Van Lanier Posted February 22 Report Posted February 22 Like most folks with an eye on the money, I'm looking to find out the base price of an annual inspection for a M20C in the Mid-Atlantic area. I've owned airplanes for 50 years, so I understand fixing the discrepancies. What I'm looking for is the base price to unbutton the airplane, perform the inspection and provide a written report. Many thanks for your comments. Quote
Fly Boomer Posted February 22 Report Posted February 22 5 minutes ago, Van Lanier said: Like most folks with an eye on the money, I'm looking to find out the base price of an annual inspection for a M20C in the Mid-Atlantic area. I've owned airplanes for 50 years, so I understand fixing the discrepancies. What I'm looking for is the base price to unbutton the airplane, perform the inspection and provide a written report. Many thanks for your comments. Drop it off, and come back in a couple of weeks, or stay with the airplane to help? Quote
MikeOH Posted February 22 Report Posted February 22 Rough answer: Call shop, ask hourly rate, multiply by 20. QED 1 1 Quote
markgrue Posted February 22 Report Posted February 22 I generally charge 2500. 2000 if I have done it before. Mark 3 Quote
Ragsf15e Posted February 22 Report Posted February 22 $2500-$3500 in my experience. There are large differences in what different IAs decide to inspect. Obviously there are regulations and a Mooney specific guide but there’s still a lot of differences. 1 Quote
Pinecone Posted February 22 Report Posted February 22 Reports in other threads puts doing the whole Mooney checklist at upper 20s hours to mid 30s hours. Then add in researching AD compliance if it is not well laid out already. Quote
N201MKTurbo Posted February 22 Report Posted February 22 I only do my annuals and owner assist for a selected few. (I just don't have the time) It usually takes me 24-30 hours to do mine (back when I did annuals) It usually takes 8-12 hours of my time to just do the inspections with somebody else doing the grunt work. 1 Quote
Greg Ellis Posted February 22 Report Posted February 22 While not the Mid-Atlantic area, I just paid $2850 for the base annual for my 63 C model. This included the inspection as well as all the AD research, etc... Fortunately it was a pretty clean annual with only 2 squawks that needed attention. Quote
Joseph Long Posted February 22 Report Posted February 22 My 1967 M20C is currently in annual. I'll follow up in a week or two and give detailed results. I'm in Central Ohio. Quote
phxcobraz Posted February 22 Report Posted February 22 Somewhere around $2500 for my M20C the last few years. That is with me helping as much as possible. Quote
PT20J Posted February 22 Report Posted February 22 There are a few components to what we generally refer to as an annual inspection: 1. Disassembly and reassembly of inspection covers, cowlings, etc. necessary to gain access for the inspection. 2. Servicing (mostly lubrication) that isn't really part of the inspection but is done during the inspection because the airplane is opened up. 3. Checking AD status. 4. The actual inspection. 5. Repairing any discrepancies found during the inspection or requested by the owner. 6. Completing logbook entries. I try to avoid deferring maintenance until the inspection. I keep the AD list up to date so that the IA only has to review it and check it against the service he subscribes to. I do all the disassembly, reassembly and servicing. My IA charges me a flat $750 to perform the actual inspection, check the ADs and make the logbook entries. The point is that the cost is highly dependent on how you manage it. At one end of the spectrum is not deferring any maintenance and doing most of the work yourself. That's pretty inexpensive. At the other end is dropping off the plane with a squawk list. Depending on the squawks, that can take a long time and be alarmingly expensive. Keep in mind that the first annual on a new airplane is likely to find issues that didn't show up on a pre-purchase inspection. If you drop off an airplane in good shape with no squawks and don't do any work yourself, I would think the $2500 to $3500 range sounds reasonable. 3 Quote
Hank Posted February 22 Report Posted February 22 I've relocated and used several IAs; some allow owner assistance, some don't. Thise who do, if they come to your hangar and inspection panels are already off, it's a two-day jib with your minor assistance, then close up after IA leaves. Drop it off at the IAs, duration is highly variable. Using the Mooney checklist, count on 20-24 billable hours, minus any assistance that you are able and permitted to provide. Here in Sweet Home, mine are generally < 2 AMU, unless something needs repair / replacement. Quote
EricJ Posted February 22 Report Posted February 22 22 minutes ago, Hank said: I've relocated and used several IAs; some allow owner assistance, some don't. Thise who do, if they come to your hangar and inspection panels are already off, it's a two-day jib with your minor assistance, then close up after IA leaves. My first IA and I had it down about like this, too, and could do it in a day-and-a-half, but that was with both of us moving pretty constantly and no squawks. A buddy takes his Cherokee to a local shop where he shows up early, takes it apart in front of their hangar before they show up for work, they do the inspection, then he puts it back together and flies it home the same day. You need to have a good relationship with your IA/shop, but that sort of thing is definitiely doable. 1 Quote
Mooneymite Posted February 22 Report Posted February 22 About 25 years ago, when I bought my first Mooney, I knew nothing about inspections, or Mooneys. The broker promised me a fresh annual upon purchase. The morning I was supposed to pick up the plane, an IA showed up and did the "annual" before lunch. Not only did he do the annual on my plane, but he did an annual on an F model too that same morning. As far as I know, I didn't pay a thing for that annual and except for the signature in the logbook, I got exactly what I paid for...nothing. Your cost for an annual may run a bit higher. 1 3 1 Quote
Bob E Posted February 22 Report Posted February 22 Central OH base annual cost 2023: My shop is familiar with this aircraft and has done the annuals for the past decade. Quote
Van Lanier Posted February 22 Author Report Posted February 22 Goodness! Thanks, gents, for all the helpful comments and guidance. Clearly, I've been overpaying recently and these insights are most helpful. Thank you. Quote
Mooneymite Posted February 22 Report Posted February 22 26 minutes ago, Van Lanier said: Goodness! Thanks, gents, for all the helpful comments and guidance. Clearly, I've been overpaying recently and these insights are most helpful. Thank you. Based on your JYO location, you're probably just paying "market". You might have to go "out of area". Quote
FlyingDude Posted February 22 Report Posted February 22 20 hours ago, markgrue said: I generally charge 2500. 2000 if I have done it before. Mark Owner-assist or you do everything in the 100hr maintenance list? Quote
Ragsf15e Posted February 23 Report Posted February 23 5 hours ago, Van Lanier said: Goodness! Thanks, gents, for all the helpful comments and guidance. Clearly, I've been overpaying recently and these insights are most helpful. Thank you. Just remember, lots of people threw out numbers that included owner assistance for removing and reinstalling the 1000 screws that are on the inspection plates and belly. It’s a pain (I just did it). Also, that’s only the inspection, no repairs on anything. 1 Quote
AndreiC Posted February 23 Report Posted February 23 I had my annual done in November at a Mooney Service Center in the Midwest, no owner assist. It was the first annual for me, and required me to fix some squawks: replace two sets of hockey pucks (one main and the front), replace a tire, oil and filter, replace the switch that controls the flaps, replace the bushings controlling the trim in the tail, and replace the door seals on both doors. I provided all the parts except for the tail bushings, oil and filter. With all this the cost came to almost exactly 4 AMU. The originally quoted base cost for an annual with no squawks was $2500. Quote
Becca Posted February 24 Report Posted February 24 (edited) I am surprised @jetdriven has not already jumped in to reply to this. I think he's written a few posts on this on the vendor forum. The quality and thoroughness of annuals vary. But in RPM's experience, a no-repairs checklist following the Mooney Factory Checklist recommended steps takes between 30-35 hrs. If you get quoted for a flat rate that takes less time, ask your mechanics if they do the annual in reference to this checklist or if they skip any of the steps on the checklist to make the annual go faster (and if so, make sure you are ok with whatever steps do they skip). Also if offered a low flat rate, make sure to ask what is included in the flat rate (I have seen bills that add 3 hrs for an oil change on top of a "flat rate" annual, that actually happened to a girlfriend of mine on her first annual, or or other items that you might assume would be included in the annual). Assuming a $100/hr labor rate (though in the midatlantic area some of the local shops have gone up to as high as $130-140/hr labor rate!!), you're looking at $3000-3500 plus materials (oil, filter, etc.). My personal observations is that first annuals in a new relationship with a mechanic - especially a thorough mechanic - are rarely no-repairs, straight time projects. They will find deferred or unsatisfactory work from previous owners. You will have squawks. When we bought our plane, experienced airplane owners told us "just plan $10k on that stuff in the first year of ownership." And I think that tends to run true for most of my friends that have bought planes both here and back in Texas for their year 1 annual expenses, whether incurred at annual or throughout the year. One thing I've been surprised learning since Byron opened RPM is how many planes do not have AD lists. If a mechanic has to compile an AD list from scratch because they don't want to rely on the previous mechanic's statement "all AD's complied with" but did not show their work or provide any info on which AD's are applicable or how they've been complied with, that's several hours of additional time but its a one time deal, because you will have an AD list going forward. This is super baffling to me, we would've wanted an AD list at pre-buy. Not sure why this isn't a thing everyone has. Edited February 24 by Becca 3 Quote
Paul Thomas Posted February 24 Report Posted February 24 I'm shopping for an airplane and called Don Maxell's shop. I'd like to get on their schedule for a PPI; the annual inspection is 2,400. Quote
Van Lanier Posted February 24 Author Report Posted February 24 Funny enough, I just booked my next Annual with Byron at RPM Maintenance. I liked his full disclosure response to my inquiry and I respect the way he does business. I also found his pricing to be reasonable. Thank you all for the informative and helpful comments. P.S. I'm adding the 64-gallon bladder tank kit from Griggs to my '63 Model M20C so I can get to the grandkids in Florida without a fuel stop. No coffee before departure! 2 Quote
Becca Posted February 24 Report Posted February 24 2 minutes ago, Van Lanier said: Funny enough, I just booked my next Annual with Byron at RPM Maintenance. I liked his full disclosure response to my inquiry and I respect the way he does business. I also found his pricing to be reasonable. Thank you all for the informative and helpful comments. P.S. I'm adding the 64-gallon bladder tank kit from Griggs to my '63 Model M20C so I can get to the grandkids in Florida without a fuel stop. No coffee before departure! If you’re anything like Byron, no matter how much gas he has the perfect plane has 10 gallons more… 2 Quote
Ragsf15e Posted February 24 Report Posted February 24 Just now, Becca said: If you’re anything like Byron, no matter how much gas he has the perfect plane has 10 gallons more… Unless you’re on fire… 1 1 Quote
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