Any Bellanca Viking advice?

[Mcstealth]

Kerrville just yesterday, aquired three new planes to rent. One is a Viking. It is the first traveling plane on the field available to rent in over 20 years or more. I am going to get my complex and HP ratings in it.

The owner stated it has an IO 520?? 300hp? Something like that. 

Any reason not to get the ratings in that plane? 

Thanks in advance. 

Standard six pack with a wass430. 

[KLRDMD]

It is a fine airplane but tight. It makes a Mooney seem spacious. Also, it doesn't fly all that fast on a bunch of fuel. It is one of the only airplanes that glides, power off, worse than an Arrow.

It you were talking ownership, there would be a diferent series of comments but as a renter, those are the concerns.

[philip_g]

They are very nice handling planes. Wood wings, tube steel and fabric elsewhere. Later ones are faster than easier ones. Little faster than a j on aot more gas. I don't think I've ever seen one with a panel that wasn't a scattered mess. 

 

They're neat airplanes. I actually like them a lot.

Edited December 1, 2021 by philip_g

[BKlott]

Someone once said that the Bellanca Viking was the most efficient airplane ever at converting avgas into noise.

You should check out the Super Viking Forum. There are a number of threads and resources there that may benefit you. One popular thread is titled something like “How to land a Viking”. Apparently they can be a little tricky.

[GeeBee]

Be very careful of fuel management. Some versions have very complicated fuel systems, made more complicated with two valves and gauges that will not read unless that tank is selected. In addition the fuselage tank is very tough to determine how much fuel is aboard and especially in a rental, you may think it is empty only to find yourself over gross and out the aft end cg with fuel in the tank. Finally all 5 tanks are small and you can find yourself in flame out city if you don't keep a close eye on things. Personally, I would not own one without a good fuel totalizer on it and would think long and hard about flying it with the totalizer inoperative. 

Avoid flying with fuel in the fuselage tank. It is not your friend when you have a forced landing or LOC.

Finally it glides like a beveled man hole cover. If you loose an engine, downwind abeam the numbers, turn to the runway, NOW.

It handles really good and flying it makes you feel like you are in an early Maserati.

 

[N201MKTurbo]

My friend used to have access to one. We did a bit of formation flying. The Viking would out climb the Mooney (M20F) but I would catch up in cruise?

 

The speed difference was very small, a couple of knots at most. The Mooney was more comfortable to ride in.

[EricJ]

Should definitely be fun to get checked out in.   I wouldn't pass it up!

A friend used to have one and loved it, then bought a Mooney because he couldn't bear leaving the Viking outside in storms.   Apparently the Mooney wasn't as much of a worry.     

 

[philip_g]

28 minutes ago, N201MKTurbo said:

My friend used to have access to one. We did a bit of formation flying. The Viking would out climb the Mooney (M20F) but I would catch up in cruise?

 

The speed difference was very small, a couple of knots at most. The Mooney was more comfortable to ride in.

The vike handles bumps really nice. You can look at the wing tips and see them bouncing along soaking up the bumps. It's been too long to remember if the vike felt smaller. I remember sitting right on the spar so you sit super low

 

At some point they simplified the fuel system, I can't imagine renting an older more complicated one

 

The craftsmanship put into those wings is impressive. Used to be some old vids on YouTube from the factory back in the day

 

I wanted a turbo vike before I got my first Mooney (231) and just never got back to them. Termites here would eat one to dust so I can't have one now 

Edited December 1, 2021 by philip_g

[EricJ]

2 minutes ago, philip_g said:

The craftsmanship put into those wings is impressive. Used to be some old vids on YouTube from the factory back in the day

In A&P school we had a Viking wing that we used for wood inspection, planning repairs, and stuff like that in our Wood and Fabric class.  Definitely very cool to see.   I wouldn't want to have to actually maintain one, though. 

 

[philip_g]

6 minutes ago, EricJ said:

In A&P school we had a Viking wing that we used for wood inspection, planning repairs, and stuff like that in our Wood and Fabric class.  Definitely very cool to see.   I wouldn't want to have to actually maintain one, though. 

 

I was under the impression they were pretty worry free if kept dry and the fabric was good. Never got the nerve to buy one though. I met a guy in around 09 that was having a hard time keeping his with the economic downturn so I flew his awhile in a non equity partnership

 

I don't think they've ever had a bellanca soar fail. Mooney can't claim that anymore lol

Edited December 1, 2021 by philip_g

[philip_g]

This poor bastard hit a powerline. Wing still attached 

 

http://www.kathrynsreport.com/2013/03/bellanca-17-30a-super-viking-n96jg.html?m=1

[David Lloyd]

The Viking was very unusual in that it could be ordered with either a Lycoming IO-540 or a Continental IO-520.  Seems like the 540 was 300 horsepower, the 520 was 285.

[kris_adams]

1 hour ago, philip_g said:

This poor bastard hit a powerline. Wing still attached 

 

http://www.kathrynsreport.com/2013/03/bellanca-17-30a-super-viking-n96jg.html?m=1

interesting read...a student pilot wit 24 hours carrying a passenger 

[philip_g]

29 minutes ago, Kris_Adams said:

interesting read...a student pilot wit 24 hours carrying a passenger 

Yeah. lucky they aren't both dead. 24 hours total and I think 8 in the vike

[Mcstealth]

4 hours ago, N201MKTurbo said:

My friend used to have access to one. We did a bit of formation flying. The Viking would out climb the Mooney (M20F) but I would catch up in cruise?

 

The speed difference was very small, a couple of knots at most. The Mooney was more comfortable to ride in.

That makes sense. 6 cylinder against 4 cylinder. Mooney efficiency against non-efficiecy. 

[steingar]

For rental?  I'd fly one of those things in a heartbeat.  To own?  Not os much.  Personally I think the owner is an idiot putting that airplane on the flight line.

[Geoff]

Vikings are super fun to fly.  The wing is smooth no rivets and the aileron response will feel fast compared to the Mooney. Go fly ground maneuvers and have fun with the turn rates.

They do not float on landing and the pitch trim is on an overhead spinner which I can never remember which way to turn.  Glides like a Steinway piano so you can make an high approach with no problems.

Need ANR as they are louder inside than a Mooney.

[Mcstealth]

Glides "second worse to an Arrow" "like a beveled man hole cover," "like a Steinway ," "turn toward the runway Now,"

Hahaha. Got it. 

[BDPetersen]

Plus the elevator trim is on the ceiling like God and Stinson intended . . .

[Hank]

It's hardly BellancaSpace, but this is a good read:

https://airfactsjournal.com/2021/12/owning-and-flying-a-bellanca-viking/

 

[Mooneymite]

1 hour ago, Hank said:

It's hardly BellancaSpace, but this is a good read:

https://airfactsjournal.com/2021/12/owning-and-flying-a-bellanca-viking/

 

My concern for a Viking would be the same concern I had for my Mooneymite: how long does wood glue last; how long does it maintain its strength?

No one seems to know for sure.

[takair]

My previous hangarmate was a Super Viking restored by the hangar owner.  Beautiful airplane, but hasn’t moved in years.  I’m restoring a 64 Pitts Special right now with wood wings.  Generally speaking the wings are in good shape, but the plane was indoors.  Glue joints appear good, with some exceptions, and a trend.  One location had collected water in storage AND the wood and glue was not sealed.  The original damage was in 1972 and hidden by whoever repaired it.  It would have caught up to me or someone else in a dramatic way.  The only reason I found it was because I pulled the leading edges due to a bad feeling……. Other areas are where there was movement of the wood and joint…..and again exposure.  
 

Ultimately, a wood airplane, especially an old one, should not be kept outside.  Moisture is definitely not good for them, but UV, heat and very dry also takes its toll on glue joints and the wood.  The complication is the difficulty in inspecting them….and even a small amount of moisture can collect in places that can’t drain.  This is just another complication in the shortage of affordable hangars…

[81X]

My hangar mate had a super Viking and I used to fly it with him to stay current while my Mooney was in for upgrades.  It was shocking to me how much power you needed on approach.  Really neat, fun airplane to fly!  So unique for a traveling machine with wooden wings and a rag tube fuselage.  

The super Viking handled turbulence well, was a dream to fly, and was fast in flight.   The speed was important if that meant first to the pumps, because it burnt some serious fuel!  

[Nokomis449]

There was a '67F auctioned a few weeks ago.  Beautiful paint, window curtains, nice trim and steam panel - looked like it was fresh from the '67 factory floor.  I called and spoke to the owner, who was in his '80's and decided it was time to give up flying.  This was his 3rd Mooney, and had bought his first one brand new (in '58?) for about $9k.  Turned out to be a very interesting 30 minute conversation about Mooneys and Bellanca's.  He was something like the national sales manager for Bellanca for many years and almost took a similar position at Mooney around the LoPriesti era.  He had good things to say about Bellanca's, but also said to stay away from those that'd lived in wet/humid areas.  Said he'd seen several where water had accumulated at the spar and you could push your finger into the wood.

My personal valuation was that his F needed $40k of avionics upgrades to make it a decent, $90-$100K IFR platform.  A last minute bidding war between two bidders drove the selling price up to $81K