Hot start procedures for IO-360

[PT20J]

57 minutes ago, ArtVandelay said:

To be clear is that a 1/4” or a 1/4 travel.


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1/4 travel. If you want to find out exactly you can turn on the boost pump with the mixture full rich and watch the fuel flow as you slowly advance the throttle. You will see a sharp increase and then it will level off.  It will be dripping gas by the time you finish this so let it dry out before trying to start it. 

My SOP for priming is throttle about 1/4 open, boost pump on, Mixture rich until fuel flow stabilized, then ICO. Then I close the throttle and open it until I hear the click of the gear warning micro switch. Now, I’m ready to crank (If I remembered to take the key out of my pocket ).

Skip
 

[carusoam]

SOP for the IO550…

1) Prime with the throttle in full…. Remember to take the throttle back out as the next step…
2) 5 seconds for warm weather, 10seconds for cold…

3) This is using the HI electric pump option… vs the Lo option…

4) The lo option has choices as well, with better precision over longer periods of time… about 3X the Hi option…

 

Pp thoughts only, for comparison to the IO360…

Best regards,

-a-

[LeRoy Johnston]

Just to close the loop, the plane is now out of annual with overhauled mags and new plugs (with fine wires on the bottom set).  It is starting like a champ, hot and cold.  I am using the book cold start and my IA's flooded technique for all other starts (warm and hot).  It is pretty easy to not let the revs get too high when it catches.  --LeRoy

[Ragsf15e]

1 hour ago, LeRoy Johnston said:

Just to close the loop, the plane is now out of annual with overhauled mags and new plugs (with fine wires on the bottom set).  It is starting like a champ, hot and cold.  I am using the book cold start and my IA's flooded technique for all other starts (warm and hot).  It is pretty easy to not let the revs get too high when it catches.  --LeRoy

Glad to hear it!

As you get more comfortable with your engine, consider the “non flooded” hot start technique most of us use.  There is a (small) chance of a tailpipe fire when it’s flooded.  If you try the standard hot start technique and miss the start, you can then move to the flooded start.  Just my 2 cents after 7 years of ownership.

[LeRoy Johnston]

Rags--Thanks for the input.

[Philip France 13]

I have a method that works 100%

- when engine is hot mixture low, throttle full forward, fuel pump off, starter until engine turn on (may take 5seconds), then mixture rich and throttle back

- when engine is hot but stated to cool down 30mn or so,

mixture low, fuel pump on for few seconds until fuel pressure goes on, fuel pump off, mixture rich to feed fuel in the fuel lines, then same as above : mixture low, throttle full rich, start engine

Philip

 

[toto]

1 hour ago, Philip France 13 said:

I have a method that works 100%

- when engine is hot mixture low, throttle full forward, fuel pump off, starter until engine turn on (may take 5seconds), then mixture rich and throttle back

- when engine is hot but stated to cool down 30mn or so,

mixture low, fuel pump on for few seconds until fuel pressure goes on, fuel pump off, mixture rich to feed fuel in the fuel lines, then same as above : mixture low, throttle full rich, start engine

Philip

 

Sounds like the flooded start procedure?

[1001001]

I have a hot start procedure that works every time on my airplane.  The guy I went to for my Mooney transition training taught me this--he used it in his F model when he still had it.  Works fine in my J (should, since it's the same engine setup, pretty much).  It works regardless of how long the engine has been resting since shutdown, as long as it's hot.

1.  Mixture cutoff

2.  Throttle full for 30s

3.  Throttle back to 1/2" to 1" open

4.  Crank until start

5.  Advance mixture, adjust throttle

 

This usually results in a start within a few revolutions.

Edited November 22, 2021 by 1001001

[toto]

It’s interesting to me that there are so many different techniques for a hot start with the IO-360, when the Don Maxwell procedure is so dead simple and agrees with the flight manual.

[Derrickearly]

On 11/21/2021 at 7:49 PM, toto said:

It’s interesting to me that there are so many different techniques for a hot start with the IO-360, when the Don Maxwell procedure is so dead simple and agrees with the flight manual.

I'm a Don Maxwell hot start convert, as well.

[MisfitSELF]

Hey I do this novel and innovative hot start technique on my M20J (fuel injected).  There's this procedure in this blue book in my airplane that works great!  I recommend you check it out -- I bet your airplane has one too.

Pardon the sarcasm.  I had this crony at my home field give me the whole "you're probably doing it wrong so I'll show you the RIGHT way to start your engine" spiel.  I humored him but I knew the result as I've tried this before.  His "technique" was to leave the throttle at 1200 on shutdown and just restart.  Result -- you crank and crank and the engine doesn't start - surprise.  I guess this works for some, but it definitely didn't work for me.

For my engine that's not enough throttle for a hot or "flooded" start.  You have to use full throttle / idle mixture technique as stated on my checklist.  Imagine that?  Follow the checklist.

Edited April 7, 2022 by MisfitSELF

[Shadrach]

On 4/6/2022 at 11:19 AM, Derrickearly said:

I'm a Don Maxwell hot start convert, as well.

I thought maxwell's procedure did not involve toucing the mixture until the engine fired.  Hot or cold there is rarely a reason to touch the mixture until the engine has fired.

[jaylw314]

6 minutes ago, Shadrach said:

I thought maxwell's procedure did not involve toucing the mixture until the engine fired.  Hot or cold there is rarely a reason to touch the mixture until the engine has fired.

I don't even bother with full rich, after the engine catches, I only advance mixture about halfway for hot starts.  On really hot days, I'll hear the engine cut out from the vapor in the lines, but the prop still has enough momentum to keep things going.  It's really quite remarkable how close the mixture can be to cutoff during ground ops, it's literally like a 1/2" away if I'm taxiing at 1000 rpm.

[jaylw314]

6 hours ago, MisfitSELF said:

Hey I do this novel and innovative hot start technique on my M20J (fuel injected).  There's this procedure in this blue book in my airplane that works great!  I recommend you check it out -- I bet your airplane has one too.

Pardon the sarcasm.  I had this crony at my home field give me the whole "you're probably doing it wrong so I'll show you the RIGHT way to start your engine" spiel.  I humored him but I knew the result as I've tried this before.  His "technique" was to leave the throttle at 1200 on shutdown and just restart.  Result -- you crank and crank and the engine doesn't start - surprise.  I guess this works for some, but it definitely didn't work for me.

For my engine that's not enough throttle for a hot or "flooded" start.  You have to use full throttle / idle mixture technique as stated on my checklist.  Imagine that?  Follow the checklist.

The majority of M20J owners here seem to use the Don Maxwell successfully.  Given that your experience with the "technique" is out of the ordinary, it would be wise to consider having your A&P bench test the left mag at next annual. 

I could only get hot starts done using the flooded procedure with a motor and mags only 150 hours from rebuilt.  When my A&P bench tested the left mag, he said the e-gap had changed significantly from wear, and it was only making about an 1/8" spark.  Since then, the motor does hot starts fine.  I got the right mag IRAN'd about 200 hours later.

[MisfitSELF]

42 minutes ago, jaylw314 said:

The majority of M20J owners here seem to use the Don Maxwell successfully.  Given that your experience with the "technique" is out of the ordinary, it would be wise to consider having your A&P bench test the left mag at next annual. 

I could only get hot starts done using the flooded procedure with a motor and mags only 150 hours from rebuilt.  When my A&P bench tested the left mag, he said the e-gap had changed significantly from wear, and it was only making about an 1/8" spark.  Since then, the motor does hot starts fine.  I got the right mag IRAN'd about 200 hours later.

Not going to be a factor.  Next time I fly my Mooney, the left mag will be a Surefly.

[Ragsf15e]

55 minutes ago, MisfitSELF said:

Not going to be a factor.  Next time I fly my Mooney, the left mag will be a Surefly.

Surefly made starting very slightly easier both hot and cold but not a significant change for mine.  I do not change the throttle or mixture from shutdown and she cranks right up on a hot start.  Now if I go and actually flood it, yes, the throttle needs to start at full and come back slowly until it fires.  Interesting that yours seems different than most of the other IO-360s.

[PT20J]

I had a Surefly but took it off due to the 28v cutout problem (I believe that has been resolved). It didn't affect starting at all on my factory rebuilt IO-360-A3B6 with about 200 hours on it at the time. Maybe it helps with engines that have some oil fouling, but mine only burns about a quart every 12 hours and the plugs are always dry and clean. I'm still running the massive Champions that came with the engine.

Skip

[Will.iam]

On 4/7/2022 at 8:23 PM, PT20J said:

I had a Surefly but took it off due to the 28v cutout problem (I believe that has been resolved). It didn't affect starting at all on my factory rebuilt IO-360-A3B6 with about 200 hours on it at the time. Maybe it helps with engines that have some oil fouling, but mine only burns about a quart every 12 hours and the plugs are always dry and clean. I'm still running the massive Champions that came with the engine.

Skip

Only resolved if you get version 2 with the modified voltage regulator. If you get the old stock lije my neighbor did and you get a problem then they will send you a capacitor kit. I would demand and wait if necessary for a version 2. I got one of the first ones off the assembly line the last week of sept 2021 but had to wait 2 weeks to get it. 

[PT20J]

35 minutes ago, Will.iam said:

Only resolved if you get version 2 with the modified voltage regulator. If you get the old stock lije my neighbor did and you get a problem then they will send you a capacitor kit. I would demand and wait if necessary for a version 2. I got one of the first ones off the assembly line the last week of sept 2021 but had to wait 2 weeks to get it. 

I saw your other post. I'm surprised that they are still shipping out a product with a known problem. I think that is pretty tacky, personally.

[EricJ]

44 minutes ago, PT20J said:

I saw your other post. I'm surprised that they are still shipping out a product with a known problem. I think that is pretty tacky, personally.

Supply chain pressures may have led them to ship all the inventory that they had.

Still pretty lame, though.