Finding the right M20J

[BushPilot]

My name is Nathan. I am a corporate pilot in MN and im looking for my first airplane. I am new to this forum and new to airplane buying. However this forum has been one of the best resources I have found while hunting for a plane. I am hoping to utilize the mooneyspace network to find the perfect M20J. I did donate and hope to post a wanted ad in the classifieds soon. Before we go any further thank you for reading this far 

The "Needs"

• 1978 or newer
• no corrosion
• Recently overhauled engine/ Midtime engine flown frequently/ Run out engine (priced accordingly)
• IFR certification
• 430w
• 4 place intercom
• no fuel leaks
• complete logs
• >900lb useful load
• all ADs and especially SB208 complied with
• autopilot with alt hold
• hangared most of its life

The Wants

• 1982 or newer
• NDH
• A3B6 
• new prop: scimitar or top prop
• fuel bladders 
• 530w Or GTN 650/750
• stec autopilot 
• gpss
• graphic engine monitor
• adsb
• garmin G5 or aspen PFD/HSI
• intercom w/music
• >1000lb useful load

I unfortunately just had a deal fall through. But...The good news is that all assets are lined up, insurance is approved, hangar is waiting, and my wife is on board. But even more importantly than that!!! I now can have you all help me find the perfect plane! 

How much is this guy willing to spend!?!? 

Did you see his wants list!?!? Holy S**t!!! 

Budget is accomodating (not unlimited)

Anyone who read this far deserves a drink... or at least a sincere thank you. 

 

If you know anyone that is looking to sell their J and it meets the above Needs list please let me know! Lets skip the brokers and BS and transfer a nice Mooney from one discerning owner to the next! (me )

It will be hangared loved and have the crap flown out of it.

Cheers and thanks to everyone who read this.

-Nathan (future Mooney owner)

[Niko182]

https://www.controller.com/listings/aircraft/for-sale/24531875/1978-mooney-m20j-201

Partly glass panel
1000lbs useful load.
no leaks
1000 hours left on the engine (this is a 2 bit answer, this result can vary alot)
full logs
ADSB
A3B6 Engine
I dont have any relation with the seller. 

seems like what you're looking for.

[ArtVandelay]

NDH? I searched and see it mention but no explanation of the acronym.

 

[Niko182]

Just now, teejayevans said:

NDH?

No damage history

[BushPilot]

4 hours ago, Niko182 said:

https://www.controller.com/listings/aircraft/for-sale/24531875/1978-mooney-m20j-201

Partly glass panel
1000lbs useful load.
no leaks
1000 hours left on the engine (this is a 2 bit answer, this result can vary alot)
full logs
ADSB
A3B6 Engine
I dont have any relation with the seller. 

seems like what you're looking for.

Another person on MooneySpace already looked at this plane and found sketchy logs and a few other things Unfortunately... 

[gsxrpilot]

Have you looked at this one? It might be out of the budget as asking is right at the top of the J range. I know it's with a broker, but AllAmerican is a good broker to deal with. Many of us on here have bought planes from Jimmy & David and very happy with the process and outcome.

https://www.controller.com/listings/aircraft/for-sale/27414473/1993-mooney-m20j-mse?dlr=1&pcid=17527&crmid=614667&if=1

 

[jaylw314]

So I hesitate to say this, but I am considering selling my M20J, with the idea of moving up to something that has FIKI.  I will be honest in saying I haven't really put together any concrete plans yet, so if I did sell, it might not be for several months yet (if at all).  I hate to sound so wishy washy, but give me a PM if you're interested. 

[BushPilot]

2 hours ago, gsxrpilot said:

Have you looked at this one? It might be out of the budget as asking is right at the top of the J range. I know it's with a broker, but AllAmerican is a good broker to deal with. Many of us on here have bought planes from Jimmy & David and very happy with the process and outcome.

https://www.controller.com/listings/aircraft/for-sale/27414473/1993-mooney-m20j-mse?dlr=1&pcid=17527&crmid=614667&if=1

 

It’s nice but exceeds my budget and short on my wants list. I did call and am on their list now. Thanks for the recommendation!

[gsxrpilot]

One thing I did when searching for both of my Mooneys, was to sort my Needs and Wants lists in some sort of order of importance. It's virtually impossible to get everything on even your Needs list. My goal was to find the plane within my budget that got me as far down the Needs list as possible.

For example I had both and autopilot with altitude hold and an engine monitor on my needs list. But I also knew that failing both of those, the autopilot is a $20K+ job while the engine monitor is closer to $5K. So getting the "perfect in every way except engine monitor plane" could be easily mitigated with a little negotiation. While the same but without the autopilot was probably a deal breaker.

Just a thought... as the supply of these airplanes continue to decrease, finding the perfect one gets more and more difficult. You might have to get as close to perfect as possible, and then spend some time, effort and $$ to get it the last bit of the way to perfect.

[BushPilot]

Sounds reasonable to me 

[Bartman]

I would not refuse a Mooney with damage history so long as it was repaired properly. Lots of really good airframes out there with gear up and not a long term issue if repaired properly. Mine had damage in the 1990s, was repaired properly, has been thru 25 or more annual inspections plus all of the other maintenance and I've had no significant issues in over 10 years of ownership. In my search I had no corrosion at the top of the list like you, and everything else was negotiable.  I got a good one and after just changing oil and putiing gas in for a long time I am now working on upgrades as well as preventive and scheduled maintenance.

Hope you get a good one !!!

[gsxrpilot]

I agree with @Bartman on the damage history. I've owned two Mooneys and each had 3 gear-up's prior to my acquisition of the plane. In my opinion a requirement of NDH will severely restrict the available pool to chose from and most of them in that pool will be hangar queens. Which is a much worse condition... IMHO.

[BushPilot]

4 hours ago, Bartman said:

I would not refuse a Mooney with damage history so long as it was repaired properly. Lots of really good airframes out there with gear up and not a long term issue if repaired properly. Mine had damage in the 1990s, was repaired properly, has been thru 25 or more annual inspections plus all of the other maintenance and I've had no significant issues in over 10 years of ownership. In my search I had no corrosion at the top of the list like you, and everything else was negotiable.  I got a good one and after just changing oil and putiing gas in for a long time I am now working on upgrades as well as preventive and scheduled maintenance.

Hope you get a good one !!!

I am going to agree with you on this. It will be moved to the wants column. Thanks for the input! 

[Oldguy]

One thing I might suggest is to consider a late model F with many of the J speed enhancements. You might look up M20F-1968 on here and see what his looks like.

[nbush]

19 minutes ago, Oldguy said:

One thing I might suggest is to consider a late model F with many of the J speed enhancements. You might look up M20F-1968 on here and see what his looks like.

I have looked at F models some. If i could find one like that i would definitely be interested! Thanks for the suggestion! 

[BushPilot]

Apparently I made a different account and was still logged in to that on this computer. 

[Hank]

2 hours ago, BushPilot said:

. . . . and was still logged in to that on this computer. 

You mean that we can log out????

[Raptor05121]

I might also remove the "wants: IO-390" from that list. The cylinders are godawful expensive compared to the IO-360 and has a very restrictive prop combination. Any sort of MX on either of the engine/prop will easily be a exponential increase versus a regular IO-360. Also, I do believe the 390 is limited to 210hp for 5 minutes and then has to be brought back. And this is an old wives tale, but I've also heard the "high performance" STC means insurance can be higher. I don't have any confirmation on that last bit.

tl;dr- the IO-390 is a big negative for someone like myself. It raises costs exponentially with little to no performance gained.

[BushPilot]

8 minutes ago, Raptor05121 said:

I might also remove the "wants: IO-390" from that list. The cylinders are godawful expensive compared to the IO-360 and has a very restrictive prop combination. Any sort of MX on either of the engine/prop will easily be a exponential increase versus a regular IO-360. Also, I do believe the 390 is limited to 210hp for 5 minutes and then has to be brought back. And this is an old wives tale, but I've also heard the "high performance" STC means insurance can be higher. I don't have any confirmation on that last bit.

tl;dr- the IO-390 is a big negative for someone like myself. It raises costs exponentially with little to no performance gained.

And the learning continues!!! Thank you!

[Hank]

16 minutes ago, Raptor05121 said:

I might also remove the "wants: IO-390" from that list. The cylinders are godawful expensive compared to the IO-360 and has a very restrictive prop combination. Any sort of MX on either of the engine/prop will easily be a exponential increase versus a regular IO-360. Also, I do believe the 390 is limited to 210hp for 5 minutes and then has to be brought back. And this is an old wives tale, but I've also heard the "high performance" STC means insurance can be higher. I don't have any confirmation on that last bit.

tl;dr- the IO-390 is a big negative for someone like myself. It raises costs exponentially with little to no performance gained.

Seems like someone here got the IO-390 during overhaul when they first came out. His writeup and performance were uninspiring. Wonder if the Search box will find it? It was definitely one website upgrade ago, if not two.

[Bartman]

4 hours ago, Raptor05121 said:

the IO-390 is a big negative for someone like myself. It raises costs exponentially with little to no performance gained.

Everything else being equal I would not choose a 390 over a 360, but I would take a roller tappet IO-360 over a legacy engine. 

[Niko182]

I have to say given the engine choice on a J, id have to take the io550. Something about a 185 knot cruise speed sounds nice.

[jaylw314]

3 minutes ago, Bartman said:

Everything else being equal I would not choose a 390 over a 360, but I would take a roller tappet IO-360 over a legacy engine. 

Just look for an engine serial number that ends with "E", that is Lycoming's designation for the roller tappet engines.  The only exception might be a field overhaul that replaced the crankcase and installed new roller tappets, but it seems like nobody has ever heard of that being done