How to make a 201 faster

[Tx_Aggie]

Four day weekends and crummy weather lead this Mooney pilot to lots of post searching and ideas!  Other than the rocket Missile conversion, what are other modern ways to make my 201 faster?

my searches have yielded the following:

- io-390 conversion, seems to yield maybe 5% higher cruise speed (vs 155 knots)

- lo presti cowling, 5-7 mph increase

- modern/ new paint/ wax coat

-could the cowling be paired with the 390 and double up on speed increases for a truly ~170 knot/ 200mph cruiser?

Any other ideas or examples ? 

[Niko182]

Electro air and mt prop. Gann pap engine?

[ArtVandelay]

Power flow exhaust?
Firewall forward’s stc
mod works stc

[Tx_Aggie]

4 hours ago, philip_g said:

Turbo normalization or sell and get a k

I didn’t think anyone had an active  turbo normalized stc but maybe I’m wrong?

[Tx_Aggie]

4 hours ago, Niko182 said:

Electro air and mt prop. Gann pap engine?

Does the MT prop improve cruise speed? What’s a Gann Papp engine and Electro Air?

[jetdriven]

The iO390 engine is 7 hp more at 75% power and less it lower power settings. I’m not sure if anybody’s documented amy real speed gains with this engine 

 

[GeeBee]

The rule of squares is in effect, always has, always will. 

Cheapest way is to reduce drag. Most expensive, increase power.

 

[N201MKTurbo]

So let's say you spend a bunch of money and eek out another 5 kts. on a 400 mile leg, that is only 4 min. Is it really worth it?

[N201MKTurbo]

You can get about 10 KTS right now. Just cruise at takeoff power. 

[philiplane]

Turbocharging is the only way to go significantly faster, but you have to fly higher for that to work. You'll gain 2 knots per thousand feet above 7000 feet, so you'll see 170 at 15,000 feet. And more as you go higher, up to about FL220. Back to the costs though...better off to sell and buy a 231 or 252. Or a 201 that already has a turbo.

There's really  no cost effective way to exceed 165 knots with a 201. It's more practical to sell the 201, and buy something that already does 170+ knots.

199010-1988 Mooney M20J 201SE Turbo Conversion.pdf

Edited January 3, 2022 by philiplane

[Ragsf15e]

Easiest way is to sell it and buy an ovation.  170kts, problem solved.

[ArtVandelay]

So let's say you spend a bunch of money and eek out another 5 kts. on a 400 mile leg, that is only 4 min. Is it really worth it?

Then posting on MS bragging about your speed…priceless.

[201Mooniac]

7 hours ago, ArtVandelay said:

Power flow exhaust?

I found it very hard to measure any reliable difference after installing the PowerFlow exhaust.  I had convinced myself it helped until I did careful testing and found maybe 0.5 kt improvement.

[Guest]

I installed one of these, it helped my speeds quite a bit.

[201er]

Monroy tanks and a piss bag. When you skip a fuel stop, you end up saving 30-60 minutes which is comparable to gaining 10-20 knots in time to destination on a 1000nm flight.

[bmcconnaha]

3 hours ago, jetdriven said:

The iO390 engine is 7 hp more at 75% power and less it lower power settings. I’m not sure if anybody’s documented amy real speed gains with this engine 

 

Besides me? I’ve posted and been asked a hundred times about the speed gain.  It’s faster.  

[bmcconnaha]

@Tx_Aggie to answer your question on the 390, without speculation.  Down lower, I’ve seen 169kts true. But, that is not usually where I fly.  I’m usually 10k plus. Tough to say the exact number, because obviously testing on different days, and different weights.  This is typical of a 14500 cruise for me.  100-125 ROP.  The better improvement is how it climbs though.  It’s a definite improvement there.  I took off out of Sheridan WY with the old 360, with two people onboard and full tanks, and it was seriously not happy getting to ten.  The last time I left Sheridan, I climbed to 14500 with a similar load and didn’t think twice.  I wouldn’t go out of my way to replace the engine with a 390 solely for a speed gain, that’s throwing good money away.  But, when it comes time to overhaul, I’d go that way again.  I had the a3b6d engine in mine, and I wanted to get rid of that magneto arrangement anyways.  The 390 actually was a couple grand less than the 360 a3b6 and almost 4K less than the a3b6d (lycoming factory rebuilt).  I sold the oem prop to get the hartzell top prop, so it costs a few more grand in the grand scheme, it was definitely worth that.  Common misconceptions that you’ll hear: 

cylinders cost more: they don’t

its only ten horsepower: well the engines were certified at different times.  The 390 makes 210hp or more.  The 360 was rounded up. 
 

hopefully that helps you.  
 

with that said, other than removing an antenna or two, there will not be anymore money spent on speed on this airplane.  In the end, it’s a J.  It does what it does, and does it well enough.  If I need to go faster, I’ll buy a bravo or a 252.  

 

[bmcconnaha]

1 hour ago, bluehighwayflyer said:

Part of the speed gain you are seeing is probably also due to the fact that your old engine was no longer making rated power.  They usually aren’t when they are removed from service.  Even though this is often imperceptible until you bolt on a new engine and suddenly see what you have been missing.  

Mine was removed from service because it was an oil leaker, not because it was tired. It had a relatively recent top OH before I bought it.  Just wasn’t comfortable with the leaks, particularly ones I couldn’t find sources for.  i bought the plane with the intention of overhauling it eventaully, i just moved the timeline up.  looking at the current delays, i am glad i did.  So, that’s most likely not the case on it not making full rated power.  compressions were still strong when i pulled it.  

[A64Pilot]

The ways to increase speed in any aircraft are

1. reduce drag, hide or remove antennas maybe even sand the paint job, polish the aircraft.

2. verify / correct rigging gear doors and flight controls etc. sometimes a surprising amount of speed is lost from rigging being wrong.

3. increase power, turbos work of course by allowing higher power in less dense air, so your reducing drag and increasing power both with a turbo.

4. “stacking” performance mods or STC’s just doesn’t work, meaning you can’t add the numbers of speed increase claimed for each and get the total increase, not even half from my observations.

I have a Gann “performance” engine, 500 hours on it and my 201 is capable of 168 kts down low (1000 MSL) at TO power, I have no idea how that compares to other 201’s but suspect it’s about average.
 

My normal cruise is I’m sure, like most other 201’s is 155 kts, and 10.5 GPH, but having run the numbers of how much time a few kts save me, my normal cruise is now 130 kts and a burn of 6.5-7 GPH.

Being older and Retired the speed doesn’t mean as much as it used to, now efficiency seems to be more important, and I feel sure the. engine will live longer running at low power / RPM and LOP.

You can spend a tremendous amount of money in search of very small speed increases. My advice is burn that money in Avgas, motel rooms and rental cars and enjoy traveling in your Mooney.

[carusoam]

Find Bob’s M20E…

Copy his details.

Bob enjoyed chasing the finer details of speed and ownership…

New cowl, new paint, rigged properly…. Engine OH’d, new prop, and the finest instrument panel…

Method of paying… investing throughout retirement… enjoyed his AAPL… Today, Apple is enjoying its three trillion market capacity…

Go Bob!

Best regards,

-a-

[bmcconnaha]

16 minutes ago, A64Pilot said:

The ways to increase speed in any aircraft are

1. reduce drag, hide or remove antennas maybe even sand the paint job, polish the aircraft.

2. verify / correct rigging gear doors and flight controls etc. sometimes a surprising amount of speed is lost from rigging being wrong.

3. increase power, turbos work of course by allowing higher power in less dense air, so your reducing drag and increasing power both with a turbo.

4. “stacking” performance mods or STC’s just doesn’t work, meaning you can’t add the numbers of speed increase claimed for each and get the total increase, not even half from my observations.

I have a Gann “performance” engine, 500 hours on it and my 201 is capable of 168 kts down low (1000 MSL) at TO power, I have no idea how that compares to other 201’s but suspect it’s about average.
 

My normal cruise is I’m sure, like most other 201’s is 155 kts, and 10.5 GPH, but having run the numbers of how much time a few kts save me, my normal cruise is now 130 kts and a burn of 6.5-7 GPH.

Being older and Retired the speed doesn’t mean as much as it used to, now efficiency seems to be more important, and I feel sure the. engine will live longer running at low power / RPM and LOP.

You can spend a tremendous amount of money in search of very small speed increases. My advice is burn that money in Avgas, motel rooms and rental cars and enjoy traveling in your Mooney.

A few knots gained over the course of a typical flight when converted to min is depressing, lol.  I took off the other day about fifteen mins behind my pal in his Comanche 180.  I caught him about 80 mins after I departed.  And we’re talking much more than just a few knots between the two. 

[ArtVandelay]

Tough to say the exact number, because obviously testing on different days, and different weights.  This is typical of a 14500 cruise for me.  100-125 ROP.

I run 20°+ LOP, and at 13000’/2500 rpms will true out at 153 , but only burn 7.9 gph vs your 162knot/9.1 gph. I’m guessing if you ran LOP you’d lose 6-7 knots but would only burn 8.0-8.1.
I like the efficiency of a 201 and it’s less about maximum speed, more about mpg.

[jaylw314]

We normally fly from Oregon to SoCal, and my partner HATES using the pee bag in the plane.  However, after one time stopping in Fresno for a bathroom break (where it happened to be about 100F that day), she realized it adds up to an hour of travel time.  Now she reminds me to make sure we have extra pee bags so that we don't have to stop.

The irony, of course, is that's it's a lot easier for a gal then a guy to take care of business while sitting in a plane.  Landing with a full bladder is probably the other technique to shave off travel time, since you would taxi to the ramp at 100 knots if you could   That'd save at least a couple minutes!

[ArtVandelay]

Just now, philip_g said:

Interesting. I lean to about 9gph for whatever lop that equals and see about the same speed. We have an insight g1 that sucks for lop operation

I was at 13000’, my guess is at 9gph you were about 7000’?

[Browncbr1]

Save $100k and find a 231 with the turbo plus intercooler instead of a 252.