Just bought a junk m20c Ranger

[super6]

I have been fighting this crap for years now. Theirs Something not right here.

[DXB]

2 hours ago, super6 said:

Man I have some naysayers ,Need some help here.If I get $70,000 Into this thing I will be happy. This will be my last hobby.over and out.

Don't sweat the naysayers - this site is a great resource, but it's still the internet after all.  You will get a lot of the help you need here so don't be scared off.  Assuming the air frame is solid and you have enough time to work through the problems along the way, your budget above sounds realistic to me.

Edited April 14, 2019 by DXB

[Yetti]

27 minutes ago, super6 said:

I have been fighting this crap for years now. Theirs Something not right here.

Ha ha.   There are people on here that have blocked me because I like to explore how to fix things.    These are simple machines.   You will be fine.  Just make it better than the factory did and its all good.   Just like flying, do good work.

[chriscalandro]

A lot of these people are bone heads who think they should be able to buy someone else's upgraded airplane for nothing, and if you can't do the same you did it wrong. It's not the case and more than a few people have gone the path you are going. 

Some people will tell you you're wasting your money, but the fact is you are building the airplane you want, and that's worth something. 

Some people, unprovoked, will tell you all the things wrong with your airplane, and point out whatever flaw they can. 

The people described above are jerks. Don't pay attention to them. 

 

I have an airworthy 67C, and I am doing basically what you are doing. If you have questions, ask. 

Edited April 14, 2019 by chriscalandro

[Yooper Rocketman]

8 minutes ago, chriscalandro said:

A lot of these people are bone heads who think they should be able to buy someone else's upgraded airplane for nothing, and if you can't do the same you did it wrong. It's not the case and more than a few people have gone the path you are going.

Not exactly the same, but the same mindset you're seeing from some here. 

I was at a Lancair convention years ago, eating the continental breakfast one morning, and the guy at the table next to me found out I had built my own IVP Prop-jet.  He disclosed he was buying one, moving up from a two seat Lancair.  He said "why would I build one when I can buy one for equal or less than what you will have in yours, less labor?"  I shrugged my shoulders and thought to myself.....good luck buddy.  You're not getting what I BUILT for the number you're talking about.  He bought the plane he was talking about.  Missed a ton of flying time working out gear issues, hydraulic leaks and new interior pieces after hydraulic fluid saturation, experienced all kinds of issues with his "unsupported" Chelton avionics, eventually installing a complete new Garmin panel with MORE down time.  His first trip to a Lancair shop and his first annual.....a whole nother story.   I'm guessing his first year of ownership cost him well north of $100k and all that flying time.  He even disclosed to me several important flights (vacations with his girl) he cancelled due to issues.

And....he is a full 30 knots slower then me and extremely frustrated.  Can't figure out why he's so much slower.  All I'm thinking....go back to your first comments to me at the Lancair convention.  Just maybe you were dreaming.

Tom

[carusoam]

Getting to know many MSers over the years...

I have found that most of us have a different writing style than who we actually are in real life...

 

I see some cautionary posts written... as in ‘I did this, and it was more expensive that I thought...’  by people that are actually trying to help.

 

Try to take in the advice... it’s an opportunity to avoid some really expensive steps...

Try to get to know each poster... there are going to be some that have the answer you are looking for...

Know that... There is going to be an answer that can’t come out right... because the poster doesn’t have time to write today...

 

Then, put some things into perspective... Friday and Saturday evenings have some looser posts than mid week... there isn’t a way to tell if there are wine stains on the screen...  

 

At MS, you get out more than what you put in...

If you don’t, you are missing an opportunity...

 

It can be challenging to be part of such a fluid community... people come and go... some are afraid to post their names...  some start a conversation today, come back to it a few days later...

Sometimes you will feel like you are being attacked... and it gets pretty frustrating... 

The longer you hang out here... there is a maturing / aging process... (work with me on this statement... I don’t have the right word yet...)

The longer you hang out here... the more you will recognize the difficulty people have in expressing themselves... or their style is different than what you are expecting...

 

Yes there can be some bone headed activity... it gets reported and locked down...

Take some time...

re-read the same posts...  decide if each post was meant to be helpful, supportive, or mean...

Face it, there isn’t anyone spending time, hanging out here, hoping to make somebody else’s life miserable...

There isn’t a pay-off for that type of activity...

 

One thing for sure... 

First posts regarding planes that have been purchased... get a lot of fiery posts... 

The less prepared the purchase, the more fiery the posts get...  in this case imagine your friends trying to help you out... unless your friends are trained therapists... it isn’t going to sound like you have done the right thing...

The best part of the shared world of MS... If it sounds negative, you can ask for clarification... or ignore it...

Do your best... take in as much as you can... learn from others... forgiveness when somebody drops the ball... Expect that you will drop the ball someday too...

Most importantly... don’t ask somebody to write rules! 

We should be able to handle this kind of stuff intelligently... as a community.

About me... I bought the ugliest run down M20C available on the planet... there was no MS to ask questions to...

It takes effort to write, more effort to read, and when you don’t get it right... lots of effort to not insult people while writing....

We all are just/only people... 

Best regards,

-a-

 

[tigers2007]

I guess one could be lucky and buy a known masterpiece with a well memorialized history of meticulous ownership.

I recently sold my Jeep and the buyer was somewhat skeptical that I had a multi page Excel file journalizing every single item done to it. He even questioned the prophylactic work done like replacing the belts, plugs, etc before they were due. After he took it to the dealer for inspection he offered me like 4% under my asking price. He had nothing to lowball me on.

One day I’ll buy N994PT and be done with it. Maybe Tom will give me a “fire sale” price if I promise to let him ride in it.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Dan208]

I have been very tempted to go this route and buy a fixer uper. If I had any time to devote to a project I would probably already be there. Not buying a plane because I can afford it has been tough.  I will probably still end up with a project , but it will be worked on by the Avionics shop , or the paint shop.

I know people who will discourage and criticize any idea you float to them . You could find  the best fire sale deal in the world and they would still tell you it's no good .

What makes you happy is the best way to go , even it doesn't fit someone else's mold of the proper way to get the best deal.

Two thumbs up for saving another  M20 .

Edited April 19, 2019 by Dan208
Spelling error

[Igor_U]

Few things to consider…

All of us flying 50+ year old machines have, more or less project on our hands. My CFII once told me I didn’t buy airplane to save money. 

While people saying you would need to buy that plane for free and you’d still be in red might be technically right, it doesn’t mean you shouldn’t be doing it. A lot of people are DIY builders, restorers and if you have time and money I say go for it.

Do everything right, ask for advice, work with A&P but try to do as much as you can and you just might ended up with above average airplane. And by this I don’t mean fancy avionics and such but mechanically sound Mooney, free of corrosion, sorted out years of skipping on maintenance and such.

 

I do a lot of maintenance myself (Just installed the ADS-B Transponder and few more goodies) and would love to do project like this… Sometimes even finding M22 project…

However, senses prevail, with my work at 50-60 h/week and weekdays being away from home so I’ll have to postpone this kind of project ‘till retirement.

 

I say, good luck to you and I hope you post regularly about your progress.

[super6]

carusoam  

The last thing I want to do is insult any one here. I have respect for pro and con conversation.  I am overwhelmed by the reply's to this thread! I love the site and am trying to read through 20- 30 posts a day. I want to be civil and constructive. Thanks to all. 

[Bob E]

Good luck super6!  The challenge of restoring your bird will be worth it when you see the result.  It's fun to get lots of advice (and it's fun for people like me to give it), and it's even more fun to be in charge of your own project.  It sounds like you are more than capable of pulling this off.  You already know more about Mooneys than I knew (basically nothing!) when I bought mine 34 years ago!  And I'm still learning.

I've got a bunch of original (or original spec) M20C instruments I removed when I did an upgrade to a JPI EDM-900.  (I have an ad for them in the avionics forum.)  If nobody buys them in the next 30-60 days I'd be happy to donate them to you if you can use them.

 

[Andy95W]

If I end up buying @Bob E's Manifold Pressure gauge, I'll donate mine in its place.

[super6]

I will welcome all donations! I need a paint motif. I have  a 1999 Harley anniversary model road king  and wood like the paint to match.Any Ideals!

[super6]

M20F-1968

I think I will just fly the dam thing.

[kris_adams]

Congrats and thanks for saving a Mooney from the scrap pile. Look forward to some progress updates and seeing you at a fly in one of these days in the future!

[super6]

Alright, Been engine shopping and taking some advice from this thread an io-360 is on the list. I have seen some decent deals here and there.I just don't know which types are compatible. Will a io-360 A1B6 work ? Any advice  welcome!   

[EricJ]

3 hours ago, super6 said:

Alright, Been engine shopping and taking some advice from this thread an io-360 is on the list. I have seen some decent deals here and there.I just don't know which types are compatible. Will a io-360 A1B6 work ? Any advice  welcome!   

The only engines certified for an M20C are the O-360-A1D and the O-360-A1A.    Anything else will need an STC or a 337.    If an STC exists it will specify what engines it covers.    A 337 could be done on anything, but expect a lot of work to get a field approval from the FAA for that sort of alteration.

[DXB]

@super6  You will need an STC.   I think if you bought this one from LASAR, you would be good to go with an IO-360-A1B6.  You may want to call them and make sure however.    A downside includes $750 for paperwork.  Need for additional new fuel and intake system components add cost and complexity.  I think there are a few of these conversions out there, but I think many others who have looked into it have decided against.  

[steingar]

Just out of curiosity, what's wrong with the engine that came with it?  I heard it had a prop strike, but they can be rebuilt after that.  Way cheaper than trying to source an engine.

[super6]

bluehighwayflyer   Is The A1D fuel injected?

[Hank]

3 minutes ago, super6 said:

bluehighwayflyer   Is The A1D fuel injected?

By definition, the O-360-A1D is NOT fuel injected; that would change nomenclature to IO- . . . .

Edited May 7, 2019 by Hank

[super6]

Hank I have  the I0 and O- 360 thing sorted out, Just want to know if the IO-360 A1D was standard .

[DXB]

1 minute ago, super6 said:

Hank I have  the I0 and O- 360 thing sorted out, Just want to know if the IO-360 was standard .

You definitely need the carb'd O-360-A1D - no IO-360 in the type certificate for a C model.  

[super6]

Thanks DXB There is a ton of IO-360  engines available . Carburated 0-360 A1D not so much,

[EricJ]

19 minutes ago, super6 said:

Thanks DXB There is a ton of IO-360  engines available . Carburated 0-360 A1D not so much,

Are you stuck on an A1D?  There seem to be a number of A1As for sale, which many might argue are more desirable, anyway.

You have the option of purchasing the Lasar STC to install an IO-360, but as others have mentioned this will also include some additional work modifying the cowl and intake, etc., etc.