Ferry pilot needed from Houston to SF Bay Area

[binkata]

From what I've gleaned, it's really up to the ferry pilot whether I need to add them?

Obviously having them as a named insured makes the open pilot clause moot, but the open pilot clause itself still provides coverage.

Good to know there are honest agents willing to give honest answers out there too.

[RobertGary1]

21 minutes ago, LANCECASPER said:

The word is moot, not mute..

[ moot ]SHOW IPA

SEE SYNONYMS FOR moot ON THESAURUS.COM

---

adjective

open to discussion or debate; debatable; doubtful:  Whether that was the cause of their troubles is a moot point.

of little or no practical value, meaning, or relevance; purely academic: In practical terms, the issue of her application is moot because the deadline has passed.

 

 

Did you see the post I was responding to?

-Robert

[Andy95W]

2 hours ago, LANCECASPER said:

The word is moot, not mute..

[ moot ]SHOW IPA

SEE SYNONYMS FOR moot ON THESAURUS.COM

---

adjective

open to discussion or debate; debatable; doubtful:  Whether that was the cause of their troubles is a moot point.

of little or no practical value, meaning, or relevance; purely academic: In practical terms, the issue of her application is moot because the deadline has passed.

 

 

 

[carusoam]

Welcome aboard, Binkata!

Todays MS word of the day... Moot. As defined above... (we get these lessons a couple of times a month maybe...) 

Insurance details are always explained by the best insurance guys in the industry... they are resident here on MS (Parker and Paul H)  don’t be afraid to ask... they are good with the jargon and the English translations...

 

Can’t tell the players without a score card... - Program seller at the ball park...

We have a couple of CFIIs also in the conversation...

• Parker used to fly a fancy highly updated M20K...
• Paul K is currently flying an M20K and knows engine ops with the most minute detail... and resides in CA...
• Mike E is the kind of CFII that has experience in all Mooneys, and spreads Mooney knowledge infectiously....

There are plenty of fine turbo experienced pilots in the conversation as well, including some with further experience of being mechanics too...

And our friend Joe who was last seen flying an Acclaim and an RV... but has a foot challenge...   

One thing for sure...

You came to the right place...

If you would like moral support... I know a great writer who also has many hours in an M20K... but now flys a Screamin’ Eagle...  @Amelia

PP thoughts only...

Go MS!

Best regards,

-a-

[mike_elliott]

11 hours ago, binkata said:

From what I've gleaned, it's really up to the ferry pilot whether I need to add them?

Obviously having them as a named insured makes the open pilot clause moot, but the open pilot clause itself still provides coverage.

Good to know there are honest agents willing to give honest answers out there too.

It really is up to the ferry pilot to decide to guarantee the insurance company will not lose anything or not if something bad happens by allowing himself and his assets to be at risk by not being named additional insured with a waiver of subrogation or not. Yes, he may or may not have a non owned policy that could cover the replacement of the plane, the lawyer bills, the liability lawsuits etc, but most folks just doing a reposition with a commercial wont have a policy that protects him, who will surely be named in any potential suit. Your plane will be covered by your policy under the open pilot warranty, but this scenario really lacks the benefits of having all the attorneys on the same side of the table having your ferry pilot added as named additional insured with a waiver of subrogation. It is in your best interest also to keep things from being as messy as our election process

Disclaimer: Not an insurance agent, but have been fortunate enough to have had this in place in a fatal aircraft accident. I assure you my outcome would have been far different otherwise in spite of a rather comprehensive commercial non owned policy. The owners policy will be primary in any event is my understanding

[kortopates]

15 hours ago, RobertGary1 said:

Did you see the post I was responding to?

-Robert

yeah, blame it on me?.....

guilty as charged! .... I'll write a thousand "moots" at the blackboard .... unless is now "moot" 

[binkata]

10 hours ago, carusoam said:

Welcome aboard, Binkata!

Thanks for the warm welcome, and the introductions!  I've been lurking here for the past year as I contemplated buying an M20K...definitely saw the very detailed discussions about LOP/ROP, etc. that made my eyes go googly.

My story: I'm getting back into flying after a decade (all my experience is in C152/C172), have always wanted to get my instrument rating...but always lacked access to a plane that I would actually want to fly IFR with!  Plus, in California you're stuck mostly with north/south flying if all you do is rent.  I figured this was the best solution: I get a plane I want to fly that can take me places I want to go.

I look forward to learning a lot more from you all 

[201Mooniac]

Welcome, it is always nice to have another Mooney in the Bay Area.  I fly an M20J out of KRHV and there are several other bay area Mooneys represented here.

[RobertGary1]

48 minutes ago, 201Mooniac said:

Welcome, it is always nice to have another Mooney in the Bay Area.  I fly an M20J out of KRHV and there are several other bay area Mooneys represented here.

How is rhv doing? Seems like that airport was always under attack.  
 

-Robert 

[Flash]

16 hours ago, binkata said:

My story: I'm getting back into flying after a decade (all my experience is in C152/C172), have always wanted to get my instrument rating...but always lacked access to a plane that I would actually want to fly IFR with!  Plus, in California you're stuck mostly with north/south flying if all you do is rent.  I figured this was the best solution: I get a plane I want to fly that can take me places I want to go.

Welcome. The Bay Area is a great place to fly and home to quite a few Mooneys. My M20J is based at San Carlos. 

[pwnel]

On 11/5/2020 at 8:25 AM, binkata said:

Yes, that's how I understand it. Though one company/pilot said that she logged her hours under the ICAO type M20T, which is what the M20K would be, technically?

I'll ask the insurance company for clarification.

As a 231 owner, irrespective of what the insurance says, I won’t let anyone who don’t have 50hrs 231 experience fly my plane. Too much that can be messed up with poor engine management. I’ll include 252 pilots if they’re technically minded and understands the differences between LB and MB engines. (To insurance they’re both M20K) Be mindful of this - I see you’ve already been reading a lot here. Enjoy!

[carusoam]

Speaking of good reading and M20Ks around here...

Find the threads on operating the M20K using LOP...

It is a handful of K pilots that really have skill and don’t mind writing...   @jlunseth will be one of the writers...

Best regards,

-a-

[binkata]

19 minutes ago, carusoam said:

Find the threads on operating the M20K using LOP...

I think this will be a later mastery item for me...landings first! But yes, it's a newly OH'ed engine (< 25 hrs) so I'll want to get as much life out of it as possible.

 

On 11/7/2020 at 1:16 AM, Flash said:

Welcome. The Bay Area is a great place to fly and home to quite a few Mooneys. My M20J is based at San Carlos. 

Thanks--I did my primary training out of HWD in 2002, but that was in underpowered Cessnas. Can't wait to get out there and (post-covid-19) run into any of you all at the Two Niner Diner or at whatever replaces the old 3-Zero Cafe!

[jlunseth]

11 hours ago, pwnel said:

As a 231 owner, irrespective of what the insurance says, I won’t let anyone who don’t have 50hrs 231 experience fly my plane. Too much that can be messed up with poor engine management. I’ll include 252 pilots if they’re technically minded and understands the differences between LB and MB engines. (To insurance they’re both M20K) Be mindful of this - I see you’ve already been reading a lot here. Enjoy!

Very wise. For example, if you lean the engine for takeoff and climb, which is a technique for normally aspirated engines, you will see the TIT redline within a minute or two on takeoff during the summer, and not long after you will see CHT redlines, which is saying something since the redline is 460. The operation of the engine is almost completely contrary to what you may have been taught for NA engines. The only pilots who have ever flown my 231, other than me, are my mechanics, who know the engine.

[gsxrpilot]

I'll tentatively agree with @pwnel and @jlunseth.  And much like motorcycles, you don't just toss the keys to an airplane, no matter who it is.  But I'd also rather not assume all other pilots are idiots or incapable of due diligence, study, knowledge, etc. My very first time flying any turbo Mooney, or any turbo airplane for that matter, was when after handing over the bank check, I climbed in the left seat of N252AD, solo, and flew it home. New Philadelphia, OH to San Marcos, TX with a fuel stop in Memphis. I had the POH and other manuals sitting in the right seat next to me. 

Of course it is a 252 which is quite a bit simpler than a 231. It was also my airplane and therefore in some cases that equals better attention to detail and responsibility. But running full rich during the climb in a turbo is pretty basic information.

Maybe I got lucky, but 700 hours later, I'm still getting lucky 

Edit - assuming all other pilots are idiots is probably prudent with regards to your own airplane 

[201Mooniac]

On 11/6/2020 at 3:54 PM, RobertGary1 said:

How is rhv doing? Seems like that airport was always under attack.  
 

-Robert 

Still under attack.  Currently the county seems to be planning a 2031 or so shutdown.

[jlunseth]

On 11/5/2020 at 7:25 AM, binkata said:

Yes, that's how I understand it. Though one company/pilot said that she logged her hours under the ICAO type M20T, which is what the M20K would be, technically?

I'll ask the insurance company for clarification.

Yes, M20T is the aircraft type designation for a turbocharged Mooney, the designation that goes in a flight plan (ICAO or pre-ICAO). The 231 is an M20T, although the type designation applies to any turbo Mooney, K, Bravo or Acclaim. If her hours are not in the 231 she would need to be cautioned not to firewall the throttle or she will overboost the engine. Firewalled throttle is not reached until critical altitude, about 22,500 or thereabouts in a Merlyn equipped 231.

[binkata]

On 11/9/2020 at 9:53 AM, 201Mooniac said:

Still under attack.  Currently the county seems to be planning a 2031 or so shutdown.

Not sure if I can list links, but from just yesterday's news: https://www.ktvu.com/news/community-leaders-want-reid-hillview-airport-land-repurposed-for-affordable-housing

The seller of my Mooney-to-be said the main reason why he bought the plane years ago was because he was moving into a new subdivision and they were building an airport right next to it. Coming from California, it completely blew my mind that there were places where new GA airports were still being built! 

[carusoam]

Binkata,

Around here... search for hangar homes...

Some people actually like living near the runway...  

They pay extra for the opportunity.

Somebody is confusing the issues when they are telling the masses that airplanes are bad... or noise is bad... there are millions of other more important things to worry about...

Best regards,

-a-

[binkata]

Oh yeah, there is one of those airpark communities up near Sacramento: Cameron Park. A co-worker of mine who recently retired bought some land there to build a home for him & his Seneca. I'm not sure if he'll be able to taxi to his garage though.