Wing Jack

[A64Pilot]

On 4/27/2023 at 3:12 PM, ArtVandelay said:

You’ll have to figure out how to remove the V part.

That’s easy, chop saw or band saw or even a die grinder and cut off wheel.

Then once removed I think weld on a heavy duty fender washer, the hole in the fender washer of course holds the jack point secure

[A64Pilot]

22 hours ago, bluehighwayflyer said:

Mine came from The Jack House 40 and 15 years ago.  I have two sets.  All with locking collars.  Modifying car jacks is a mistake in most cases. Even if the extensions were properly done I don’t think nine inch bases would give me the stability I would want climbing in and out of the plane to swing the gear.  
 

http://www.jackhouse.com

Yeah, I’ve sort of abandoned the 9” base idea for the reason you state, so either make a jack from a jack stand that has a proper base, or extend the base on the initial jack stand.

Leaning towards making a strong stand into a jack

Majority of the factory solutions are pretty much a 24” Chinese jack, a simple X base with electrical conduit braces. An hour or two’s work and maybe $150 ea to duplicate a $400 jack.

Way back in the day, 1980 to be precise I started my working life as an oilfield contract welder, then of course the oilfield collapsed, but I’m not a bad welder.

Its a long story but I got rid of almost all of my tools a few years ago, and have ordered a cheapo Chinese 200Amp DC welder, some 3/32 7018 welding rod etc and will most likely try to knock up something, whether it’s copy a jackhouse etc jack or convert a stand into a jack will I think depend on how well made and robust one of the stands are. I like the idea of the jack only being used to lift the airplane, once lifted aircraft is supported by a stand that’s very strong and stable over a jack that relies on an O-ring in a Chinese cylinder to hold my airplane up.

[N201MKTurbo]

I have a set of Jack House jacks. I bought them used and they never had the locking collars. They bleed down slowly, but it never has been a problem. If I jack it up enough to get the wheels off and come back the next day they will be all the way down, but the axels won’t touch the ground, so no harm.

The one thing you don’t want to do is leave the plane on jacks overnight with the wheels up, because you won’t know for sure how high you need to jack it so the wheels will clear coming down. 
 

The plane does look pretty sexy sitting on jacks with the wheels up.

[Guest]

3 hours ago, N201MKTurbo said:

I have a set of Jack House jacks. I bought them used and they never had the locking collars. They bleed down slowly, but it never has been a problem. If I jack it up enough to get the wheels off and come back the next day they will be all the way down, but the axels won’t touch the ground, so no harm.

The one thing you don’t want to do is leave the plane on jacks overnight with the wheels up, because you won’t know for sure how high you need to jack it so the wheels will clear coming down. 
 

The plane does look pretty sexy sitting on jacks with the wheels up.

You can get a split locking collar for a motor shaft, slide it down the ram and tighten the Allen screw to secure the ram.  Or drill a cross hole in the ram, add a collar and pin.  I've done both in the past.  

[Guest]

3 hours ago, bluehighwayflyer said:

Agreed about not relying on o-rings for support.  Not for any longer than necessary, anyway.  That is where the locking collars come in.  

Here is a picture of mine from The Jack House in action.  Maybe elements of them will give you design inspiration.  My only complaint with them is that you have to put the plane higher in the air than would otherwise be necessary in order to get to the hole in the shaft for the locking collar.   It makes getting in and out of the plane with it on jacks harder than otherwise would be necessary.  Also, lower is better as far as stability on the jacks is concerned.

You could always drill another hole lower down to your liking.

[RLCarter]

23 hours ago, Tim-37419 said:

@RLCarter - are you talking about the original jack asked about or one of the others in the thread?

The one in the 1st post (link)

[A64Pilot]

1 hour ago, bluehighwayflyer said:

My IA made the same suggestion.  Having not done so I think is more a product of fear of messing up my jacks than of laziness, but they both probably factor in.  

I’ve considered the hole myself, but you could damage the seal, so I think if you do drill a hole be careful to chamfer / deburr the hole and you should be fine.

I’ve considered the clamp lock collar for my engine hoist too as I use it to lift the nose, I need to do something there.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, A64Pilot said:

I’ve considered the hole myself, but you could damage the seal, so I think if you do drill a hole be careful to chamfer / deburr the hole and you should be fine.

I’ve considered the clamp lock collar for my engine hoist too as I use it to lift the nose, I need to do something there.

There is no seal in the top of the cylinder to damage. It’s a single acting cylinder.

[Pinecone]

Those things look dangerous.

It looks like they use thin wall conduit, which is NOT structural.  And they flatten and bend the ends, which has NO strength or stability.

[Z W]

The steel tube side bracing on the Alpha jacks looks like thin wall conduit in photos, but is not.  I would guess it's 1/8" wall galvanized pipe and is pretty stout.  In case anyone was going to build their own, using thin wall conduit.

[Pinecone]

Still, flattening and bending does NOT make for strength.

[67 m20F chump]

https://www.csobeech.com/floor-jack.html

The one by Russell S is what I made.  It’s the second example on that link.  

[67 m20F chump]

Here is a hint for builders.  When you cut the feet save a chunk of that 3/8 scrap and put it under the center where the jack goes.  It makes a small gap under the ram that helps when the floor isn’t level.  After you weld one side remove the 3/8 scrap.  I have made about 8 for friends over the years and so far everyone is happy.

[A64Pilot]

21 hours ago, M20Doc said:

There is no seal in the top of the cylinder to damage. It’s a single acting cylinder.

While I’ve not taken a chinese jack apart, on hydraulic cylinders there is usually a wiper seal whose job is to keep the cylinder free from dirt. There isn’t one here?

https://www.skf.com/us/products/industrial-seals/hydraulic-seals/wiper-seals

[Sabremech]

Is there a need for a set of wing jacks that can be broken down to ship as a rental? 
Thanks,

David

[A64Pilot]

17 hours ago, Sabremech said:

Is there a need for a set of wing jacks that can be broken down to ship as a rental? 
Thanks,

David

Weight is I think the issue with that, these stands I’m looking at fold up, but I suspect will still be so heavy shipping would be expensive.

Having said that it’s supposed to arrive today, Amazon shipped the thing via Fed-ex.

Give me a day or two and I should at least know if it’s viable or not, I already bought a little 2 ton bottle jack that will of course do the lifting.

I expect cost wise for one to be maybe $100 or so?

[carusoam]

Always be on the look out for some form of locking collar or other locking mechanism…

It can be really disappointing when a Mooney falls off the jacks…

it has happened to a few long standing MSers around here.

There are pics of wing holes and bent props.

Think and then review your work…

Actively Avoid the sad story.

Best regards,

-a-

 

[A64Pilot]

OK it’s put together and it works, a few caveats of course.

First I used the stand @rickseeman recommended, not the original I looked at, his fit better and besides was cheaper.

Second the threaded rod portion as your moving it, it’s length is the limit that you can jack up, so you have to have it fully screwed down and then using the sliding tube portion of the jack adjust it so it just fits under the wing with the screw portion fully down.

There is enough lift for a Mooney, but this may not work for an Oleo strut airplane, if we had a longer screw portion, ideally 7” longer that would be perfect.

Second there is a “window” on the adjustable sliding tube, when the bottom of the threaded portion is in that window, that’s it, you should stop jacking up or there won’t be enough of the threaded portion sticking into the pipe to be safe.

I bought an 18” portion of 1.25 “ galvanized pipe and cut it into two 7” pieces, one for each jack, on one end I welded on a thick fender washer for the jack to push against and I then welded it 100% around to the threaded rod portion of the jack, initially I didn’t weld it, but as I’m jacking so the threaded rod is up high in the tube, I wanted the additional security of 7” more pipe still sticking into the jack stand and feel that 100% weld out is justified, of course real thick tubing would be much better than galvanized  plumbing pipe, if you weld galvanized, be sure you have good ventilation as the gas burning zinc gives off apparently isn’t healthy.

OK you get this thing and the first thing you see is there is a cap on the bottom acting as a stop for the legs that fold, it’s screwed on with an internal wrenching bolt, remove it, then you see a washer in the tube with three spot wells, that’s what the cap screws to, drill out the three spot wells, then drive it out the bottom. You can weld the portion that slides up and down to fold, or what I did was drill a hole through the tube and the clamp screw screws through the tube, securing the ring that slides up and down, so it can still fold but it’s held secure.

If you have one in your hand all this will make sense.

Using a hacksaw or band saw cut off the V on the end of the screw, keeping all the length you can of the screw, the screw is solid steel, so take a 1/2” bit and drill into the sawed off part to center the jack point.

To jack the airplane up, position the jack stand under the airplane with the screw fully screwed in, then simply put the jack under the center of the stand and start jacking, as the airplane is lifted keep the barbell looking locking ring tightened so if the jack fails the aircraft can’t fall. Watch the jack stand legs, for some reason one may not be carrying its share of the weight, the BFH is to make an impact adjustment so that all three legs are carrying the load, check that every inch or two.

Once fully lifted I take the load off of the jack, but keep it there just in case. Your not getting it out anyway as the piston won’t collapse without weight on it

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B09Z367HM5?ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details&th=1

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07WTKXP1V?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details

Personally I think it’s more secure than most aircraft jacks and as it doesn’t rely on hydraulics to hold the airplane up, just to lift it, and even then if you keep moving the lock down even if the jack blew nothing bad would happen, the airplane would drop the 1/4” or so that you had the lock up.

The little jack just barely fits under the stand, but it does fit. Whole thing took less than an hour to put together. The down side is your limited by the length of the screw portion how much you can raise it as a jack. Ideal would be about an 18” screw with lock ring that would give you over a foot of lift.

 

[rickseeman]

I like it. I too can't trust a jacks hydraulics to hold an airplane up. Or a collar with a set screw on a pipe. I trust threads. Job well done.

[PT20J]

I like it. 

It looks like the stand is quit a bit cheaper if you buy it directly from Vevor

 https://www.vevor.com/roller-head-pipe-stand-c_10836/pipe-stand-fold-a-jack-v-head-pipe-capacity-12-height-24-42-2500-lb-steel-p_010756516367

[John Mininger]

Here's a "For What It's Worth.

I had a rather unpleasant after hour flat tire experience about a year ago. Since then, I've done some things that will make it easier to jack the plane next time something like that happens.

I was somewhat intrigued by the jack that @A64Pilot linked to on the beginning of this string. So, I ordered a 2-ton version of the jack. I figured if it didn't work for the Mooney, I could always use it for other jacking projects. The only thing I did to the jack was drill an indent with a 9/16 drill for the jack point to fit into. Amazon.com: Powerbuilt 2 Ton UniJack Combination Hydraulic Bottle Jack / Jackstand in 1 Unit, Compact, Portable, Wide Base, for Unibody Sedans, CUVs, SUVs, Cars, - 620470 : Automotive 

I had made up some heavy plywood boxes, with a 2x4 in the center after my last flat tire experience. And I also installed the combination stainless tie-down/jack point kits that LASAR sells. STAINLESS STEEL TIE DOWN/JACK POINT COMBO - SS TIE DOWN WING — LASAR

It works well. Below are pics:

 

 

[Fly Boomer]

6 hours ago, John Mininger said:

I had made up some heavy plywood boxes, with a 2x4 in the center after my last flat tire experience. And I also installed the combination stainless tie-down/jack point kits that LASAR sells. STAINLESS STEEL TIE DOWN/JACK POINT COMBO - SS TIE DOWN WING — LASAR

It works well. Below are pics:

I wonder if that box and jack would still fit under the wing if the tire were flat, sitting on soft ground?

[Mufflerbearing]

On 4/27/2023 at 12:29 PM, rickseeman said:

Thank you. Does the nose use the same item?

On the Ovations there is a jack interface on the left side of the nose of the airplane by the front wheel well.  The dimple on the jack stand will work at this jack point as well.

[Mufflerbearing]

On 4/27/2023 at 12:29 PM, rickseeman said:

Thank you. Does the nose use the same item?

On the Ovations there is a jack interface on the left side of the nose of the airplane by the front wheel well.  The dimple on the jack stand will work at this jack point as well.

[A64Pilot]

On 5/15/2023 at 5:01 PM, Fly Boomer said:

I wonder if that box and jack would still fit under the wing if the tire were flat, sitting on soft ground?

Not sure about the box jack, but I’m certain the jack stand I used would not, it’s too tall.

But I’m also nearly certain that most manufactured “aircraft” jacks would not either. The ones I’ve been borrowing which are either jack house jacks or a copy wouldn’t, they fully collapsed only have an inch or so clearance.

I guess one could argue that you could dig a hole for the jack though

In that instance, soft ground and flat tire I believe you would need a piece of plywood or similar to keep any jack from sinking in and use a bottle jack with a piece of pipe stuck in the knuckle of the gear itself and not jack on the wing.

The box looks neat to me, I was thinking with a cushion you could use one for a mechanics stool. I have one on wheels that’s rolled out from under me more than once, the box wouldn’t roll away, or you could flip the box and use them for storage. I’m just not a good woodworker, I would never have thought of a box.

I didn’t think of the stand either, I stole that idea from someone here who had some I believe boat jack stands modified to do the same thing.

I think @FlyingDude did, but I’m not certain