Laser Wing Tip VOR Antenna

[jimluper]

I bought my 1975 E model 3 years ago. I normally fly GPS (Foreflight) point A to B.

The plane has all the Laser Mods including the wing tips.

The VOR works ok, but I really only use it to fly the ILS.

Finally after 3 years I was at the Avionics shop talking some upgrades and the guy point out that I don't have an VOR antenna on the tail.

The original plate has been replaced and there are no antenna holes. I scratched my head and said that seems strange because everything works.

After some research I discovered that Chief Aircraft sells a "Wing Tip" antenna for the Mooney.

Before I start taking my plane apart does anyone the Laser wing tip mod and does it include a new VOR antenna?

Thanks, Jim

[MB65E]

If it's a documented STC from Lasar, they will have all the drawings you need.

They are always great to talk to.

-Matt 

[carusoam]

Start with your logs.  Things like that are usually documented so you can read what exactly you have installed and working in your plane.

Seems like somebody may have installed some fancy fiberglass wing tips as well.  This is needed to hide the VOR antennae.

Best regards,

-a-

[N601RX]

According to Lasar's web site the can be purchased with or without the antenna.

See 107 and 107a

http://www.lasar.com/mods.asp

[carl]

3500 dollars for wing tips !!!

what has happened to this country ? 

 

[aviatoreb]

1 hour ago, carl said:

3500 dollars for wing tips !!!

what has happened to this country ? 

 

But its HIGH QUALITY plastic.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, carl said:

3500 dollars for wing tips !!!

what has happened to this country ? 

 

It goes well with $2,500 cylinders and $60,000 engine overhauls.

Clarence 

[tony]

A good rule of thumb I find is when I figure out what it should cost, then multiply by ten when its for an airplane. 

Edited January 24, 2016 by tony

[aviatoreb]

42 minutes ago, M20Doc said:

It goes well with $2,500 cylinders and $60,000 engine overhauls.

Clarence 

I was scratching my head and trying to understand the $12000 crank shaft which is part of the discussion over on the Bravo engine thread.  That is a lot of money for a hunk of metal.

[aviatoreb]

28 minutes ago, tony said:

A good rule of thumb I find is when I figure out what it should cost, then multiply by ten when its for an airplane. 

Well- a hunk of plastic might cost $25-50 so that brings me to 250-500 with the multiplying factor.  

BTW, I have a friend who operates a part 135 turbine and he says multiply by 10 for piston and multiply by 100 if it is a part for a turbine airplane.

[Guest]

I recently priced a camshaft for my IO720, just shy of $7,000US or almost $11,000CDN with taxes.  Ouch!

Clarence

[aviatoreb]

Just now, M20Doc said:

I recently priced a camshaft for my IO720, just shy of $7,000US or almost $11,000CDN with taxes.  Ouch!

Clarence

Is that for new or used?  I think they were quoting the new price for a Bravo crankshaft.

Somehow since a crankshaft has no moving parts, its just a carefully shaped and hardened hunk of metal it seems more expensive than it should be but clearly it is a very important hunk of metal.

When I think of how important the specific shape of the crankshaft is - I am amazed that they were doing that kind of work in the 1930s to almost the quality of today.

At 12,000 it almost seems so expensive that modern cnc should be able to tool one of those babies for us custom each time we need it - but what do I know?

[N601RX]

1 hour ago, M20Doc said:

I recently priced a camshaft for my IO720, just shy of $7,000US or almost $11,000CDN with taxes.  Ouch!

Clarence

There is a new IO 720 bendix Mag on eBay. I believe they said it was around $12k us if purchased new. 

[aviatoreb]

Great thread drift - VOR tips for Mooneys and now we are shopping for mags for the IO720 for a commanche 400.   

[kortopates]

I believe Mooney started offering wing tip VOR antenna's at some point. My 252 has them as original equipment. Since then they have been available as a retrofit into the plastic wing tips. The antenna's are very expensive to buy and pretty labor intensive if you were going to install after the wing tips were already on.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Piloto]

I prefer vertical fin antennas for NAV/ILS. For optimum reception the antenna needs to horizontal polarized facing forward. This reduces multipath effects and random erratic deviation indications. On my M20J I have the vertical fin towel bars antenna connected to a signal splitter for VOR/LOC and GS. This eliminated the need for the old cat whisker antenna on the windshield. Works very well with a very stable deviation indication.

José

[Guest]

4 hours ago, N601RX said:

There is a new IO 720 bendix Mag on eBay. I believe they said it was around $12k us if purchased new. 

Van Bortel in Texas is selling the same mag for $1250.00  The guy on eBay will be waiting awhile.

Clarence

[Guest]

4 hours ago, aviatoreb said:

Great thread drift - VOR tips for Mooneys and now we are shopping for mags for the IO720 for a commanche 400.   

It's better than the sword and pistol fight in another thread!

Clarence

[aviatoreb]

The lassar website is suggesting that putting your VOR antenna into the wingtips is worth a 1mph savings. So roughly a tad more than 1/2kts. Anything less than 1kts would be hard to measure the difference.  Besides the kit, very costly to install with all the wing wires to run.

In any case, I would guess the VOR system is gone within 5 years - my guesstimate.  Then we will just all remove the towel bar antenna and send them to the museums.

[Andy95W]

6 hours ago, aviatoreb said:

 I would guess the VOR system is gone within 5 years - my guesstimate.  Then we will just all remove the towel bar antenna and send them to the museums.

But then how would we shoot ILS approaches?

[cliffy]

I did the test flying on the original Mooney wingtip antennas back in the 70s.

The VSWR was good and the polar chart looked good also. They worked fine. 

[Jerry 5TJ]

How about a horizontal dipole taped to the inside of the windscreen?  The antenna can feed the splitter for LOC/ILS use.  No added drag, little trouble routing coax, low cost.  Too bad it isn't approved.

 

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/avpages/antennasystems.php

 

 

[Bennett]

I did the test flying on the original Mooney wingtip antennas back in the 70s.

The VSWR was good and the polar chart looked good also. They worked fine. 

I had my blade VOR antennas moved into my wingtips on my 261, and I couldn't tell any difference in performance. From conversations (private, non official) with a FAA manager working on the elimination of the VOR system, I decided to leave my "towel bar" antennas on my J on the basis that it would be far less expensive to remove the towel bars than buying new antennas for the wingtips and having them installed.

[Piloto]

The Mooney Acclaim has the NAV antenna on the tail like the airliners:

https://www.google.com/search?q=Nose+ILS+antenna&rlz=1C1CHFX_enUS593US593&espv=2&biw=1024&bih=478&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjZ-ZuB1sXKAhUDzWMKHdh4DIQQ7AkIKA&dpr=1.88#imgrc=4pToJZMFWQrBvM%3A

On the airliners the LOC and G/S antennas are located in the plane nose radome. On a single engine having the antenna behind the propeller makes it susceptible to prop signal modulation on an ILS approach. Depending on the RPM and number of blades it may induce momentary indicated deviations.

José