrant also.  they are not all the same.  Mine has the flap switch next to the mixture control.   One hand on the quadrant and I can move all 4 controls, including the flaps with out my hand moving at all. 

Yep, that's me. I enjoy the quadrant, and often hold throttle to idle, extend a finger and raise the flaps on rollout.

With my fully-resurrected dog house and carb heat boxes, my C will now run 15-25º LOP, and I don't find it difficult to move the red lever to get there.

[bonal]

Admittedly I haven't flown a Mooney with a quadrant but really like my simple controls throttle has no veneer so very simple for power changes mixture veneer  is very sensitive but push the button and make big adjustment quickly. I also have the big old style prop control which works very well. For me the big advantage of the panel mounted controls is it takes less space 

[rbridges]

I have a friend with a cherokee 140.  He said he likes his because he feels like he's flying a commercial jet.  lol

[Jpflysdfw]

Wow, great input/feedback and thanks to all for sharing your perspective and experience. It sounds like I have been overly critical of something that appears to not be that big of a deal.  This is very helpful and opens the door to planes that I had wholly discounted as viable candidates. Love all the great info here on MS...thanks all!!!

Jeff

[KSMooniac]

Agree with Jim...there are so many other factors to judge planes of this vintage to let the quadrant be a deal-breaker. You can spend years searching for perfection, or spend years enjoying the one you end up buying instead! (And then try to make it perfect!)

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[Brandontwalker]

I have a quadrant an like it.  Fine tuning the mixture for LOP is not as easy as it is with a Vernier control, but that does not mean it is difficult.  Just different.  I too rest my palm on the body of the quadrant and am able to make fine adjustments that way.

[Marauder]

Besides, with a quadrant you have a huge urge to yell out, "V1, V2, ROTATE!"


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[carusoam]

Vernier knobs are really precise...

Where that precision gets used:

1) engine starts... twist the black knob to the starting position, back it out to the warm up position... verify with rpm.

2) engine warm up... set the FF by twisting the red knob slowly from 4gph to 2....

3) setting MP in the traffic pattern... 16, 14, 12....

If you accidently over change something it is easy to put it right back to where you started....

Do they make a precision style quadrant? Click, click, click....

PP thoughts,

-a-

[TTaylor]

9 hours ago, Marauder said:

The main challenge with the quadrant is the fine tuning of settings. A vernier system makes that much easier. I like my quadrant.



Especially the extra control on the throttle.




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i have always thought there is something manly about the quadrant controls.  Maybe there is some Freudian phallic representation of the throttle .

[Hank]

18 minutes ago, TTaylor said:

i have always thought there is something manly about the quadrant controls.  Maybe there is some Freudian phallic representation of the throttle .

All of us don't have that enormous pistol grip thing there . . .

I often grab the throttle by the metal,piece for small adjustments. It's just right to curl my fingers around, while resting my hand below it.

[Mooneymite]

3 hours ago, Marauder said:

Besides, with a quadrant you have a huge urge to yell out, "V1, V2, ROTATE!"

V1, Rotate, V2?

[Hank]

6 minutes ago, Mooneymite said:

V1, Rotate, V2?

You should know, Gus, as many years as you've been flying them jets.