At Spruce Creek right now....

[Jim Peace]

Guys I saw this happen....crazy is all I have to say...

Please check your RPM's,  MP and oil pressure during takeoff roll...if you are not making power and having to scrape the tail to get airborne reject reject reject...

I helped pull the pilot out....he was uninjured...few scrapes...his wife stayed in the plane until medics came for a back injury....

Standby for an increase in premiums....

[N201MKTurbo]

Wow, glad everyone is ok.

[KB4]

Did Piper include wings? And something to hold them to the fuselage? My goodness, looks more like a submersible now. 

[rickseeman]

The thing was never going to takeoff with no wings. Hopefully wifey is ok.

[SoccerCA]

Hopefully they are all going to be ok.

[ArtVandelay]

Did Piper include wings? And something to hold them to the fuselage? My goodness, looks more like a submersible now. 

I’m guessing they flew between a pair of trees. An excellent strategy if there’s no open area, the trees/wings absorb much of the energy and the wings and fuel is left behind you.

[RoundTwo]

Glad to hear everyone is ok. Props to the pilot for keeping the cockpit intact. Unfortunately,I don’t think that’s going to buff out.

R2

[Jim Peace]

52 minutes ago, ArtVandelay said:

I’m guessing they flew between a pair of trees. An excellent strategy if there’s no open area,

They were so slow when airborne I do not think he could steer it one way or another....divine intervention

[Jim Peace]

1 hour ago, KB4 said:

Did Piper include wings? And something to hold them to the fuselage? My goodness, looks more like a submersible now. 

The hot plate on the windscreen will probably disappear tonight.....worth more than all the rest...

[A64Pilot]

Had a friend crash a G-10 thrush between two large Oak trees, hopper and engine as they were most of the mass kept going, pilot undid his belts stood up and walked straight out, the instrument panel attaches to the hopper, everything forward of his seat even the windshield was 50 ft or so in front of the rest.

Very few reject a takeoff, for some reason we are wired to try to nurse a sick one off of the ground. Before I moved here two extraordinarily experienced pilots tried to get a bonanza off the ground, they both perished in the fire, witnesses said they could see the pilot moving around trying to get out. I believe they were leaned out as the accident report said the mixture was partially pulled back. Both I believe were 10,000 hours ATP’s etc.

[Canadian Gal]

Glad they are alive.

What a mess.

[201Steve]

1 hour ago, A64Pilot said:

Had a friend crash a G-10 thrush between two large Oak trees, hopper and engine as they were most of the mass kept going, pilot undid his belts stood up and walked straight out, the instrument panel attaches to the hopper, everything forward of his seat even the windshield was 50 ft or so in front of the rest.

Very few reject a takeoff, for some reason we are wired to try to nurse a sick one off of the ground. Before I moved here two extraordinarily experienced pilots tried to get a bonanza off the ground, they both perished in the fire, witnesses said they could see the pilot moving around trying to get out. I believe they were leaned out as the accident report said the mixture was partially pulled back. Both I believe were 10,000 hours ATP’s etc.

Great reason to lean so hard you stall out before you can go anywhere. 

[A64Pilot]

53 minutes ago, 201Steve said:

Great reason to lean so hard you stall out before you can go anywhere. 

That’s exactly what I do lean so much that 1500 is all she will pull, also helps keep me out of that 1500 -2000 RPM avoid range that I have.

‘Then I look for 19 GPH as soon as I get to full throttle

I need 1400 to pull a hill to get to the runway

You can never hurt a motor by over leaning, only by not leaning enough.

[Pinecone]

16 hours ago, RoundTwo said:

Glad to hear everyone is ok. Props to the pilot for keeping the cockpit intact. Unfortunately,I don’t think that’s going to buff out.

R2

Nope, will need a couple of rolls of duct tape to fix that.

[carusoam]

Yikes!

+1 for checking three things before going too quick….

• MP
• RPM
• FF

If you have all three, there is a good chance it is developing full power….

Best regards,

-a-

[Fly Boomer]

On 2/4/2023 at 3:13 AM, carusoam said:

Yikes!

+1 for checking three things before going too quick….

• MP
• RPM
• FF

If you have all three, there is a good chance it is developing full power….

Best regards,

-a-

I like it!  Three knobs, and three gages.

[Jim Peace]

also another good idea, although I do not figure it out as much in detail as others is to have an idea of when "in distance", you should have enough speed to be rotating...

That guy was more than halfway down the runway, over 2000 feet dragging the tail and still trying to pull it off....at some point you need to have a knock it off point...

Maybe I will start doing that....

[Fly Boomer]

28 minutes ago, Jim Peace said:

at some point you need to have a knock it off point..

There should be a “knock it off” chart in the POH.

[Jerry 5TJ]

When I operated out of a 2000’ strip (CA35) I had a go/no go point pre-established:  If not at >50 knots when abeam of the compass rose, abort the takeoff.  That pre-set test prevents (some of) the decision delay. 

[MooneyMitch]

No doubt the pilot is beating himself up, knowing what a horrible decision he made that nearly caused tragedy for himself and his passengers.

Speed and flight can be very unforgiving.  It’s possible we forget these things as we travel in this fast world we live in.

Wishing a full complete recovery for these folks. 

[Jim Peace]

On 2/5/2023 at 2:06 PM, Fly Boomer said:

There should be a “knock it off” chart in the POH.

yeah my point is to know what land marks are right at 1000 feet 1200 feet etc...if not close to rotating by that point then something is up...I fly a ton and even I get lazy with that...

[Mooney in Oz]

10 hours ago, Jerry 5TJ said:

When I operated out of a 2000’ strip (CA35) I had a go/no go point pre-established:  If not at >50 knots when abeam of the compass rose, abort the takeoff.  That pre-set test prevents (some of) the decision delay. 

Hello Jerry.

Can you please elaborate on ‘when abeam of the compass rose’ in a takeoff scenario. I try and use the 50/70 method, which reaches a speed of at least 44 kias at the half way point of any runway (in a J). I actually learnt that on this forum.

[carusoam]

8 minutes ago, Mooney in Oz said:

Hello Jerry.

Can you please elaborate on ‘when abeam of the compass rose’ in a takeoff scenario. I try and use the 50/70 method, which reaches a speed of at least 44 kias at the half way point of the runway (in a J). I actually learnt that on this forum.

Hey Victor!

I assume Jerry was discussing a specific airport with his method…

The US doesn’t have a standardized location for a compass rose….

 

The 50/70 rule is good… but, can leave you a bit uncomfortable as the trees grow larger in the windshield…. 

One of my favorite airports was 2,200’ long…

Getting the 310hp engine in the O… assured being off the ground at the halfway point…. Instead of closer to the trees…

I probably suffer from arborphobia…  

PP thoughts only, standby for Jerry…

Best regards,

-a-

[Jerry 5TJ]

5 hours ago, Mooney in Oz said:

Hello Jerry.

Can you please elaborate on ‘when abeam of the compass rose’ in a takeoff scenario. I try and use the 50/70 method, which reaches a speed of at least 44 kias at the half way point of any runway (in a J). I actually learnt that on this forum.

The compass rose at CA35 happens to be a highly visible point early in the takeoff roll.  For me it served as a checkpoint for proper acceleration and from which it was still possible to stop on the remaining runway.  

Without an accelerate-stop performance chart in the AFM you must make your own estimates.  

[Fly Boomer]

6 hours ago, carusoam said:

The 50/70 rule is good… but, can leave you a bit uncomfortable as the trees grow larger in the windshield…

I have read about the 50/70 rule here on MooneySpace, but I don't really understand the logic.  It seems to me that it's going to take the same amount of (remaining) runway to stop my airplane regardless of the runway.  Airplane doesn't know how long the runway is but, depending on weight and environmental factors, it's going to take "X" feet to get stopped.  I'm generally a fan of "rules of thumb" but it seems like it would make more sense to say "If I'm not off the ground when I have "X" feet of runway remaining, abort".  Anthony, I'm not picking on you specifically, this is really a question for the group.