New AD to make Aspens VFR only?

[Cruiser]

The E5 is not included because there are required backup instruments in the panel that are not effected. 

Just like the single PFD 1000 is not included in the AD. 

[NJMac]

The E5 is not included because there are required backup instruments in the panel that are not effected. 

Just like the single PFD 1000 is not included in the AD. 

That's not the case. I legally pulled my vacuum system and artificial horizon based on the paperwork for the E5. Technically, by the paperwork, the only backup instruments you have in a efis failure situation is the turn coordinator and whiskey compass. Honestly I think this whole Aspen failure stuff is nonsense. I'm ditching the unit and putting in dual G5s once the Garmin autopilot becomes live for the short bodies.

 

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[Cruiser]

An E5 failure is no different than an AI failure in a steam gauge panel, the partial panel is FAA legal to fly. That is why you had to retain the Turn coordinator

 

 

[bradp]

Does this have anything to do with the gentleman in the baron who crashed in NC after an Aspen upgrade/work?

[gsxrpilot]

Yeah, I like my Aspen a lot. And I also keep it up to date and current on any software updates or patches. As I do for all the technology in my airplane. And my technology at home as well. So therefore this AD doesn't apply to me or my airplane. 

@mike_elliott unfortunately there's no available software patch to fix that KI256. Good thing you had that Aspen.

[larrynimmo]

I flew the E5 for a whole year, about 230 hours...one time out of no where while flying vfr...it just restarted for no reason...when it came back up, it worked fine.

since feb 1st, I’ve had the upgraded max and it has been near flawless....about one in 10 power ups, it comes back and says “check attitude” and I need to do a hard reset and that works.   No issues while flying

[PTK]

17 hours ago, bradp said:

Does this have anything to do with the gentleman in the baron who crashed in NC after an Aspen upgrade/work?

Probably not the exact same Aspen malfunction that is the topic of this thread but yet another Aspen issue. As someone said above this Aspen failure stuff is really nonsense and dangerous. Shame on those of us in GA who put up with this bs by excusing and carrying water for Aspen or for any manufacturer who just can’t cut it. Shame on GA for not holding them accountable and not demanding better. We are GA and shame on us! 
I will say it again and I don’t care if some on here get a bad case of the hives. Take some Benadryl, sit up straight and please stop complaining about GA’s woes. It’s hypocritical. We need to wake up and own up. If it causes pause for thought and concern it’s worth it: The irony is that one of GA’s deadliest killers is spatial disorientation and we teach instruments students to “trust” their instruments! We’ve all been taught this and we continue to teach it. Personally, I cringe when people's lives depend on these boxes in IMC. In readIng these reports I cannot tell some trusting soul “trust your failure prone Aspen instruments” as I wouldn’t trust them myself.
(To be fair it appears from reading this report that the airplane was in the shop and the repair not begun or completed. It appears this pilot, with full knowledge of the malfunction, took it up anyway for night currency. He trusted a little too much.)

“...During startup at FAY for the flight to INT, the attitude and heading reference system (AHRS) fail amber caution light illuminated in the cockpit at engine startup and remained illuminated for 12 to 15 minutes, which included the initial portion of the flight. The pilot remarked during engine runup that the light usually extinguished by then. They discussed continuing the flight under visual flight rules because the autopilot would not engage, which would require the accident pilot manually
Page 1 of 4 ERA19FA201
This is preliminary information, subject to change, and may contain errors. Any errors in this report will be corrected when the final report has been completed.

fly the airplane. The friend added that during the time the caution light was illuminated, he did not observe any anomalies with the electronic flight information system (EFIS) display. To the friend's knowledge, the autopilot would not engage with the caution light illuminated and would not remain engaged if the caution light illuminated. After the caution light extinguished, the pilot engaged the autopilot for the remaining trip to INT. The friend spoke to the pilot after they both returned to FAY. The pilot reported that the light remained extinguished and he utilized the autopilot on the return flight to FAY; however, after landing at FAY, he turned off the avionics and then back on, the light illuminated for 3 minutes before he shut down the airplane and planned to take the airplane to an avionics maintenance facility. The pilot also commented that he planned to perform three night landings to maintain his night currency...

During startup at FAY for the flight to INT, the attitude and heading reference system (AHRS) fail amber caution light illuminated in the cockpit at engine startup and remained illuminated for 12 to 15 minutes, which included the initial portion of the flight. The pilot remarked during engine runup that the light usually extinguished by then. They discussed continuing the flight under visual flight rules because the autopilot would not engage, which would require the accident pilot manually
Page 1 of 4 ERA19FA201
This is preliminary information, subject to change, and may contain errors. Any errors in this report will be corrected when the final report has been completed.

fly the airplane. The friend added that during the time the caution light was illuminated, he did not observe any anomalies with the electronic flight information system (EFIS) display. To the friend's knowledge, the autopilot would not engage with the caution light illuminated and would not remain engaged if the caution light illuminated. After the caution light extinguished, the pilot engaged the autopilot for the remaining trip to INT. The friend spoke to the pilot after they both returned to FAY. The pilot reported that the light remained extinguished and he utilized the autopilot on the return flight to FAY; however, after landing at FAY, he turned off the avionics and then back on, the light illuminated for 3 minutes before he shut down the airplane and planned to take the airplane to an avionics maintenance facility. The pilot also commented that he planned to perform three night landings to maintain his night currency...”

[Cruiser]

It has occurred to me after reading these posts that some members here that have not had the opportunity to fly with a glass panel might get the impression that they are dangerous and unreliable. 

Please understand that "glass panels" merely replace the same instruments that exist in a "steam gauge" equipped aircraft. Old mechanical gauges fail also. We are all taught in our primary training how to handle partial panel situations. While I agree that any instrument failure is bad, it should NOT be viewed as "life threatening" or "disastrous" . If you have not practiced partial panel operations recently please take the time to do so. You owe it to yourself. 

These failures occur in all equipment by every manufacturer. Each system is different and it is the pilot that MUST make themselves familiar with operating the equipment in the plane they fly. SERIOUSLY. Trying to figure out how it works in a high stress situation is not the idea learning environment. 

Glass panels and modern instruments are great, easy to use and offer increased safety, reduced workload and overall convenience in flying. 

Be SAFE out there.

 

[Hank]

But when my vacuum pump goes out, I still have airspeed, altitude, vertical speed and turn coordinator. When the Aspen unit resets itself, and there are no backup instruments due to multiple Aspen installs, there are NO INSTRUMENTS until it completes the reset, and Aspen and the FAA are both concerned about loss of control in IMC with no instruments during the one minute the reset requires.

If the manufacturer thinks it's not safe, I must agree with them.

[Cruiser]

Just now, Hank said:

But when my vacuum pump goes out, I still have airspeed, altitude, vertical speed and turn coordinator. When the Aspen unit resets itself, and there are no backup instruments due to multiple Aspen installs, there are NO INSTRUMENTS until it completes the reset, and Aspen and the FAA are both concerned about loss of control in IMC with no instruments during the one minute the reset requires.

If the manufacturer thinks it's not safe, I must agree with them.

Not quite, your assumption is that the independent backup instrument will also fail at the exact same time the primary instrument fails. While that is possible, would you like to calculate the odds of it happening for me? 

[Hank]

5 minutes ago, Cruiser said:

Not quite, your assumption is that the independent backup instrument will also fail at the exact same time the primary instrument fails. While that is possible, would you like to calculate the odds of it happening for me? 

Aspen already figures out the multi-unit reboot, wrote an SB and submitted  it to the FAA. When it reboots, there are no instruments until the process completes. How long can you maintain control in IMC with no Instruments at all?

Losing the vacuum pump won't affect airspeed; my TC has electric backup. If pitot goes out, there's still vacuum.

What are the odds of vacuum pump and pitot both going out?

[Cruiser]

Hank, I am not sure what you are trying to say. .......

A single unit requires airspeed, Turn coordinator and Airspeed backup instruments. The turn coordinator can be removed if you have a backup AI. 

[RobertGary1]

One reason I never understood why people remove perfectly functional vacuum attitude indicators.  I have a pair of gi-275’s but still have my vacuum too. When has a pilot ever been in the air lamenting having too many attitude indicators? Plus I’m ifr legal even if both gi-275’s fail. 
 

-Robert  

[Hank]

8 minutes ago, Cruiser said:

Hank, I am not sure what you are trying to say. .......

A single unit requires airspeed, Turn coordinator and Airspeed backup instruments. The turn coordinator can be removed if you have a backup AI. 

The AD only applies to multi unit installs.

32 minutes ago, Cruiser said:

Not quite, your assumption is that the independent backup instrument will also fail at the exact same time the primary instrument fails. While that is possible, would you like to calculate the odds of it happening for me? 

That's not what I've ever said.

[RobertGary1]

20 hours ago, NJMac said:

I'm ditching the unit and putting in dual G5s once the Garmin autopilot becomes live for the short bodies.

 

 

Go modern. The gi-275 is a generation beyond the old G5’s. 
 

-Robert. 

[Cruiser]

19 minutes ago, Hank said:

The AD only applies to multi unit installs.

That's not what I've ever said.

I am saying that the two (or three) units are totally independent. If the primary resets you will still have airspeed, altitude, turn coordinator and VSI on the secondary unit, if it resets that information is all on the primary unit. 

The ONLY way you lose indications of airspeed, altitude, T&B and VSI  is if BOTH units reset at exactly the same time.