Shop breaks a part

[BillC]

46 minutes ago, xcrmckenna said:

To soon Lance, to soon.....


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Hahaha.....that’s OK, I did get a laugh out of that one. I needed it.

[xcrmckenna]

Hahaha.....that’s OK, I did get a laugh out of that one. I needed it.

Yeah at this point all you can do is laugh. It sucks you found a crap shop to deal with.


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[gsxrpilot]

This just verifies my belief that I shouldn't let anyone work on my Mooney unless they've done the job before, more than a few times, and have references to the quality of their work. I'm gonna need to get a small leak fixed in my left tank at some point. Carl Sharon did a full strip and reseal of the right tank last year and it's holding just fine. I'll likely use Don Maxwell or Dugosh to patch the leak in the left tank.

[xcrmckenna]

This just verifies my belief that I shouldn't let anyone work on my Mooney unless they've done the job before, more than a few times, and have references to the quality of their work. I'm gonna need to get a small leak fixed in my left tank at some point. Carl Sharon did a full strip and reseal of the right tank last year and it's holding just fine. I'll likely use Don Maxwell or Dugosh to patch the leak in the left tank.

If you want come up to Oregon and I’ll take care of the leaks. I have a sawzall. Figure if you can’t put fuel in the tank it can’t leak....


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[LANCECASPER]

3 hours ago, gsxrpilot said:

 I'll likely use Don Maxwell or Dugosh to patch the leak in the left tank.

If you use Dugosh and need a ride back let me know. They sealed up a small leak I had two years ago and no problems.

[M20C_AV8R]

I can relate and have been through something similar, you did the right thing and handled it the best way that works for you. As for me, I will never let the local fbo/shop on field touch my plane. I am now taking the work off field despite the inconvenience, it is well worth the extra effort to work with someone I can trust. Finding a shop that is willing to admit their mistakes and take ownership vs. blaming the pilot, age of the plane or related parts is worth it., as far as I see it, and if the plane is under their care and damage occurs they need to own it, just my opinion.

Best of luck getting these issues sorted.

[BillC]

15 hours ago, LANCECASPER said:

If you use Dugosh and need a ride back let me know. They sealed up a small leak I had two years ago and no problems.

Thanks for the offer but I’m only a short ride to KFLL when I get back. I’ll let Edison do it.

[Cayman44]

On 5/12/2018 at 11:44 PM, BillC said:

Thanks...where did you find it? Just found LASAR price is 119.06

https://lasar.com/product/dial-face-880024-009/

I've been looking for a wing fuel site guage, 880024-009, for almost two years. Does anyone have a lead.  I've called Lasar and Dugosh.

[carusoam]

6 hours ago, Cayman44 said:

I've been looking for a wing fuel site guage, 880024-009, for almost two years. Does anyone have a lead.  I've called Lasar and Dugosh.

Sounds like you started at the top of the list…

You can continue down the list, to see who has them on the shelf…

Or contact Mooney directly to get the ball rolling on replacements….

 

There is an MSC that used to sell the LB Mooneys recently… in Florida… a place I would want to check their shelf…

Best regards,

-a-

[1980Mooney]

21 hours ago, Cayman44 said:

I've been looking for a wing fuel site guage, 880024-009, for almost two years. Does anyone have a lead.  I've called Lasar and Dugosh.

 

15 hours ago, carusoam said:

Sounds like you started at the top of the list…

You can continue down the list, to see who has them on the shelf…

Or contact Mooney directly to get the ball rolling on replacements….

 

There is an MSC that used to sell the LB Mooneys recently… in Florida… a place I would want to check their shelf…

Best regards,

-a-

2 years…..no parts!  This sounds like the No Back Spring debacle …2.0, again, “the sequel”.

I look at Lasar and so many critical parts seem to say “Sold Out”… Steering horns, landing gear linkage, landing gear actuators, fuel dials, flight controls, switches, etc. 

“Or contact Mooney directly to get the ball rolling on replacements”.   Helpful advice but Sadly this appears to be the new Mooney “standard operating procedure”

 

[Will.iam]

On 3/24/2022 at 5:21 PM, Cayman44 said:

I've been looking for a wing fuel site guage, 880024-009, for almost two years. Does anyone have a lead.  I've called Lasar and Dugosh.

how about contacting Rochester Gauges in Dallas Texas for a Dial 5-2100? maybe they can sell you one?

[LANCECASPER]

7 minutes ago, Will.iam said:

how about contacting Rochester Gauges in Dallas Texas for a Dial 5-2100? maybe they can sell you one?

This has been tried many times and they will only sell that gauge to Mooney.

[M20F-1968]

On 5/15/2018 at 12:58 PM, Kris_Adams said:

I get it but you may not have the option to always use an experienced Mooney mechanic that knows every trick of the trade, plus sometimes 40 or 50 year old parts have reached their service life (or ability to be taken off and put back on at least) and they break...and I agree that it's not the owner's responsibility to train or oversee but doing so can save you money and aggravation.  I don't have the knowledge that others in the group have so I'm pretty much in the group that has to trust their mechanic and pay his bills...

My experience has taught me not to be in the group that blindly trusts their mechanic.   Find a mechanic that knows what he is doing and learn from him.  When I did my rebuild, Bill Wheat referred me a a shop in the DC area just for a conversation.  They were experienced and  easy to talk to.   They asked me if this was my first  aircraft and I said it was.   I responded with my question which was, " so are you telling me that half the A&P's are incompetent and half of the other half are thieves."   The man I was talking to laughed  and said,  "Yeah,  that is about right."  

Treat the people you know  are competent and experienced well.    That is an important relationship to keep.  There are not a lot of such people around.   For the others you don't know,  keep an eye on them and maintain some skepticism.    Even the  biggest  and fanciest  shops need to hire  inexperienced help.   The larger the shop  the less you will know about the person who's actually working on a plane.   Even if you  do not do the work yourself,  you want to get to the point where you know what needs to be done,  how to do it,  and how to judge the work of others.

John Breda

[Fly Boomer]

 

May be moot if they won't sell it, but I'm not even seeing the product?

[N201MKTurbo]

So, If they won't make you a Mooney specific custom part, reverse engineer a Mooney capsule. Make a drawing and send it to them and ask if they will make a custom part for you? Be prepared for some NRE. 

Has anybody called Mooney and asked to finance a buy of 100, or whatever the minimum buy is for Rochester. In exchange for some quantity of capsules at cost? It would need to be a deal that was a win for Mooney and a win for you (us).

[Guest]

Mooney quoted us 18 weeks lead time.  Now it requires approval and another 10 weeks after approval and approval isn’t guaranteed.

Clarence

[1980Mooney]

4 hours ago, N201MKTurbo said:

Has anybody called Mooney and asked to finance a buy of 100, or whatever the minimum buy is for Rochester. In exchange for some quantity of capsules at cost? It would need to be a deal that was a win for Mooney and a win for you (us).

Seriously?  I am sure you have followed the “No-back Spring” debacle. This has been suggested before. Mooney will continue to wait until it has some good quantity of orders in hand and then place small orders. As I have said this shows Mooney is struggling with extremely tight working capital. 

Edited March 28, 2022 by 1980Mooney

[N201MKTurbo]

44 minutes ago, 1980Mooney said:

Seriously?  I am sure you have followed the “No-back Spring” debacle. This has been suggested before. Mooney will continue to wait until it has some good quantity of orders in hand and then place small orders. As I have said this shows Mooney is struggling with extremely tight working capital. 

That’s why I said to finance the buy. I know they don’t have the money.

[Schllc]

2 hours ago, N201MKTurbo said:

That’s why I said to finance the buy. I know they don’t have the money.

While money is absolutely an issue, it’s also the manufacturing certificate, traceability and liability impeding prompt replacement parts. 
Owning and stocking the parts is value added inventory, which is not good for a company in their position.  And selling directly to owners almost invites unauthorized repairs. 
If a mass buy were to happen it would probably have to come from an MSC, and they would have to hold and sell the part(s).
Meaning if you wanted to order whatever number of any part required to incentivize a manufacturer, you would have to pay the service center and they would own all the parts. 
how you got reimbursed would be a tricky deal.

I would lay more blame on the regulations regarding parts and manufacturers than on Mooney. 
The system is truly outdated and broken. 
 

[1980Mooney]

6 hours ago, Schllc said:

Owning and stocking the parts is value added inventory, which is not good for a company in their position.  And selling directly to owners almost invites unauthorized repairs. 
If a mass buy were to happen it would probably have to come from an MSC, and they would have to hold and sell the part(s).
Meaning if you wanted to order whatever number of any part required to incentivize a manufacturer, you would have to pay the service center and they would own all the parts. 
how you got reimbursed would be a tricky deal.

I would lay more blame on the regulations regarding parts and manufacturers than on Mooney. 
The system is truly outdated and broken. 

Historically MSC's were able to purchase parts from Mooney at a 20% discount.  This gave them incentive to order and stock in inventory these parts.  A few years ago Mooney eliminated the discount.  MSC's have less incentive to order parts in advance and hold them as they did in the past.  As a result nationwide inventories of Mooney parts have plummeted.  @M20Doc has previously commented that 

"Of the 3 brands I operate a service centre for, Mooney is the only one to remove the discount structure from us....

Clarence"

Mooney has brought this on upon themselves.

Edited March 29, 2022 by 1980Mooney

[A64Pilot]

I’ll take an opposite view many have.

The mechanic called you and told you the absolute truth as to what happened, that is worth a LOT in my opinion.

What I believe many shops would have done is to NOT call you and when you picked up the airplane they would either have put in the bill the replacement cost or left it broken and if you asked they would say it was that way when it came in.

I think with several shops you don’t ever know what’s really going on, misdrilled holes and other hidden damage.

While you guys may say “hammering” on fuel covers isn’t right, I’ll tell you it’s not at all uncommon, I myself will usually use the heel of my hand to hammer in a putty knife if fuel tank sealer was used to seal the cover which isn’t uncommon either. You have to use force to break the seal, and often to continue the “cut” not using an impact action can often result in a bent cover

So while they F’d up. at least the mechanic was honest, and honestly is becoming a rare thing, and it’s worth a lot in my opinion, an honest mechanic is less likely to cover up their mistakes.

Edited March 29, 2022 by A64Pilot

[1980Mooney]

5 hours ago, A64Pilot said:

I’ll take an opposite view many have.

The mechanic called you and told you the absolute truth as to what happened, that is worth a LOT in my opinion.

What I believe many shops would have done is to NOT call you and when you picked up the airplane they would either have put in the bill the replacement cost or left it broken and if you asked they would say it was that way when it came in.

I think with several shops you don’t ever know what’s really going on, misdrilled holes and other hidden damage.

While you guys may say “hammering” on fuel covers isn’t right, I’ll tell you it’s not at all uncommon, I myself will usually use the heel of my hand to hammer in a putty knife if fuel tank sealer was used to seal the cover which isn’t uncommon either. You have to use force to break the seal, and often to continue the “cut” not using an impact action can often result in a bent cover

So while they F’d up. at least the mechanic was honest, and honestly is becoming a rare thing, and it’s worth a lot in my opinion, an honest mechanic is less likely to cover up their mistakes.

Agreed.  These mechanics are fixing Mooney's in which the majority are 20-60 years old. Materials get brittle and hard over time.  Oxidation occurs and things stick.  Some materials shrink and some expand. Many things don't come apart as easily as they went together in the factory ages ago.  Things are going to break. 

Of course we want every repair to proceed perfectly. And we don't want the plane abused.  If you have ever done any of the work yourself you will know what a bear it can be to work on a Mooney.  Mooney's are largely hand built/assembled and every one can have some things that are just the slightest bit different.  Sometimes it takes a degree of art to get everything apart and back together perfectly.

If you expect a mechanic to never break a part, never strip anything on these generally old, old planes then you probably should not own an old airplane.  In most cases it is an easy fix but the problem is the lack of easily available (and timely) parts from Mooney.  Yes it is good that the Factory may eventually support and supply but Mooney owners just need to factor in down time or flying with INOP parts like this.