Fuel tank repair

[ryoder]

The tank seaping is now my biggest priority and I want to choose between a couple of options.

I am in Zephyrhills Florida.

Option 1. Help my a&p reseal the tanks. I discussed this briefly but I can help him do some of the work reducing costs probably on the stripping portion.

Option 2. Drop it off at Mooney Mart in Sarasota and get a reseal for $3500 per tank. Are they still in business? They didn't answer any of my emails.

Option 3. Drop it off at wetwingologists for about the same cost as two.

Option 4. By the ON bladders for $6050 and help my a&p install them.

Option 5. Have a mooney service center install the bladders.

I am leaning toward option one due to cost but also like option five.

When the tanks are full and I leave the airplane sit for two days I have some seeping into the interior so this is now my biggest priority.

[Mooneymite]

When the tanks are full and I leave the airplane sit for two days I have some seeping into the interior so this is now my biggest priority.

Interior seeping is often easily fixed by tightening the fuel senders, or replacing their gaskets. Occassionally, the leak is caused by the short rubber fuel line connecting the tank pick-ups.

These are easily accessed under the interior side panels beside the front seats. Look for the blue stains.

[ryoder]

Great! The outside leaks are annoying and concerning but leaking inside is absolutely intolerable.

So I remove the side panels and it will be obvious where the sender is?

I'll look for pics online.

To replace the gaskets do you need to completely drain the tanks?

[ArtVandelay]

Interior seeping is often easily fixed by tightening the fuel senders, or replacing their gaskets. Occassionally, the leak is caused by the short rubber fuel line connecting the tank pick-ups.

These are easily accessed under the interior side panels beside the front seats. Look for the blue stains.

I had this done, the down side is the smell will be there long after the repair, it took months for it to go away

[Mooneymite]

Great! The outside leaks are annoying and concerning but leaking inside is absolutely intolerable.

So I remove the side panels and it will be obvious where the sender is?

I'll look for pics online.

To replace the gaskets do you need to completely drain the tanks?

Yes, the fuel line and senders are in the same general location. Removing the front seat makes access easier, but it isn't necessary.

Before changing those gaskets, try tightening.

If they have to be changed, the fuel level has to be lower than the bottom of the sender gasket.

[lahso]

I was in the same situation early this year. Had the gaskets replaced, which cut down on the smell, but eventually the leaking was too great. I ended up getting the O&N bladders installed by a MSC.

[Mooneymite]

I was in the same situation early this year. Had the gaskets replaced, which cut down on the smell, but eventually the leaking was too great. I ended up getting the O&N bladders installed by a MSC.

I also have bladders, but the sender gaskets and short fuel connection line are just as prone to leakage since they aren't a part of the bladders per se. These parts are probably replaced when the bladders are installed, but bladders won't prevent them from developing leaks.

Look around for the blue stains under the side panels. If you've had the fuel odor for awhile, the source will be fairly obvious.

[clh]

I too resealed the senders and had the tanks patched.  I ended up at Wetwingologists.  That was about 18 months ago and so far so good.

[N601RX]

For planes with bladders there will be 2 gaskets per sender.  One between the bladder and rib, and another between the rib and sender.  If I remember correctly the bladder install instructions recommends a light coat of PRC on the gaskets.

[neilpilot]

Yes, the fuel line and senders are in the same general location. Removing the front seat makes access easier, but it isn't necessary.

Before changing those gaskets, try tightening.

If they have to be changed, the fuel level has to be lower than the bottom of the sender gasket.

I've removed both senders for overhaul, didn't remove the front seats and don't think it would improve access greatly.  Start with the tank empty.  Then simply slide the front seat all the way forward, pull away interior panel and the sender is easily accessed.  Be sure to use a wrench on the sender post when removing the wire, to prevent damage to the sender.

[pinerunner]

For me it will be between option 1 (me and the A&P) and option 3 (Wetwingologists). I've been around airplanes most of my life, scraped a lot of paint, bucked a lot of rivets, and now have a chemistry degree. So sealing polymers with their two part mixtures and kind of nasty removal products don't scare me off. Don Maxwell has a great page where he describes leak finding using a vacuum cleaner to pull a SMALL negative pressure on the fuel compartment (multiply the inches to get the cross-sectional area in your fuel compartment and you should realize what a few extra pounds per square inch might do to your wing).  The mechanic who does my inspections told me I must be on drugs when I discussed it with him and now I think he's actually right. Aviation is like a drug to me and I'm almost as happy working on my plane as flying it.

 

If you count my hours researching it and then convincing my A and P and then if he charges me for HIS time reading up on it (I don't think most mechanics have done wet wing reseals) maybe Option 3 becomes cost effective.  Wetwingologists have a great reputation and if you mention them when you go to sell your Mooney some day I think it helps the plane move better.

 

I wouldn't go with bladders cause I'd rather have it the way Mooney made it in the first place. Having it sealed by a lesser known shop for less $$$ may be OK but could turn into a lot of aggravation; if you go that route try to go where someone else from Mooneyspace has had a good experience. 

 

Unless you're addicted to the fun of working on your own plane and have the mechanic to back you up I'd go with Option 3.

[Glenn]

Does anyone know if the sealant previously STCed by Midwest M20 can be easily stripped or repaired?  I had my "F" sealed about 10 years ago, and it is still good, but I am concerned that this process may now be orphaned.

[rbridges]

I would go to wetwingologist.  Hank had his done there and seems very pleased with the results.  If you go with bladders, I'd go to an MSC that knows how to do them.  There is some modification to the wing that I wouldn't want my IA doing.  Personally, I went with bladders but it was a matter of logistics more than anything else, and I'm very pleased with the results. 

[FloridaMan]

I believe that WeepNoMore did my tanks many years before I purchased it and they are still in great shape. If you get your tanks sealed, look at the thread on that recent C crash where Piloto explains issues with the fuel drains and tanks resealed by people who weren't exceptionally familiar with Mooney tank reseals. 

 

If I had to have my tanks resealed, I would consider the long range STC. 

[Hank]

Wet Wingologists did a great jib for me three years ago. He gives a 7-year warranty, and a discount for MAPA members. No more smell, no more drips on the floor.

[carusoam]

1) identify what is really leaking... Seals and rivets are easy fixes.

2) determine if it can be fixed.... Some sealant is too far gone, broken down and not worthy of repair.

3) decide if this plane is the one to hold onto... Some planes get put out to pasture at some point.

4) then decide reseal vs giant wing condom.

Several levels to consider...

Keep plane or not...

Reseal or bladder...

Who does the work...

You may be pleased to find out that seals leak and they are easy to repair...

You may be surprised that a newer Ovation may come with a leaky rivet or two...

Hopefully you don't have degrading tank sealant.

Good luck,

-a-

[HRM]

The tank seaping is now my biggest priority and I want to choose between a couple of options.

I am in Zephyrhills Florida.

Option 1. Help my a&p reseal the tanks. I discussed this briefly but I can help him do some of the work reducing costs probably on the stripping portion.

Option 2. Drop it off at Mooney Mart in Sarasota and get a reseal for $3500 per tank. Are they still in business? They didn't answer any of my emails.

Option 3. Drop it off at wetwingologists for about the same cost as two.

Option 4. By the ON bladders for $6050 and help my a&p install them.

Option 5. Have a mooney service center install the bladders.

I am leaning toward option one due to cost but also like option five.

When the tanks are full and I leave the airplane sit for two days I have some seeping into the interior so this is now my biggest priority.

 

At Mooney Summit II a week or so ago Paul Beck from weep no more gave a great talk on tank sealing issues. Be advised first that once you go bladders you cannot go back. Bladders are fine, but they have their own set of pros and cons that should be investigated thoroughly before making the jump.

 

As part of your due diligence in working through this, I would strongly recommend a call to Paul--he and Bruce Jaeger invented the automated system that cleans the old sealant off of the inside of a tank. The pictures are phenomenal.

[Mooneymite]

Uh, oh....do I sense this devolving into a re-seal/bladder thread?  

 

Oh, and someone referred to bladders as "condoms"?  Gee!  They go on the INSIDE of the tank.  Do we need a refresher phys-ed class here? 

[DrBill]

I had my bladders installed by O&N.  They gave me a ride to Scranton airport on the day I dropped it off and picked me up there a week later. For the price of a RT ticket it was worth having them do it right the first time.  Plus I got some great flying in up the Smokies.

BILL

[fantom]

They go on the INSIDE of the tank.  

 

But they protect the fluid from seeping out, and doing great damage. Plus they're a poor man's substitute for the real thing.

[Awful_Charlie]

How bad is your leak? Mine was fairly bad (see photo 4 in http://mooneyspace.com/topic/8437-pirep-weep-no-more/?p=91548) but two tubes of 1422 and a pint of 1002 fixed it

[ryoder]

[ryoder]

[ryoder]

These seeps on the belly are new. They showed up after I left a full tank of gas for two days. Previously I bought s tank and flew off some of it before putting it away for the day. Hopefully the belly leaks are related to the interior ones and can be fixed by a gasket and torquing the bolt down on the senders. After seeing this and some under the carpet I took it out to burn some gas off.

It might be getting worse as I stress the previously unused tank sealant that sat out in the heat with dry tanks for a year before I bought it.

[Wakeup]

Anyone have any problems with leaks around the wing fuel sumps (small rivets on each side)? I had a new fuel sump put in at my local FBO and they used the wrong fuel sump. Now I have a leak at the rivet. Thanks Troy