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Adhesive removal

0TreeLemur
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0TreeLemur Grand Master

0TreeLemur

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According to the logs, the black foam insulation that was installed in our bird by a Texas-based MSC in 2006 as part of complying with SB208-B has given up the ghost.  See the photo- I scraped it a bit when removing the back seat.  This black stuff has lost all mechanical strength and the foil facing is falling off.   Slight friction causes little black residue spots to fall to the floor.   It needs replacing.

We plan using the soundproofing/insulation suggested by @Skates97 from Aircraft Spruce.  The stuff in our a/c was installed with some kind of gritty contact adhesive that has the dried character similar to that of chalky dried wallpaper paste.   Where it got on the tubular frame, you can break it off like chalk with some effort.     Seems kind of strange to me that this stuff was used as an adhesive.   Anybody know what it is and if any chemical concoction can dissolve it?  I don't want to use too much mechanical effort because the darn aluminum skin is so thin.  Thanks for reading.

bad_insulation.jpg

Rwsavory Mentor

Rwsavory

Posted
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3M Adhesive Remover, 3M General Purpose Adhesive Cleaner or just regular Xylene from the hardware store should do the trick.  For that quantity of stuff to remove, use plenty of ventilation and consider wearing the appropriate respirator.

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Mufflerbearing Rising Star

Mufflerbearing

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I have found the 3M Adhesive cleaner to be an awesome cleaner that does not affect paint.  We use it for removal of clag tire hits on the race cars.  

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Yetti Grand Master

Yetti

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Can try starting with Mineral Spirits or Lacquer Thinner and then move up to the stronger stuff.   Stainless wire brush.   Don't use steel wool or steel brushes.

0TreeLemur Grand Master

0TreeLemur

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3 minutes ago, Yetti said:

Can try starting with Mineral Spirits or Lacquer Thinner and then move up to the stronger stuff.   Stainless wire brush.   Don't use steel wool or steel brushes.

How about a brass brush?   I've got one of those.

I think the key here is soft metal so as to not remove any of the aluminum skin??   Is stainless soft enough?   Just curious.  Thanks @Yetti

Yetti Grand Master

Yetti

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Posted
1 minute ago, Fred₂O said:

How about a brass brush?   I've got one of those.

I think the key here is soft metal so as to not remove any of the aluminum skin??   Is stainless soft enough?   Just curious.  Thanks @Yetti

They use stainless brushes to prep aluminum for welding.....   YMMV with brass....    Let the cleaner soak and do the work and you may be able to use a nylon brush

0TreeLemur Grand Master

0TreeLemur

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I went to the hangar after work and tried mineral spirits.   Negative effect.   Even after soaking, and with the brass brush.  It is going to take a stronger solvent.  I'll look into ordering some of the 3M adhesive remover.    This photo shows what I'm up against.  This stuff has the character of plaster infused wallpaper paste.  Dried, it is slightly gritty, like it has some kind of aggregate.  In thicker regions it fractures like plaster.   This was installed by a MSC in 2006.   Removing it looks to be a major PITA.  Oh- the black stuff is the backing of the old black foam that I removed.

rhs_panel.JPEG

cliffy Grand Master

cliffy

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No brush made of any steel on Alclad aluminum. Alclad (which is what our planes are made of) has a layer of pure aluminum on the surface for corrosion control. Scratching it with any steel brush is a big problem. I once watched as a guy stripped his 310 and used coarse steel wool putting deep scratches in the surface that he had to fill and sand down before he could paint. Ruined the airplane. 

Maybe your "problem" with removal is why I elected to inspect according to the SB but continue to use the fiberglass insulation. If there are no leaks there is no problem with the old stuff.  I have no leaks and NO rust anywhere on the tubing! 

Shields up, let the photon torpedoes fly! 

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0TreeLemur Grand Master

0TreeLemur

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8 hours ago, cliffy said:

Maybe your "problem" with removal is why I elected to inspect according to the SB but continue to use the fiberglass insulation. If there are no leaks there is no problem with the old stuff.  I have no leaks and NO rust anywhere on the tubing!

Thanks for the heads up regarding steel brushes and AL.   Much appreciated.

SB208-B was done on this a/c in 2006, over 10 years before I bought her, so I can't speculate about that.  I'm just trying to do the right thing.  The existing insulation/soundproofing has lost its wherewithall.

BTW- N. AZ is a great place to live if you want to avoid corrosion.

cliffy Grand Master

cliffy

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I'm lucky in that this airplane was taken care of by the previous owner and I've had it over 15 years, watching for corrosion all the time. I had a Cessna 140 for 20 years that someone had put something black down inside the fuselage as a sound deadener that I was never able to get removed no matter what I tried. 

Your persistence in trying to do the right thing here is commendable.  Many would just give up. Keep up the good work. You'll be glad you did in the end. 

Just had a thought- aircraft paint stripper?  Might be worth a try. 

hypertech Proficient

hypertech

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If that doesn't work, maybe try the Peerco 321 that knots2u sells for door seal removal.  It works really well on that and since we don't know what this is, maybe it'll be compatible.  

0TreeLemur Grand Master

0TreeLemur

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I've got some of that stuff- we used it when we changed the door seal earlier this year.    It also works on the class-B polysulfide window sealant.  I'll give it a try- won't take long.

  • 3 weeks later...
MinneMooney Collaborator

MinneMooney

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The MEK substitute is 100% Ethyl Acetate and the primary ingredient (60-80%) in the 3M product is Methyl Acetate. If the 3M product does do the job, then the MEK substitute should work too, since methyl and ethyl acetate have similar solvent properties. Be careful to eliminate any sources of combustion and use good ventilation since these are both highly flammable. I would pick the cheapest one. For that matter, straight MEK should work too and is typically an even stronger solvent than either of the 2 acetates. It’s just not as friendly from an EHS perspective.

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N201MKTurbo Grand Master

N201MKTurbo

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It just takes elbow grease and perseverance. Try all the solvents and see what works best. Don't forger soap and water, it will surprise you some times.

Guest

Guest

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I’ve seen plain old Mil H 5606 hydraulic oil dissolve glue quite well.

Clarence

Shadrach Grand Master

Shadrach

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Posted (edited)
On 5/16/2019 at 6:45 PM, Fred₂O said:

How about a brass brush?   I've got one of those.

I think the key here is soft metal so as to not remove any of the aluminum skin??   Is stainless soft enough?   Just curious.  Thanks @Yetti

brass or steel will compromise the alclad coating on the skin. Stick with solvents. Even non maring scotch brite may damage the finish.

Edited by Shadrach
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0TreeLemur Grand Master

0TreeLemur

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Now that summer is here in full force, it is too hot to work in the hangar during waking hours.    I'll report back on progress in Sept.

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