Anybody doing their own annuals? (With an IA)

[DaV8or]

I plan to do my own annual in my hangar this year and I think I have all the tools and stuff I need except the tool for checking the gear preload. I have assisted three times before, so I have an idea about all the stuff to do and I'll be using the LASAR check list. Just wondering if there are any special tools I'm forgetting or any sequence, or oh, I don't know, just advice. My IA has done annuals on Mooneys before, but he's hardly a Mooney expert. May ask questions here as goes, but I think it should be pretty straight forward.

[carusoam]

Plan on taking a few pictures to go with the posts...

David the cowl guy has machined the gear tools as well...

Best regards,

-a-

[RLCarter]

Do you have the Service and Parts Manuals? PM me if you need them, I have them in PDF files and can email them to you. FAA has your "F" as 1966, serial number has it as a 1967. Gear tools will be needed to set the pre-load (it's an AD), have fun and learn about you plane, 

[carusoam]

Dave's S/N is a fun sort of unique one in the Mooney timeline...

Best regards,

-a-

[triple8s]

Just curious why you wouldn't use the Mooney list for performing an Annual Inspection?

[MB65E]

Have Saber Dave make you a tool set for the gear. Get a nice game plan going with your IA. Brief eachother daily. Set some goals. Look at mag times and replacment items ahead of time. Look at accessories, exhaust, and other consumables that take time to repair or replace first. ELT battery dates, etc. The inspection itself doesn't take long. Waiting for the darn ELT battery when it didn't ship like they said it would is a waist of time. Agree on a rate upfront. Makes it easier in the long run if the guy is like me. Can't think of anything really mooney service item spicific other than the gear tools. Expect it to take longer than you think and you'll be happy.

I had 49 hrs in my last owner assisted annual. Let's just say The owner received an education! Lol.

-Matt

 

[Hank]

I,always do owner assist, but have never tracked the hours. This year was at my hangar over a 3-day weekend, much nicer than my previous three weekers! Hope next year is as smooth.

[Jerry 5TJ]

I did owner-assisted annuals on my E and C perhaps a dozen times in 16 years.  That generally meant the IA would inspect and do the mag timing and compression test.  I'd do everything else working mostly alone in my hangar and under his loose supervision.  Usually 2-3 weeks elapsed from start to finish and taking 40-60 hours of my time.   That interval including ordering parts - there's always something found - and delays to do irritating stuff like my day job. 

This year I did an owner-assisted annual on the R where I worked in parallel with the mechanics & under their direct supervision. Flew in to KSFQ and stayed in a local hotel.  I put in about 25 hours over 4 days and the A&P and IA (2 men) at McClellan Aviation worked about 35 hours.  I test flew it and then flew home the fourth afternoon.   

Good learning experience for me, I think we did a thorough job, we repaired a few "finds" and at 4 days it was refreshingly quick. 

I also learned that there are about 800 fewer screws to remove and replace when inspecting an Ovation compared to the C.  

 

 

[RobertGary1]

I've done my own work for at least the last ten annuals as well. Like others said the trick is to be prepared. I try to fix issues during the year so the annual is just an annual. You'll learn to order all your disposables before you start (cotter pins, seals, etc). Some IAs will want to personally see things like bearings, some will want pictures or want you to leave them setting out after you've cleaned them so they can inspect them. Defiantly try to know of anything that needs to be repaired so you have the parts ready. You'll slowly build up a set a tools, lubricants, and disposables. The IAs that let you work mostly on your own usually don't expect to have to loan you these things. It probably shows your ability when you know what to have. Go through the Sevice Manual in detail. Not only does it list the inspection and lubrication points but it lists all the lubes you'll need.  

Oh, and order a set of Mooney Jack points   

 

-Robert

[Sabremech]

I have plenty of stock on gear preload tool sets. Price is $245 plus shipping for a set.

David

[StevenL757]

I just completed my 5th owner-assisted annual with Brian Kendrick.  Each successive year, I've demonstrated the ability to do more of the work to Brian's comfort level, and have learned so much about my ship through the processes.  Anyone who hasn't done one should really find a Mooney-savvy mechanic who will allow this.  Emphasis on Mooney-Savvy.  I'm a firm believer that this makes the difference between a good annual and a great one.

Whether I fly to Texas, or I bring Brian up to NY, I know the ship is in the best hands possible...and I sleep well at night with that peace-of-mind.  Happy to share details offline (or online) for those interested.

Steve

[Jerry 5TJ]

48 minutes ago, RobertGary1 said:

Oh, and order a set of Mooney Jack points   

 

...and if you have a long body Mooney, get a nose jack point as well. 

[StevenL757]

Just now, Jerry 5TJ said:

...and if you have a long body Mooney, get a nose jack point as well. 

Ditto.

[mooniac15u]

7 minutes ago, StevenL757 said:

I just completed my 5th owner-assisted annual with Brian Kendrick.  Each successive year, I've demonstrated the ability to do more of the work to Brian's comfort level, and have learned so much about my ship through the processes.  Anyone who hasn't done one should really find a Mooney-savvy mechanic who will allow this.  Emphasis on Mooney-Savvy.  I'm a firm believer that this makes the difference between a good annual and a great one.

Whether I fly to Texas, or I bring Brian up to NY, I know the ship is in the best hands possible...and I sleep well at night with that peace-of-mind.  Happy to share details offline (or online) for those interested.

Steve

Owner-assisted annuals work for some and not for others. If you enjoy doing that, great. Others prefer to have professionals maintain their aircraft and that's ok too. 

[OR75]

3 hours ago, StevenL757 said:

Ditto.

or a few washers and 2 correct bolts

[Yetti]

Downloaded the Mooney 100 hour inspection then converted to Word.  Prefilled it out the May work we did.  That saved time.   Looking at the FAA AD List and having one in the books will save an evening of research.

I cleaned and gapped the spark plugs last oil change.  Will probably put new motor mounts on this year.

 

[StevenL757]

4 hours ago, mooniac15u said:

Owner-assisted annuals work for some and not for others. If you enjoy doing that, great. Others prefer to have professionals maintain their aircraft and that's ok too. 

Certainly agree with the first part, but if an IA were still maintaining oversight of the entire process, wouldn't a "professional" still be maintaining the aircraft?  I'm failing to see where any large or small level of involvement by a non-A&P owner under the watchful eye of an IA would be considered a situation where a professional wouldn't be maintaining the aircraft.  Did I misunderstand?

[mooniac15u]

15 minutes ago, StevenL757 said:

Certainly agree with the first part, but if an IA were still maintaining oversight of the entire process, wouldn't a "professional" still be maintaining the aircraft?  I'm failing to see where any large or small level of involvement by a non-A&P owner under the watchful eye of an IA would be considered a situation where a professional wouldn't be maintaining the aircraft.  Did I misunderstand?

There may be a wide range of work quality that could be deemed airworthy. If your skill level supports the level of quality you want on your plane that's great. Some may feel that hiring a skilled individual to do the work results in a better end result. 

Have you seen the doghouse work that @M20Doc accomplished? That is well beyond the skill level of most owners. 

 

[mooniac15u]

For me, personally, the issue is time. I don't want to spend my free time removing panels and applying grease. That seems to be the biggest component of owner work. 

[StevenL757]

1 hour ago, mooniac15u said:

There may be a wide range of work quality that could be deemed airworthy. If your skill level supports the level of quality you want on your plane that's great. Some may feel that hiring a skilled individual to do the work results in a better end result. 

Have you seen the doghouse work that @M20Doc accomplished? That is well beyond the skill level of most owners. 

 

Good points.  I think those of us who are as critical (or more so) of our own work as we would be the A&P's work would tend to produce stellar results, which is, as you say, still only one level of airworthiness.

I'll have a read through M20Doc's post on that work...I recall seeing it, but admit I didn't read through it.

Steve

[geoffb]

I've always done my own with very experienced IAs.  I want to take it apart, fix what's needed and put the plane together since I'm the guy that has to fly through the air in it.  I also want a fresh set of knowledgeable, experienced eyes to do the complete, independent inspection after I've already looked at it.  While a agree that disassembling and reassembling the plane isn't a huge value-add use of my time, knowing it was done right because I did it is piece of mind to me.  Nothing irritates me more that paying someone 80 or 90 dollars and hour to make a mess of something and having to do it again anyway.

If you've got jacks, gear tools, a compression tester and some basic hand tools, you've got all you need.

[Yetti]

There are various levels of precision

[Hank]

57 minutes ago, geoffb said:

I've always done my own with very experienced IAs.  I want to take it apart, fix what's needed and put the plane together since I'm the guy that has to fly through the air in it.  I also want a fresh set of knowledgeable, experienced eyes to do the complete, independent inspection after I've already looked at it.  While a agree that disassembling and reassembling the plane isn't a huge value-add use of my time, knowing it was done right because I did it is piece of mind to me.  Nothing irritates me more that paying someone 80 or 90 dollars and hour to make a mess of something and having to do it again anyway.

I prefer to help out and keep an eye on the condition of everything. I usually clean,gap and test the plugs, grease & lubricate everything in addition to removing/installing all of the panels. Except for the one yahoo after I moved, who decided to put my belly on after I told him not to, and use his power driver to cross thread half of the belly screws, and ran in the spinner screws so tight that I almost couldn't get some of them loose. Just to be sure, I replaced all spinner screws (thankfully he didn't lose the Teflon washers I had put on them!) and all of the belly screws that were tight or that his driver had rounded off the Philips slot in . . .

Each year with the same IA, as we develop a relationship, I get to do more of the work. He has to trust me, and the mire he sees me do right, the more he lets me do. I like to know that everything is shipshape, and seeing it all does that for me. If something is beginning to wear or move or go bad, it's something that I can keep a. Eye in between annuals, or decide to replace right then.

But I think saying that my plane has been poorly maintained by a non-professional is a slap in my face, and the IA's face.

          --Hank Sims, BSME, MSE

[mooniac15u]

Just now, Hank said:

 

But I think saying that my plane has been poorly maintained by a non-professional is a slap in my face, and the IA's face.

          --Hank Sims, BSME, MSE

Please show me where anyone said that or even implied that. 

[Hank]

8 hours ago, mooniac15u said:

Owner-assisted annuals work for some and not for others. If you enjoy doing that, great. Others prefer to have professionals maintain their aircraft and that's ok too. 

Here you go. This is the entire post. I'd tell you which one it is above, but the Post Numbers disappeared in the last upgrade. This is rather strongly implying that "owner assist" and "professionally maintained" are discrete choices. Hey, look, I just noticed that was your post . . .

My IA is an aircraft maintenance professional, and I am a maintenance & repair professional since 1989, just not on airplanes. I also have two Engineering degrees, know which end of a wrench to hold, how to use an Allen wrench with one hand, and how to set a torque wrench.

Edited August 16, 2016 by Hank