New Garmin GI275 think round G5's

[LANCECASPER]

 

gi275_autopilot_compatibility.pdf

[aviatoreb]

2 minutes ago, Bob - S50 said:

See the note at the bottom of the table.  GFC500 support expected later in 2020.

That may well position this product then as the stepping stone, gateway drug, to a full GFC500 product without needing to drop 30k in one go.

Can you, or anyone tell which extra GAD boxes they require to have the attitude and HSI talk to our autopilots.  (KFC200 in my place).  So cost beyond the $8.3 for head units.

Also, how plug and play are these?  How easy did they make the install routine to keep cost down?  If they were very very clever they would have found a way to make it almost like R&R a KI256.

[Marauder]

I think that would be a misuse of these little units.  I would more likely buy 2 if I were did this.  One for the KI256 and one for the HSI.  $8300 plus GADs?  What GADs does it need?

Probably a GAD 43e which was their solution for legacy analog support on the G500.

What I can’t tell from the pictures (and I am too lazy to do my usual deep dive), is whether or not the GI 275 will be a full interface or just the steering input for the AP. In other words, the GI 275 could feed heading and other inputs into the GAD to convert to the analog input requirements of the AP but doesn’t replace the control heads for the legacy APs. You may still need to select VSI, altitude pre-select and other parameters from the existing AP’s control head.

Now... if they built in capability, like adding constant airspeed climbs and altitude pre-select for my STEC 60-2, I may be tempted to look at it...




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[aviatoreb]

7 minutes ago, Marauder said:

 

Probably a GAD 43e which was their solution for legacy analog support on the G500.

What I can’t tell from the pictures (and I am too lazy to do my usual deep dive), is whether or not the GI 275 will be a full interface or just the steering input for the AP. In other words, the GI 275 could feed heading and other inputs into the GAD to convert to the analog input requirements of the AP but doesn’t replace the control heads for the legacy APs. You may still need to select VSI, altitude pre-select and other parameters from the existing AP’s control head.

Now... if they built in capability, like adding constant airspeed climbs and altitude pre-select for my STEC 60-2, I may be tempted to look at it...




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I bet it does need the  GAD 43e. - a hidden $2300 cost.  But if they were very very clever, they built that function straight into the GI275.  If they did that, and also made these little GI275 units close to plug and play install, then they will fly off the shelf to people like...me.  I might get one or two at annual in May depending on what is actually involved.  

..while my HSI and KI256 still have some residual trade in value which is surely dropping and going to drop even faster like a stone as these kind of solutions become more and more available.  How much we figure my old Swiss watches are worth in trade in?

[LANCECASPER]

34 minutes ago, aviatoreb said:

I bet it does need the  GAD 43e. - a hidden $2300 cost.  But if they were very very clever, they built that function straight into the GI275.  If they did that, and also made these little GI275 units close to plug and play install, then they will fly off the shelf to people like...me.  I might get one or two at annual in May depending on what is actually involved.  

..while my HSI and KI256 still have some residual trade in value which is surely dropping and going to drop even faster like a stone as these kind of solutions become more and more available.  How much we figure my old Swiss watches are worth in trade in?

Probably next to zero on trade, but outright you can get maybe $500 each.

[gsengle]

I bet it does need the  GAD 43e. - a hidden $2300 cost.  But if they were very very clever, they built that function straight into the GI275.  If they did that, and also made these little GI275 units close to plug and play install, then they will fly off the shelf to people like...me.  I might get one or two at annual in May depending on what is actually involved.  
..while my HSI and KI256 still have some residual trade in value which is surely dropping and going to drop even faster like a stone as these kind of solutions become more and more available.  How much we figure my old Swiss watches are worth in trade in?

Plane and pilot says at 4995 it includes the autopilot adapter...


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[aviatoreb]

1 minute ago, gsengle said:

 

Plane and pilot says at 4995 it includes the autopilot adapter...


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Then there is the question is that a separate box or built in.  I bet it means it is built in and you are unlocking an option.  This is an important distinction because it will surely impact install cost whether it is closer to plug and play, or closer to a panel tear down.

[aviatoreb]

6 minutes ago, LANCECASPER said:

Probably next to zero on trade, but outright you can get maybe $500 each.

Right - my guess too - I just looked over at ebay.  I would be reticent to sell a gyro instrument on ebay since these things are delicate and don't always survive shipment even if packed carefully....as happened to me once in overhaul.  I wouldn't want to be responsible for packing a good KI256 to have it arrive broken and then have to refund and receive back a broken KI256, yadayada....

[gsengle]

Then there is the question is that a separate box or built in.  I bet it means it is built in and you are unlocking an option.  This is an important distinction because it will surely impact install cost whether it is closer to plug and play, or closer to a panel tear down.

It sure may kill off the King option.... now if either my HSI or flight director go, the choice is easy.


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[Bob - S50]

1 hour ago, aviatoreb said:

That may well position this product then as the stepping stone, gateway drug, to a full GFC500 product without needing to drop 30k in one go.

Can you, or anyone tell which extra GAD boxes they require to have the attitude and HSI talk to our autopilots.  (KFC200 in my place).  So cost beyond the $8.3 for head units.

Also, how plug and play are these?  How easy did they make the install routine to keep cost down?  If they were very very clever they would have found a way to make it almost like R&R a KI256.

If I remember right (but I'm old) the GAD is built into the box.

[Bob - S50]

We already have dual G5/GFC500.  What might interest me is using it as an MFD to replace the CDI for our KNS80 (maybe).  Their site says the unit is compatible with the KX155/165/170 series of navigators.  If it will also support the KNS80 I could see replacing our CDI with this thing.

Enroute I could use it to display traffic or weather.  If I needed to use the KNS80 for navigation or an ILS, I could use it as a CDI.  Once on the ground I could use it as a moving map of the airport diagram.

[gsengle]

If I remember right (but I'm old) the GAD is built into the box.

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[aviatoreb]

Just now, gsengle said:

 

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I interpret that to mean, its all physically and softwarewise built in but they are using the aviation industry standard concept that you pay extra to get access to features that are otherwise locked out by software.

[carusoam]

Thousands of pilots world wide...

Woke up this morning... (some were still awake last night...)

With a giant research project on their hands...

1) What are all these things...

2) which ones work for my ship...

3) What else is needed...

4) Where does my G5 fit with these awesome new devices..?
 

5) Is this real? It’s not due out in the third Q of some undefined year?

 

Wow..!

Happy Three Kings Day... (reference to the three wisemen that showed up later, in January)

 

Remember to keep your eyes out the window.  No staring at the new baubles... 

Best regards,

-a-

 

 

[gsxrpilot]

1 minute ago, carusoam said:

4) Where does my G5 fit with these awesome new devices..?

Probably in the bin.

[LANCECASPER]

Seems like just yesterday people were lined up at avionics shops to have single or dual G5 units installed . . . . Hang on . . .  That was yesterday.

[elimansour]

Do I read the autopilot interface list correctly in that it does not support GPSS or simulated GPSS for the KFC150 which a lot of us have?  That would seem like material shortcoming...

[Steve W]

15 minutes ago, elimansour said:

Do I read the autopilot interface list correctly in that it does not support GPSS or simulated GPSS for the KFC150 which a lot of us have?  That would seem like material shortcoming...

My guess is that's a chart error as the KAP-150 is exactly the same just without a flight director.

Edited January 15, 2020 by Steve W

[Bob - S50]

35 minutes ago, gsxrpilot said:

Probably in the bin.

I'm thinking you meant that to be in green but just in case...

I don't think so.  A G5 ADI/HSI with GPS GAD29 and GMU11 costs just a bit over $5000.

To buy two GI275's to act as an ADI and HSI would cost a bit over $8000 and you probably also need the GMU11 and maybe a GAD29 (but I don't know).  That makes it about $3000 - $4000 more.  If you plan on getting the GFC500 and can wait until the GI275 is approved for use with that, there are only a few things extra that you get:

Primary airspeed and altitude.

Airspeed bug.

Enhanced HSI (moving map)

Where the GI275 makes the most sense is if you have an old attitude based autopilot, the servos are all still good, but the ADI quits.  You can then slap this think in and keep flying with your current autopilot.  Once a servo quits, you could then change to a GFC autopilot or TT if you wanted.  It provides a way to spread out the cost of moving to a better/lower maintenance cost autopilot.

[Yetti]

Oh Look Garmin caught up to the Dynon D10A unit that already drives the A/P servos as part of the delivered feature set.   

Edited January 15, 2020 by Yetti

[Marauder]

3 hours ago, aviatoreb said:

..while my HSI and KI256 still have some residual trade in value which is surely dropping and going to drop even faster like a stone as these kind of solutions become more and more available.  How much we figure my old Swiss watches are worth in trade in?

I agree with Lance. As people begin upgrading to GFC 500s and the GI 275, the value will continue to drop as more and more become available.

[aviatoreb]

4 minutes ago, Marauder said:

I agree with Lance. As people begin upgrading to GFC 500s and the GI 275, the value will continue to drop as more and more become available.

I agree too - so the nature of my question was the thought is there may well still be some residual value in our mechanical gyro instruments but it will be dropping.

That said, it is a legit position for someone to say, hey I have an old (say KFC200) autopilot and I can keep it running with all the cheap seconds people are now dumping on the market.

Edited January 15, 2020 by aviatoreb

[ZuluZulu]

12 hours ago, Aerodon said:

I don't think you will be so lucky - its just a display, needs to be fed the information from the other boxes.

 

Aerodon

Assuming one already has an ADS-B transponder and a WAAS navigator, what else would they need for this to work?

[aviatoreb]

45 minutes ago, Yetti said:

Oh Look Garmin caught up to the Dynon D10A unit that already drives the A/P servos as part of the delivered feature set.   

I was not aware - will a D10A drive a KFC200?

[Marauder]

1 hour ago, LANCECASPER said:

Seems like just yesterday people were lined up at avionics shops to have single or dual G5 units installed . . . . Hang on . . .  That was yesterday.

I wonder how long or if Garmin will drop the G5 line. I'm sure there is a product marketing plan that includes target market segments for each products. The majority of the Cessna & Piper fleet will probably be happy with a G5. But, if the upgrade bug is present and these planes produced historically without APs become equipped, the GI 275 will probably take the lion share of that addressable market. Kind of reminds me when Garmin was a big player in auto GPS units. They had all kinds of flavors. How long before the market gets saturation with selections? 

I look at the GI 275 as pure play at the Aspen market where the Aspen retrofits worked with the legacy autopilots and didn't require a major panel mod like the G3X does.