Auctioned Mooney at Oshkosh

[TWinter]

For those wondering what the auctioned plane looks like. The plane has a wrap on it now that will be removed and the plane will be painted whatever scheme the winning bidder wants. Did not think to get inside shots, but looks as you would expect from Mooney with modern glass. Still has overall Mooney in appearance touches. I got a chance to sit in it.. Very nice and congrats to the new owner.

[IndyTim]

It's a good thing it's a wrap, so it can come off.  That would not be to my taste.  However, I'm overjoyed to see a brand new Mooney (of any color) at Oshkosh.

[201er]

The problem is that after 4 years of not being available, when it sells at auction for ~$160,000 below price, that says that buyers don't think the plane is worth what the manufacturer expects for it. And that's the guy who wants it most badly. Others obviously valued it at even less, despite there being no new Mooneys available for several years and the museum/charitable cause attached to bidding on this first one. Or maybe everyone's just afraid that the first one came out screwed up cause they forgot how to build them and is indicative of nothing.

[aaronk25]

I thought after talking to several mooney reps that the factory seemed disconnected from what the market place desires. I certainly understand mooney is about speed, speed and speed and so am I but when asked about what is on the horizon the answer was basically sell what we got. Cirrus is ahead of the game and the non flyers/ wifes, who ever they are, love the large Cirrus cabin and the chute. I asked specifically if they had any plans to widen the cabin or rework it to include two doors and I got a blank stare and a canned response of "what can we do for you" slight eye roll. 201er asked a question about future plans for style and safety and the response was from the new owner "that is very important to mooney and we will always keep that in mind" or some other corny Bill Clinton walk around the question answer. I am glad that their back on line for various reasons, but these guys running it isn't what made Mooney great and doubt they will be the group to truly bring the next innovations.....but they got money.....hope it works but I was looking for more...

[mikesalman]

They claimed that they had 3 confirmed orders in the US and 10 orders in China. Then five minutes later they said they had confirmed orders for 14 Mooneys. Hmmm 3+10=14??? Ok if you say so.

But what really disappointed me was their booth. Nothing to buy no accessories no t-shirts, hats, key chains, for god sake were not asking for anything free (would be nice) but at least make us feel like were a part of something. This was my first visit to Oshkosh and Mooney was the main reason for my 11 hour drive from Memphis. Ok I'll shut up.

[M016576]

I like the bird / swoosh... Very nice

[Alan Fox]

To be fair , these guys are going to have to learn the customers , and the market.....The deep pockets may lead to improved products and better things to come....Its not happening overnight.....The fact that its happening at all is pretty amazing.....

[aviatoreb]

I think speed speed speed is a decent starting angle.  The Mooney Acclaim is unique in the world as it is the fastest single engine piston.  A certain number of people will want that because it is the most-est at something.  I would if I had the money.

 

That said, I think the quickest route to compete directly with Cirrus would be to add a parachute.  Wider cabin, two doors, and so forth would require a huge amount of engineering and create a different airplane that might be nice but I think a parachute would steal a certain noticeable fraction from Cirrus.

[Bob_Belville]

I'm scornful of a parachute on a real airplane and doubt it is of any real value except for emotional support for non-pilots. And The noise from one door seal is quite enough, thank you very much. Just sayin'.  

[1964-M20E]

I'm scornful of a parachute on a real airplane and doubt it is of any real value except for emotional support for non-pilots. And The noise from one door seal is quite enough, thank you very much. Just sayin'.  

Bob

 

I'm with you for the most part about the chute but the second door would be wonderful and would make the cabin feel much larger at least when entering and exiting the plane.

 

I still say they should also bring back a basic all manual J model at a reasonable price.  I know pipe dream but…..

[TWinter]

I'm very proud of Mooney. Glad to see them up and going. I did get a very strong vibe at the press conference that they were really going to try to promote the overseas and Chinese sales as priority number one. A few questions during public Q&A that were asked and obviously danced around, particularly Mike's question about any changes in future safety and design.

 

On a personal note I felt some separation from the new company owners and myself. I spoke with one of the new Chinese factory reps and asked who won the auction and what was the approximate winning bid?, It was just small talk about the auction in general and Mooneys future plans and progress?. His reply was, "Oh we can't give that information out until later after the press time", meanwhile maybe not two minutes later I overhear a gentleman asking the very same question to the Mooney CFO (I forgot his name, but he was an American gentleman and probably been with Mooney for a while). Without hesitation the CFO speaks out and told the guy, "Oh, it sold to so and so and the winning bid was $649K (or whatever it was), he went onto all the auction details and future plans. I was disappointed I was treated like a stranger and felt like I was just bothering the rep. I told him we were Mooney owners and  excited about the re-launch, honestly it appeared he really did not care who we were, where we were from or what we flew. During Q&A I would have liked to ask about support for current fleet, but felt I would not get a straight forward answer, besides the moment was about the delivery and "new production".

 

I still have nothing but love for our Mooney brand, but I' got the vibe the new focus will be on overseas sales market. I hope they show strong support for the current owners, not just overseas sales. I really wish I had my Mooney when the factory was up and going years ago at Kerrville with local support, but then again..I'm always about yester years and change comes hard for me. I guess I'll have to watch my Boots on the Ground DVD I bought at the Mooney booth.

 

Mitch, Jolie, Don and Jan Maxwell and all the others at the Mooney tent were great and it was great seeing everyone else. Just my .02 and take on the press release and delivery announcement.

[Seth]

Adding a door, though wonderful for access, will without doubt add weight, and eat up useful load - a trade off.

 

Also, I can't help but thinking about all the diesels announced at Oshkosh - one of the bigger ones mated to the the M20 as an STC or offered from the factory?  Now that could be a developmental step. 

 

-Seth

[Alan Fox]

I actually spent about 35 minutes speaking about the new diesel coming out with the Continental rep , as this is a converted car engine that I used to work on years ago , He was very receptive  to suggestions about maintence  and actually took the time to listen.......I was very Impressed....

[flyboy0681]

All of these pie in the sky new features (wider cabin? Another door?) are a giant waste of neurons. The airframe has been certificated for decades in its present form and I doubt they would go through the expense of another certification process.

 

My take on the whole resurrection of Mooney is the burgeoning need for pilots in China. Right now a lot of candidates are sent to the US for training (I've seen signs in Chinese at Deer Valley airport in Phoenix) and believe they are going to move that effort to Asia. Part of that training will require complex aircraft and that's where their purchase of Mooney comes in.

 

What I would like to see Mooney do is get back into the business of providing zero time refurbishments.

[aviatoreb]

Parachutes sell airplanes from my opinion. As a business move - not an aeronautical move - I recommend (in my humble no expert opinion) that mooney aircraft the company would be well served to offer a parachute.

[aviatoreb]

I would be very interested in a 300 hp diesel stc for my own airplane when I reach tbo / maybe conty should offer stc's?

[DonMuncy]

I am actually encouraged by the new Mooney management's attitude. I have seen too many new owners of companies come in telling of all the grandiose changes they are going to make, none of which actually occur.

Jerry Chen seems to be saying we are not going to change things until we have established ourselves, got production going and taken a long hard look at the market.

When I saw the changes they are making to the factory, it appeared to me that they are in this deal for the long haul, and not so much as making glitzy changes until they are justified.

[DaV8or]

About the only thing Mooney could do to make the M20 airframe more attractive in the market place is the parachute and then a corresponding gross weight increase. The parachute is a good idea and it does work. The only good argument against it is cost and weight.

 

What Mooney really needs is an all new airplane to compete. Loads of money for... ?? Not sure about the ROI in this day and age. It really does just cost way too much to build and support factory made airplanes.

 

If the Chinese bought Mooney to start pilot training in China, they bought the wrong company. The Mooney Acclaim and Ovation are terrible trainers IMO. They should have bought Piper. There's a company that is a complete flight school in a box, ready to go. I really hope the new owners of Mooney are smarter than that and have a better plan in mind.

 

Seriously, the factory needs to treat guys like us as royalty. They really need us. While they are busy trying desperately to sell one Acclaim a month to some Chinese businessman, we will be day in and day out buying replacement parts and keeping the cash flowing in. If they turn their backs on us and focus on the "Mooney Millionaire's Club" idea, they are doomed.

[tony]

Parachutes sell airplanes from my opinion. As a business move - not an aeronautical move - I recommend (in my humble no expert opinion) that mooney aircraft the company would be well served to offer a parachute.

 Parachutes are for aircraft that couldn't demonstrate a satisfactory spin recovery and are required for airworthiness.  Real airplanes don't have parachutes.

[bsnpilot69]

 Parachutes are for aircraft that couldn't demonstrate a satisfactory spin recovery and are required for airworthiness.  Real airplanes don't have parachutes.

The European JAA spun the Cirrus line in excess of 60 times, the planes recovered with normal spin inputs. Cirrus aircraft chose not to include normal spin recovery procedures in the POH as they felt the average pilot who is trained to do spins in trainers would have a better chance of recovery whether flying a cirrus or any other plane (or making it alive) using the parachute. 

[tony]

The parachute is standard equipment on their airframes.  It's not an option, so you have no choice but to get it; and then everyday ten years you have to repack the stupid thing at a cost of 10K just to maintain airworthiness.   Wonder why that is? 

[aviatoreb]

 Parachutes are for aircraft that couldn't demonstrate a satisfactory spin recovery and are required for airworthiness.  Real airplanes don't have parachutes.

 

No - parachutes are for customers and aircraft COMPANYs sell airplanes to customers.  Cirrus has proven that paying customers want parachutes.  That is where the profit is.

[201er]

No - parachutes are for customers and aircraft COMPANYs sell airplanes to customers.  Cirrus has proven that paying customers want parachutes.  That is where the profit is.

I think you meant wives of customers

[Bob_Belville]

I'd rather crash and burn than fly around with a parasol or training wheels or whatever you might call that thing. Orville and Wilbur lie embarrassed in their graves. 

[helitim]

The sellers of horse and buggies probably said the same thing when cars came along and look where we are now. Innovation and improvements are what helps keep us safe and the industry growing. No change equals stagnation and a slow death of any product line. Whether you like parachutes, two doors, Diesel engines or any other idea, new products are good for the entire industry.