New STC Modifications

[Steve W]

On 4/3/2020 at 7:12 AM, LANCECASPER said:

No, they are referring to recognition lights which are basically front facing projector bulbs on later model Mooneys.

It's pretty simple. Just figure out where the virtual cuts need to be on this design, adjust the socket mounting hole location for the bulb you want to use, adjust the width of the model to properly fit the friction fit mounts in the Mooneys, print in high temp resin, reflectorize the reflector(powder coat maybe, doesn't have to be great just more or less reflective...), find a suitable LED bulb and EM/RFI/Safety test it. May only need a PMA instead of a full STC since it's designed to replace the original.

Ok, maybe it's not that simple...

[carusoam]

+1 for moving a battery back and eliminating Charlie weights...

That would take at least an hour or two of engineering and parts fabrication...

And free up a dozen pounds of UL

And improve the cg for anyone with a TopProp...

Best regards,

-a-

[LANCECASPER]

@tomgo2 Here's another possibility 

https://www.beechtalk.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=180521

[skykrawler]

How about an STC for mounting high intensity LED lights on the front of the main landing gear for improved visibility when taxing around the dark ramps at small airports.

[carusoam]

1 hour ago, skykrawler said:

How about an STC for mounting high intensity LED lights on the front of the main landing gear for improved visibility when taxing around the dark ramps at small airports.

See if the Whelen guy is taking ideas back  R&D nest... @OSUAV8TER   

Best regards,

-a-

 

[Guest]

What about an STC to install Odyssey batteries, better than Gill and cheaper than Concorde.

Clarence

[skykrawler]

13 hours ago, M20Doc said:

What about an STC to install Odyssey batteries, better than Gill and cheaper than Concorde.

Clarence

Why not Lithium Ion?   Real weight savings.

https://antigravitybatteries.com/products/starter-batteries/restart-oem/atx20-hd/

[GeeBee]

Not a fan of Li Ion batteries. Saw a bad crash caused by an overheated Lithium on a Glasair last year. There is a reason why Boeing eventually surrounded those things in a 2 inch thick titanium case machined out of a solid billet.

 

[ArtVandelay]

Why not Lithium Ion?   Real weight savings.
https://antigravitybatteries.com/products/starter-batteries/restart-oem/atx20-hd/

They would require a different voltage regulator. And not sure how they would handle starts and the high power drain.
The odyssey’s should be a easy STC, just some testing to meet aviation standards (although I think they should pay for it).
Increasing the gross weight of early Js and Fs should be easy as well, just need to perform some testing. I would think STCs that require minimal changes would be the best bang for the buck.

[cliffy]

On 4/11/2020 at 6:38 AM, skykrawler said:

How about an STC for mounting high intensity LED lights on the front of the main landing gear for improved visibility when taxing around the dark ramps at small airports.

Hmmmm-   Maybe could be a "Minor Alteration"  Might have to look into this, what do the others think?  Enough room to mount it might be the only issue.  Widest beam angle would be preferred.  Or with two, each angled slightly outboard to minimize beam overlap and maximize total lighted area. 

[Andy95W]

Cliffy, I completely agree that it would be a minor alteration.  So long as the factory installed landing light was operational, this would just be "supplemental" lighting.

I think the difficulty would be mounting them in a manner that would ensure security and positively not interfere with landing gear operation.  Other than that everything else is pretty simple AC 43-13 stuff.

[Skates97]

41 minutes ago, cliffy said:

Hmmmm-   Maybe could be a "Minor Alteration"  Might have to look into this, what do the others think?  Enough room to mount it might be the only issue.  Widest beam angle would be preferred.  Or with two, each angled slightly outboard to minimize beam overlap and maximize total lighted area. 

 

5 minutes ago, Andy95W said:

Cliffy, I completely agree that it would be a minor alteration.  So long as the factory installed landing light was operational, this would just be "supplemental" lighting.

I think the difficulty would be mounting them in a manner that would ensure security and positively not interfere with landing gear operation.  Other than that everything else is pretty simple AC 43-13 stuff.

Installing the shoulder harnesses in my plane was a "minor modification" only requiring a sign off in the logbook by an AP because it just used clamps and did not require drilling into the plane or welding brackets on. This is the justification they use, which is from a section on shoulder harneses, but I wonder if the lamps were mounted using clamps in a similar fashion to the Amsafe shoulder belts if they could fall into the "minor modification" category as well.

MINOR CHANGE STATEMENT - AC43.pdf

[Hank]

On 4/11/2020 at 8:38 AM, skykrawler said:

How about an STC for mounting high intensity LED lights on the front of the main landing gear for improved visibility when taxing around the dark ramps at small airports.

 

4 hours ago, Andy95W said:

Cliffy, I completely agree that it would be a minor alteration.  So long as the factory installed landing light was operational, this would just be "supplemental" lighting.

I think the difficulty would be mounting them in a manner that would ensure security and positively not interfere with landing gear operation.  Other than that everything else is pretty simple AC 43-13 stuff.

Hmmm . . . Lights clamped to the moving gear, with a quick-disconnect on the power line so it's not "installed." But how is the power "not installed" at the other end? To the electrical system and some free-floating / velcroed-down switch?

I like the idea. To figure out spacing, just fab a plexiglas gear door, tape it in place, jack the plane and raise the gear. Then you can see exactly how much space there is. Have an assistant do an emergency extension slowly to verify minimum clearances while moving.

I'll buy the STC at a reasonable price! If the lights themselves aren't stupid high like wingtip recognition lights . . . .

[Andy95W]

Actually, Cliffy and I are talking about legally installing it as a minor alteration, which would only require an A&P's logbook entry.  Adding lights such as these would not fall under the definition of a major alteration, since they would only be supplemental to the factory installed lighting.

The issues:

    - the lights couldn't just be some POS auto store junk.  I'd expect them to be manufactured under some sort of nationally recognized standard, and would prefer they be actual aircraft lights.  If they fried themselves inflight- right next to your fuel tanks- you couldn't just pull over and un-ass your vehicle like you would your car.

    - mounting would have to be secure and absolutely, positively, not interfere with any existing system on the airplane or have the potential for disrupting aerodynamics.  The most logical place would be the flat plate above the shock discs, and most secure would be to simply drill mounting holes into that plate.  The issues then would be determining whether that plate is structural and whether it interfered with gear retraction.  The easiest way to determine structural impact would be to ask the factory, but I'll bet they wouldn't answer the question even if you could find someone working there.

    - electrically, the installation is simple.  Give it a dedicated switch and circuit breaker, and conduct a load analysis of the electrical system, just like you would with any installed electrical equipment.  Use aircraft quality components and wiring and install it in accordance with AC43-13- just like anything else.

[Guest]

The owner of this Twin Comanche is a DAR and added these to his plane.

Clarence

[GeeBee]

I'm not a fan of anything that can jam the gear. When it comes to gear, KISS

 

[N201MKTurbo]

12 hours ago, Hank said:

 

Hmmm . . . Lights clamped to the moving gear, with a quick-disconnect on the power line so it's not "installed." But how is the power "not installed" at the other end? To the electrical system and some free-floating / velcroed-down switch?

I like the idea. To figure out spacing, just fab a plexiglas gear door, tape it in place, jack the plane and raise the gear. Then you can see exactly how much space there is. Have an assistant do an emergency extension slowly to verify minimum clearances while moving.

I'll buy the STC at a reasonable price! If the lights themselves aren't stupid high like wingtip recognition lights . . . .

Battery powered lights with a gravity sensor to turn them on when the gear is down.

[1964-M20E]

How about a retractable light in one of the big inspection covers under the wing?

[cliffy]

Retractable?   Too complex        KISS!  formula    And I believe those panels are structural

Gear lights have been done since the first days of retractable gears and electrical systems. 

Just have to figure out the correct parts to make it secure and safe.

Why reinvent the wheel? I'm going to take some time and just look at other gear lite mounts and see to adapting rather than reinventing.

There is no reason why it couldn't happen and be perfectly safe.

Edited April 15, 2020 by cliffy

[Tim Jodice]

Landing gear with some kind of damping.

Would it be possible to make a damping cartridge as wide and short stroked to replace the rubber discs? 

[N201MKTurbo]

1 hour ago, airtim said:

Landing gear with some kind of damping.

Would it be possible to make a damping cartridge as wide and short stroked to replace the rubber discs? 

Why would you want to do that? It would almost certainly be more expensive, heavier and less reliable.

[N201MKTurbo]

How about electric seats?

[cliffy]

5 minutes ago, N201MKTurbo said:

Why would you want to do that? It would almost certainly be more expensive, heavier and less reliable.

:-) :-) :-) :-) :-)    Smile!

[Tim Jodice]

22 minutes ago, N201MKTurbo said:

Why would you want to do that? It would almost certainly be more expensive, heavier and less reliable.

Two reasons,

1. Reading on here the drop test of the landing gear is what limits gross weight on some models.

2. I love my Mooney, but two airplanes I have experience with, a Bonanza and Arrow with conventional air/oil strut offer more forgiveness when landing and able to handle taxiways in poor condition better.

More expensive I don't know. At about $100 per disk plus labor Mooney landing gear isn't maintenance free either. I had to replace the seals on a nose gear on a 1955 Bonanza I had. Based on the logs it had been 32 years since it was resealed. Compared to replacing the discs on my Mooney earlier this year parts and labor were about the same. Seal kit was cheap for the Bonanza but more labor. As you know replacing the discs on a mooney is not hard provided you have the tool. But you have $300 in discs.

Definitely heavier. 

It is always possible for a regular strut to instantly blow a seal and leave you with an unairworthy airplane but I have never seen it happen. 

[Sabremech]

I had been thinking about a taxi or landing light on the gear for a while and today took a closer look. I used my LED landing light to place it around the gear and I don’t see anywhere something like it could be mounted and fit into the wheel well. Still scratching my head for an idea!