I should really think about giving up this aviation thing

[PMcClure]

I "know" a guy who has done most of these things and still flies. It's the pilots that don't recognize their mistakes that you really need to worry about. Keep practicing and keep learning. Paul 

[steingar]

12 hours ago, Alan Fox said:

Not sure why everyone has missed the obvious , but how recent have you done training with an instructor ,  Unfortunately the first victim of complacency seems to be training , A good instructor will point out your deficiencies , and suggest remedies for them......Not going to tell you not to stop flying , Don't know you , never flew with you , and you may be spot on with the decision to stop flying , But if you decide to continue flying , sounds like you should continue to do training ,     Good luck , whatever you decide.....

I cannot disagree at all.  I do dual with a CFI whenever I can (only one in my metropolis who can fly a Mooney). Heck, the flight where I mucked up everything was mostly for currency.

I suppose I should just get off my duff and put a new page in my checklist about what to do if you're just coming around and not doing a run-up.  But that takes work...

[Bob - S50]

23 minutes ago, steingar said:

I suppose I should just get off my duff and put a new page in my checklist about what to do if you're just coming around and not doing a run-up.  But that takes work...

Not necessarily.  We have a few checklists posted on the panel.  I can still run the entire 'after start' and 'before takeoff' checklist even if I've just taxied back from a landing to takeoff again.  I can read all the items but only perform those that need to be done again.  Or get a flow.  I use 1-2-3-4 before takeoff.  1 on the floor (fuel tank). 2 on the pedestal (trim and flaps). 3 on the power quadrant (cowl flaps, mixture, prop).  4 switches - as needed (lights, pitot heat, boost pump, elevator trim).  When I land it's 4-3-2-1.

Hey, I've taxied the wrong way in a DC9 so don't beat yourself up!

[Cruiser]

47 minutes ago, steingar said:

I cannot disagree at all.  I do dual with a CFI whenever I can (only one in my metropolis who cannily a Mooney). Heck, the flight where I mucked up everything was mostly for currency.

I suppose I should just get off my duff and put a new page in my checklist about what to do if you're just coming around and not doing a run-up.  But that takes work...

Perhaps you could plan your weekly flights as a mission. Each one designed to focus on a new element of the flight that you will practice. You can schedule a trip to meet a different instructor and take a quick refresher flight with someone new. There are a couple of Mooney instructors nearby. Mike Stretanski is at Delaware (KDLZ) and Jeff Schnabel is at Lunken (KLUK) both would be glad to fly with you I am sure.

[steingar]

4 hours ago, Cruiser said:

Perhaps you could plan your weekly flights as a mission. Each one designed to focus on a new element of the flight that you will practice. You can schedule a trip to meet a different instructor and take a quick refresher flight with someone new. There are a couple of Mooney instructors nearby. Mike Stretanski is at Delaware (KDLZ) and Jeff Schnabel is at Lunken (KLUK) both would be glad to fly with you I am sure.

Mike is the main one I fly with.  He's a good pal.  In fact, I want to teach him to  land my Mooney, and take up one of my buddies who I want as a partner!  I fly every weekend with good weather.  I always have a  mission, either to go somewhere or to practice some aspect of currency.  Last weekend it was landings.

[TheTurtle]

well after pssshhhawing this thread I had the single worst day of flying since training.

1. no flaps take off by accident

2. Didnt bring the gear up until 5 miles from the airport...  Got out of my rhythm when I noticed I didnt have any flaps in on take off and then spaced it.

3.  Terrible landing at destination.  Hardest landing I've had in the mooney.  Not a back breaker but real ugly.

----

4. Take prospective mooney owner up and realized after I got airborne I didnt cycle the prop on runup.

5. Busted the san diego bravo.  Fortunately the controller was cool and let it slide.  (I have to go back and check, I would have sworn I was under the shelf)

I did grease the landing coming back in though!!   Making us mooney pilots look good for the new guy.

---

6.  Heading back home no takeoff flaps AGAIN!!!  WTF.  Already at 60ish MPH and shoved in 2 pumps and she jumped into the air, that was kind of amusing..

7.  Turning onto taxiway back home and realize prop is still out and mixture isnt full rich, glad I at least did the U in GUMPS...

So anybody can have a bad day.  Most of my screwups were bad checklist usage.  Bad Turtle.  no cookies for you.

Edited August 31, 2017 by TheTurtle

[Mooneymite]

1 minute ago, TheTurtle said:

So anybody can have a bad day.  

So true!

[Hank]

So you found out that no flap takeoffs aren't a problem. I do them routinely, except when loaded near gross. But I don't rotate at 60 mph, I target 70 . . .

My clue to check the gear is the abysmal climb rate with them down.

But we all have off days. Mine hit Saturday after flying, can't find my freakin' data card I took out to update!  

[amillet]

Check the pocket of your other jackets. That's where I found mine after it disappeared for 3 weeks

[steingar]

9 hours ago, TheTurtle said:

Bad Turtle.  no cookies for you.

My turtle doesn't eat cookies, she eats lettuce.  I've done no-flap takeoffs, but I really don't think of that as a big deal.  Airplane works just fine.  I'm actually thinking about making that standard.  If they aren't deployed on takeoff they don't have to be neutralized on climb out.  One less thing to do during a busy time.

[Jeff_S]

Having read through this thread, the common foibles seem to be consistent. I've done them all at one time or another. The one activity that seems for me to lead to the most forgetfulness is any sort of landing followed by immediate takeoff. That's where you forget to reset trim, flaps, etc. because your thought process hasn't switched from "flying" to "ground ops" as much and you're likely to not follow the full checklist.

For some reason, I went through a phase where I kept forgetting to turn off the fuel pump after start-up. With the big Continental, the fuel pump is really just for starting or emergency purposes, so if you leave it on during taxi and takeoff the mixture is really rich. Funniest (to me!) time was when we are ten minutes into the flight, heading south out of ATL airspace when I noticed the fuel pump was still on. I had leaned mixture out to normal fuel flows, so when I finally noticed the pump my first reaction was to quickly shut it off. D'oh! Of course the engine almost died because I forgot to enrich the mixture first.  I knew what was going on but my wife nearly had a heart attack. (Sidebar...be careful when you say "Whoops!" as pilot-in-command.)

So I'm with that crowd that says "don't sweat it" and just keep practicing. To quote Viper from Top Gun, "a good pilot is compelled to evaluate what's happened, so he can apply what he's learned."

[mike_elliott]

2 hours ago, Jeff_S said:

a good pilot is compelled to evaluate what's happened, so he can apply what he's learned."

something I do and suggest the guys I instruct also do, is keep a diary. Debrief after each flight and note what you did right, what you did wrong and why. Reviewing it often helps keep one fresh mentally, where most errors originate. 

[Mooneymite]

4 minutes ago, mike_elliott said:

something I do and suggest the guys I instruct also do, is keep a diary. Debrief after each flight and note what you did right, what you did wrong and why.

I prefer to destroy all evidence.  

[HRM]

I just don't have the energy to enumerate all of the pilot screw-ups I have committed, but I do hope I have learned from each. Frankly, it is time for you to spend some time with an instructor. I find it relaxing and renewing and I frankly don't care how a good a pilot a guy thinks he is, we all need to go back to school on occasion just to refresh without the burden of distractions. Think about it, when you have an instructor in the left seat you tend to concentrate on flying the airplane--that's the whole idea.

[StevenL757]

On 8/28/2017 at 2:43 PM, TonyK said:

2 Our Fathers, 2 Hail Mary's and a trip around the pattern for you.  Go in peace.

Absolutely.  Moose - it won't be your last bad day, and I sincerely hope your remark about giving up flying is made out of frustration and has no merit whatsoever.  :-)

Steve

[peevee]

I have thought the same, more for sanity and financial reasons.

[Danb]

I felt that way a couple yrs ago was going to quit or start flying and trying more, real glad I decided the flying route.

[steingar]

After filling the Mooney up with gas the other day I thought the takeoff roll was going a bit long.  I figured it was 300 pounds of extra weight.  Nah, no flaps (I'd pumped them, but the little button that lets them come back up was pulled out).  Like I said, that one I really don't worry about, I'll be lots of guys take off without them.  I think I'll still use them, I like getting off 10mph slower, gives me more time before the forces on the Johnson bar become unmanageable.

My biggest goof was on startup.  I had the hardest time starting the airplane.  Could have been its long time off and the cold morning, and I didn't think a thing about it until during my runup I found the carb heat was already on!  I'd mistakenly turned it on instead of the cabin heat.  First flight in the cold in a long time.

But all my landings were good.  I'm not certain if the one on the 12K foot runway was short, but it certainly was on the centerline.  Big centerline.  Departed the runway on the first turnout on the other two runways.

Unfortunately I did give a controller cause to say "your other left".  Sometimes I hate being me.

[Shadrach]

On 8/28/2017 at 4:46 PM, INA201 said:

Anyone take off on one mag? Not me of course, just asking. I bet if you did though you would wonder why the plane won't climb. You might also do a nice and easy 180 back to the airport to figure out why it feels like DA is 15,000 feet.

I think you are over estimating the performance loss by quite a bit. Although if your engine has been retimed to 20BTDC you've already taken a hit in climb performance.  Some of the lost performance could be recaptured with proper leaning. Going from a dual ignition to single would certainly cost some power, but not the 45-50% you're suggesting.

[Shadrach]

On 8/28/2017 at 11:00 PM, Skates97 said:

I have taken off without the electric fuel pump on, forgot to reset to takeoff trim, forgot to set altimeter, forgot to set directional gyro before take off, lined up on the left runway instead of right once but tower questioned me on about a 2 mile final, and I'm sure a number of other things. I'm still a low time guy, around 175 hours total with about 115 of that in my Mooney over the last 9 months. I think what you need to do is slow down when you are on the ground and use your checklists religiously. In the air it is hard to "slow down" but that is when you have to plan ahead and get through your checklists a little early. In cruise review your descent checklist, once established in a descent review your landing checklist, etc... I have found that when I am complacent thinking "I'm good" and don't pay close attention to the checklists is when mistakes start happening. Verbalizing the checklists when I go through them is also a big help. 

Your electric fuel pump will last longer if you minimize its use.

[steingar]

1 hour ago, Shadrach said:

I think you are over estimating the performance loss by quite a bit. Although if your engine has been retimed to 20BTDC you've already taken a hit in climb performance.  Some of the lost performance could be recaptured with proper leaning. Going from a dual ignition to single would certainly cost some power, but not the 45-50% you're suggesting.

You wouldn’t notice the loss of a mag in flight. Ask me how I know.

[Shiny moose]

I have been turning aviation wrenches for a long time (30+ years), a good amount of hours (7K +)  many hours of dual given , lots of different aircraft, lots of weather,  single pilot and crew flying, and flown with many different people, some with less experience and some with much more than myself. One thing is common in all, everyone makes mistakes in aviation, and any pilot or mechanic that says they never have made a mistake hasn't flown enough or turned enough wrenches. The great part is we get to share these experiences with others, for entertainment, to help, or just for fun. That's it Fun, it's supposed to be fun. Live, learn, repeat!

Edited November 2, 2017 by Shiny moose
Addition

[Aviationinfo]

Steingar I would add to the above--- everybody has different requirements for maintaining their level of proficiency.  Some people can go longer than others without flying and still perform well, others (like myself) really need to fly at regular intervals.   The trick is to figure out what you need.  It sounds like you try to fly as often as you can.  I might suggest that you hit it hard for a short period (like a week?  Fly three times in a week) and then go back to whatever you were doing before.   A little concentrated flying might be all it takes.   Kudos to you for your level of awareness.

[Hank]

41 minutes ago, steingar said:

You wouldn’t notice the loss of a mag in flight. Ask me how I know.

She flew fine, straight and level, but I didn't have to climb. Was able to level off on descent while an airliner toured the area on a full GPS approach, too. What I noticed was weirdly high EGT readings--wait, that's hotter than peak, how can that be???

What I learned was to speak up before turning the key to Left and killing the engine . . . My wife was not happy!

[MARZ]

On 8/30/2017 at 10:21 PM, TheTurtle said:

 

So anybody can have a bad day.  Most of my screwups were bad checklist usage.  Bad Turtle.  no cookies for you.

Been there -

 

BTW noticed your tail number - I've got the littermate - serial number and N number both a difference of 4