New to Mooney

[helidrvr]

I'm an ATP-H long time Part 135 helo pilot but low time instrument rated FW pilot. It's about time to purchase my first airplane, a Mooney naturally! I'm thinking of an earlier J, and btw, I've become accustomed to great avionics - some form of Garmin stack is going to be a requirement. As pretty much a FW newbie how would you recommend I proceed in my search to determine what's important and not so much? Is an aircraft broker a good use of my investment AMU, for example? I don't want to end up with a "bargain" that costs me after the fact.

[Planegary]

man that is a loaded question. i would suggest make a list of must haves and nice to haves as a start . maybe fly with some other people or rental planes to see about avionics and then with youre list you can begin to formulate what exactly you are looking for and how it must be equipped, remembering avionics and repairs are more expensive after the purchase than buying it already configured like you want it

[Greg Ellis]

Good advice from Planegary.  When I purchased my C model I was so hell bent on getting an airplane that I got one good piece of advice from another, at the time, Mooney owner and then jumped head first into the first plane I flew.  I fell in love with it so quick that I gave no other airplanes a chance (plus the price at the time was right and within my budget!!!).  I would not advise this at all.  I still own that airplane after 14 years or so and I absolutely love my C model and it has become part of my family but I have also invested a ton of money into it, well more than it is or was worth or what I could get for it, to make it what I want it to be.  All I have left to do is an autopilot, hoping that Garmin hurries up.

So make your lists first, find out what it is you are looking for, what 95% of your missions will need and then see what is out there that comes close or even exceeds your expectations.  You can look at www.controller.com and filter just J model Mooneys and it can give you an idea of what is available, generally, in the way of exterior, interior and avionics (just things to look at to see what on average is available).  It will give you a starting point to show what you may have to invest to meet your list or what you can really do without.

[carusoam]

Welcome aboard Hd,

Sounds like you have some great experience, and have done your homework...

There is so much going on in the avionics world lately... each day gets better...

Looking backwards a decade... WAAS technology was new, and those boxes are old, but still viable...
 

You have one thing very right...

Go Mooney!

Best regards,

-a-

[WaynePierce]

I would become familiar with https://www.gmaxamericanaircraft.com/

Jimmy Garrison normally has some on-hand but he also provides the opportunity to be put on his email list to receive updates on new planes he has coming in. That's the route I took and have been happy with the decisions.

 

[ArtVandelay]

You’ve already narrowed it down to a specific model so that’s good. When I was looking I would go to the various sites making notes on every J that was for sale. I saw which planes sold and which didn’t. After a couple months I can tell what’s a good deal and what’s not.

[Bob - S50]

Since you said you were looking for an early model J, for me personally, I would avoid the '77 model only because of the fuel selector placement.

[helidrvr]

Thanks, all, this gives me a good starting point. 

[Seth]

Welcome aboard!

The Mooney is a great aircraft. Though you can retrofit avionics, replace an engine/prop, do a paint job, interior, etc . . . it is more cost effective to buy a well maintained aircraft that has the majority of avionics you want in it that doing it yourself.

Also, there will ALWAYS be another airplane coming to market soon. Many of those high end maintanined airplanes that change hands never get to the web postings. Check with the known Mooney shops, here on Mooneyspace, and find out if any of these owners are slowing down, have menioned they may want to sell soon, have a life chaning event where it may make sense to sell the aiprlane, etc. Those are the amazing ones.

That said, there typically are some good ones for sale online at any time.

Also, as noted, you can do the work yourself, spend more in the long run, but have exactly what you want fresh.

I flew three Mooney's before I purchased my first - Two M20F's (one was a J clone) and an M20E. I went with the M20F. It was my plan to keep the airplane for 4-10 years and then get my "forever" airplane. It lasted 3 years. I sold it and purchased my M20J Missile 300 which I've had now for 9 years. I looked at the cost of updating what I wanted in the M20F and it made sense to sell the plane, get something faster that would be worth what I would have put into the F.

I have made updates to it every year I've owned it. 

When you first purchase your airplane - learn to fly it - then after you have taken care of any major issues, then think about what upgrades you may want to do. The modern avionics are indeed amazing, but the airplane flies just fine without them. I plan to further upgrade my avionics in the next few years.

Take care,

 

-Seth

[PT20J]

I've owned an 1978 M20J and currently own a 1994 M20J. Here are a few suggestions.

Familiarize yourself with the changes Mooney made over time. You don't want to buy a XX year model and then find out that a feature you really wanted was added in XX+1. I consider the 1977s prototypes (there's nothing wrong with them, but there are some differences that got ironed out later). After that, there are important changes along the way such as better landing gear actuators, better corrosion proofing, gross weight increases that are worth considering. I've attached a spreadsheet that is a good starting point. Also, I'd talk to Jimmy Garrison at GMax. He'll share his encyclopedic knowledge of Mooneys even if you're not buying one from him. Some of the long-time Mooney Service Centers can also let you know about any maintenance issue with various vintages: LASAR, DMax, Top Gun are my go to folks and are all very helpful.

I've always followed Mike Busch's advice: Buy the newest, lowest time, best cared for airframe you can find. It's the one thing you can't change.

Avionics are expensive to upgrade and you never get your money back. Try to buy something with avionics that fit your mission and that you can live with for awhile. After you get used to the setup, you may discover that some of your wants are not truly needs and you can upgrade only what you truly need.

I would not worry about the interior. While it is possible to spend a small fortune on interiors, it's also possible to get a very nice looking replacement for a very reasonable price -- especially if you do some or all of the tear out and installation yourself.

Paint is expensive, but it's only a cosmetic issue unless there is a corrosion problem in which case you wouldn't buy it anyway.

Everyone looks at the engine and prop time because they are expensive. But I always worry about airplanes for sale with newly overhauled or low-time engines. Did the owner spend the money to do a really good overhaul just before sale, or did they take the cheapest route they could find?  I would much rather buy a high-time engine (appropriately discounted) than a low-time engine with a questionable overhaul. You may get years of service from the high time engine after which you have complete control over the quality of the replacement. 

Good hunting,

Skip

201hist.xls

[helidrvr]

Guys, great advice and a lot of things I wasn't aware of or haven't considered.  That spreadsheet has a lot of info, thanks for that.  I'm currently overseas, looking fwd to returning stateside for some time off to start my search in earnest.

Rick

[LANCECASPER]

On 9/2/2020 at 7:33 AM, helidrvr said:

I'm an ATP-H long time Part 135 helo pilot but low time instrument rated FW pilot. It's about time to purchase my first airplane, a Mooney naturally! I'm thinking of an earlier J, and btw, I've become accustomed to great avionics - some form of Garmin stack is going to be a requirement. As pretty much a FW newbie how would you recommend I proceed in my search to determine what's important and not so much? Is an aircraft broker a good use of my investment AMU, for example? I don't want to end up with a "bargain" that costs me after the fact.

The Mooney announcement this week and then the follow-up articles indicate that the Mooney 205 J model (28v) may be in line for some of the upgrades Mooney is talking about. So if your J is going to be a long term airplane I would get a 205 before everyone realizes this, which of course they now all do because of this post . . lol.

[ZuluZulu]

1 hour ago, LANCECASPER said:

The Mooney announcement this week and then the follow-up articles indicate that the Mooney 205 J model (28v) may be in line for some of the upgrades Mooney is talking about. So if your J is going to be a long term airplane I would get a 205 before everyone realizes this, which of course they now all do because of this post . . lol.

So this is only about extending the existing 160 lb gross weight increase to more serial numbers, or raising the 2900 MGTOW for airplanes that already have it?