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Arctic Air Evaporative cooler, think it'll work?

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carusoam Grand Master

carusoam

Posted
Posted

Before cars had AC units they had evaporative cooling units that hung on the windows...

In TX, things like this are mounted on top of buildings and they are called swamp coolers... :)

To make evaporative cooling really work.. you want the evaporated water to leave the space...

Best I can tell... 10hours of evaporating water is being expelled into your plane...

Sounds like a lot of moisture that you intentionally spread around inside your plane.

For it to technically work, the Rh has to be pretty low, allowing for a good rate of evaporation...

That just gave me a great idea... :)

PP thoughts only, not an HVAC guy.

Best regards,

-a-

McMooney Veteran

McMooney

Posted
  • Author
Posted
7 hours ago, carusoam said:

Before cars had AC units they had evaporative cooling units that hung on the windows...

In TX, things like this are mounted on top of buildings and they are called swamp coolers... :)

To make evaporative cooling really work.. you want the evaporated water to leave the space...

Best I can tell... 10hours of evaporating water is being expelled into your plane...

Sounds like a lot of moisture that you intentionally spread around inside your plane.

For it to technically work, the Rh has to be pretty low, allowing for a good rate of evaporation...

That just gave me a great idea... :)

PP thoughts only, not an HVAC guy.

Best regards,

-a-

would really only need it when taxing about and maybe for the first 4000 to 5000 feet of flight.  so say 1 hour.  could even fill it with ice to make it a bit cooler.

$40 sounds a lot more reasonable than https://www.sportys.com/pilotshop/arctic-air-portable-air-conditioner-38-qt-single-fan-12-volt.html

some concern about adding moisture to the interior of the plane, but hell, it's texas,  pretty moist already.

thinwing Grand Master

thinwing

Posted
Posted

New from womco!!...aircraft cooling vest worn while flying in the flight levels.Includes “easy scoop”velcroed to pilots vent window.Light weight hose attaches to vest for immediate cooling effect.Only 19.95 plus shipping.

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Davidv Mentor

Davidv

Posted
Posted
41 minutes ago, thinwing said:

New from womco!!...aircraft cooling vest worn while flying in the flight levels.Includes “easy scoop”velcroed to pilots vent window.Light weight hose attaches to vest for immediate cooling effect.Only 19.95 plus shipping.

“Offers 3X the cooling of other flight level cooling vests!”

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EricJ Grand Master

EricJ

Posted
Posted
11 hours ago, TonyK said:

I am suspect of anything providing additional value with a soothing nightlight. 

The bright, flashing nightlights are even worse.

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N201MKTurbo Grand Master

N201MKTurbo

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, aviatoreb said:

Lets do something with dry ice.

Be careful, asphyxiation hazard.

Even though dry ice is colder, I believe the latent heat in ice is much higher than dry ice.

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carusoam Grand Master

carusoam

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, aviatoreb said:

Lets do something with dry ice.

Back in the day... my friend flying an M20K... was carrying medical supplies that were chilled with dry ice... the cabin was all full up...

Filling the cockpit with CO2 can be pretty hazardous.  Not as bad as CO.

Nicer than regular ice because it is dry.  :)

Not as convenient because it is a challenge to circulate coolant through the heat exchanger when the coolant is water...

 

PP thoughts only...

-a-

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aviatoreb Grand Master

aviatoreb

Posted
Posted
40 minutes ago, N201MKTurbo said:

Be careful, asphyxiation hazard.

Even though dry ice is colder, I believe the latent heat in ice is much higher than dry ice.

Oh well - its good for hunting anyway.

  • Like 1
Yetti Grand Master

Yetti

Posted
Posted
On 6/7/2019 at 12:27 AM, carusoam said:

In TX, things like this are mounted on top of buildings and they are called swamp coolers... :)

 

Not in Texas with our 4000 percent humidity more of a New Mexico Arizona thang.

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EricJ Grand Master

EricJ

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, Yetti said:

Not in Texas with our 4000 percent humidity more of a New Mexico Arizona thang.

Even in AZ an actual swamp cooler (aka evaporative cooler) doesn't work all summer, as we get our "monsoon" season with moisture coming up from Baja.

My understanding of the roof chillers on big buildings is that they're used to augment the vapor-cycle air conditioners.

Jerry 5TJ Grand Master

Jerry 5TJ

Posted
Posted

Yeah, we’ve beaten this dead horse before. But it is still fun.  

One ton of ice melts and absorbs 288,000 BTU.  Yeah, I just looked it up.  

So, if your ice chest cooler has 50 pounds of ice, it can absorb 288,000 x (50/2000) = 7,2000 BTU by melting it.

Say it takes just 2 hours to melt it all. That’s 7,200/2 = 3,600 BTU/hour.  

An average automobile AC is rated closer to 20,000 BTU/hour.  

AND the vehicle AC will be dehumidifying the cabin air too, condensing vapor on the cold exchanger and draining moisture outside the cabin.  Unlike an ice chest system.  

So no, 50 pounds of ice isn’t going to chill you much in your heat-soaked Mooney.  

But it’s better than nada. And you can keep your sodas cold in the same ice chest.   

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aviatoreb Grand Master

aviatoreb

Posted
Posted
20 minutes ago, Jerry 5TJ said:

Yeah, we’ve beaten this dead horse before. But it is still fun.  

One ton of ice melts and absorbs 288,000 BTU.  Yeah, I just looked it up.  

So, if your ice chest cooler has 50 pounds of ice, it can absorb 288,000 x (50/2000) = 7,2000 BTU by melting it.

Say it takes just 2 hours to melt it all. That’s 7,200/2 = 3,600 BTU/hour.  

An average automobile AC is rated closer to 20,000 BTU/hour.  

AND the vehicle AC will be dehumidifying the cabin air too, condensing vapor on the cold exchanger and draining moisture outside the cabin.  Unlike an ice chest system.  

So no, 50 pounds of ice isn’t going to chill you much in your heat-soaked Mooney.  

But it’s better than nada. And you can keep your sodas cold in the same ice chest.   

Good analysis!

how many btu are the oem Mooney ac?

EricJ Grand Master

EricJ

Posted
Posted

The proposed cooler is evaporative, though, and latent heat of evaporation for water is ~970 btu/lb rather than the noted 144 btu/lb for melting.  

Even better, have a B-Kool with ice and when all of it has melted and reached ambient temp (which takes a LONG TIME even in Phoenix), use that water in the evaporative cooler (assuming it works, which I wouldn't always bet on).   You could potentially exploit 1114 btu/lb for the carried ice/water.

Anyway, the heat absorption capability with water is maybe better than the initial analysis would suggest.    I've found the B-Kool by itself to be way more than adequate in Phoenix in the summer.   I've not yet exhausted its cooling capability even with multi-hour missions, and that's with mixing ice and cooling packs in the load.   And I don't pay a weight penalty in the winter like I would with an a/c.

 

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smccray Mentor

smccray

Posted
Posted
8 hours ago, Jerry 5TJ said:

AND the vehicle AC will be dehumidifying the cabin air too, condensing vapor on the cold exchanger and draining moisture outside the cabin.  Unlike an ice chest system.  

Actually, the ice chest systems like the BKool and the Arctic Air will add some dehumidification. As warm moist air is pulled across the heat exchanger in the lid of the cooler, some of the moisture will condensed onto the heat exchanger eventually adding moisture to the cooler.

I don’t now how to measure the capacity to dehumidify, and I wouldn’t go pounding the table about the ability of the system to dehumidify, but it’s real and it does help...in Texas.

My BKool was required equipment when flying in the summer months in the J. 

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Hank Grand Master

Hank

Posted
Posted
13 hours ago, EricJ said:

The proposed cooler is evaporative, though, and latent heat of evaporation for water is ~970 btu/lb rather than the noted 144 btu/lb for melting.  

Even better, have a B-Kool with ice and when all of it has melted and reached ambient temp (which takes a LONG TIME even in Phoenix), use that water in the evaporative cooler (assuming it works, which I wouldn't always bet on).   You could potentially exploit 1114 btu/lb for the carried ice/water.

Anyway, the heat absorption capability with water is maybe better than the initial analysis would suggest.    I've found the B-Kool by itself to be way more than adequate in Phoenix in the summer.   I've not yet exhausted its cooling capability even with multi-hour missions, and that's with mixing ice and cooling packs in the load.   And I don't pay a weight penalty in the winter like I would with an a/c.

 

This is true for both days of your winter.  :lol:

But since moving from WV back to AL, I really can't say a whole lot anymore . . . .

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peevee Grand Master

peevee

Posted
Posted
14 hours ago, Jerry 5TJ said:

Yeah, we’ve beaten this dead horse before. But it is still fun.  

One ton of ice melts and absorbs 288,000 BTU.  Yeah, I just looked it up.  

So, if your ice chest cooler has 50 pounds of ice, it can absorb 288,000 x (50/2000) = 7,2000 BTU by melting it.

Say it takes just 2 hours to melt it all. That’s 7,200/2 = 3,600 BTU/hour.  

An average automobile AC is rated closer to 20,000 BTU/hour.  

AND the vehicle AC will be dehumidifying the cabin air too, condensing vapor on the cold exchanger and draining moisture outside the cabin.  Unlike an ice chest system.  

So no, 50 pounds of ice isn’t going to chill you much in your heat-soaked Mooney.  

But it’s better than nada. And you can keep your sodas cold in the same ice chest.   

it's a lot easier to do what you did, and buy a plane with AC.

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Hank Grand Master

Hank

Posted
Posted
17 minutes ago, peevee said:

it's a lot easier to do what you did, and buy a plane with AC.

I can buy several coolers and a lifetime of ice for the airplane upgrade differential cost . . . . .

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Jerry 5TJ Grand Master

Jerry 5TJ

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, peevee said:

it's a lot easier to do what you did, and buy a plane with AC.

And on really hot days it helps to set the pressurization to kick in at a higher altitude, too.  The P3 bleed air is hot!  

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