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Delete vacuum pump

bradp

By bradp
in Avionics/Panel Discussion

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bradp Grand Master

bradp

Posted
Posted

Hi all,

Help me work through this - have a dual G5 setup.  Currently the vacuum indicator serves as the "backup" AI to the two solid state AIs front and center.

Thinking about deleting and blanking off the vacuum pump and reinstalling my old TC (to keep the G5 STC install valid).

In addition I bet I have three other AHRSs living in the cockpit.

I always liked the idea of a mechanical AI but that is the only one (so far) that has failed because of the vaccuum system.  I kind of need the vacuum gauge to be either gone or moved somewhere else in the panel.

What do you all think?  My inclination is get over it and get rid of the vac pump...

-Brad

  • Like 1
Marauder Grand Master

Marauder

Posted
Posted
Hi all,
Help me work through this - have a dual G5 setup.  Currently the vacuum indicator serves as the "backup" AI to the two solid state AIs front and center.
Thinking about deleting and blanking off the vacuum pump and reinstalling my old TC (to keep the G5 STC install valid).
In addition I bet I have three other AHRSs living in the cockpit.
I always liked the idea of a mechanical AI but that is the only one (so far) that has failed because of the vaccuum system.  I kind of need the vacuum gauge to be either gone or moved somewhere else in the panel.
What do you all think?  My inclination is get over it and get rid of the vac pump...
-Brad


I’ve been vacuum free for a couple of years. In that time, another Mooney owner has had 2 vacuum pump failures. I’ve been running the Aspens for 7 years and when I had a chance to ditch the vacuum pump, I did. No regrets.

I wish a number of you “suckers” would dump your vacuum pump and join me in the quest to get a B&C standby alternator approved for our planes. Yeah, I know, I have “X hours” with the G5 or Aspen’s internal battery. But what runs your Nav/Com, transponder, pitot heat and electric landing gear?

“Say NO to suction, yes to the standby charge”


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
  • Like 4
EricJ Grand Master

EricJ

Posted
Posted

I'm looking forward to getting to the point that I can ditch the vacuum pump completely.   Sounds to me like you're already there once the TC goes back in, so I'd say go for it.

I'm just waiting to sort out autopilot options (c'mon TruTrak!), before I delete the old AI and vacuum pump.

 

vorlon1 Proficient

vorlon1

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, bradp said:

 My inclination is get over it and get rid of the vac pump...

-Brad

From A Christmas Story:

"Tell him to take it off! TAKE IT OFF!" :lol:

  • Like 1
Ragsf15e Grand Master

Ragsf15e

Posted
Posted

I’m in line at the avionics shop for 2 G5’s.  Vacuum pump coming off this annual if the avionics shop timeline works out.  

And yes @Marauder is right, it would be nice to have a backup alternator, but I believe you can reduce battery load enough to keep a navcom going and the G5’s (which have a 4 hour internal backup) to get you down if the alternator dies.  If that goes south, handheld radio, G5’s (internal battery) and iPad (stratus be good with iPad).  Even without the electrical system, we’ve got a lot of backups.

  • Like 1
Vno Enthusiast

Vno

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, bradp said:

Hi all,

Help me work through this - have a dual G5 setup.  Currently the vacuum indicator serves as the "backup" AI to the two solid state AIs front and center.

Thinking about deleting and blanking off the vacuum pump and reinstalling my old TC (to keep the G5 STC install valid).

In addition I bet I have three other AHRSs living in the cockpit.

I always liked the idea of a mechanical AI but that is the only one (so far) that has failed because of the vaccuum system.  I kind of need the vacuum gauge to be either gone or moved somewhere else in the panel.

What do you all think?  My inclination is get over it and get rid of the vac pump...

-Brad

Which autopilot do you have and what is it driven by? If it is King then you will need the AI to drive it. That might limit your ability to remove the system.

Brian

bradp Grand Master

bradp

Posted
  • Author
Posted

I have a century IIb single axis - currently requires the AI.  Thinking hard about a GFC which would allow the AI to be deleted. One shop I’m getting quotes from said they’d do it as part of the install.  -B 

  • Like 1
kris_adams Mentor

kris_adams

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, ArtVandelay said:

I got rid of mine and it’s electric backup...lost 20lbs of weight.

This is really good news.  I'm taking the same thing out of mine in the next month or so.  I hope I get the same savings!

Oldguy Veteran

Oldguy

Posted
Posted

When I put my Aspen in, I lost my standby vacuum but had to keep the engine-driven pump for my speed brakes and gained over 12 lbs. UL. Now, I have swapped out my 430W, MX 20 for an IFD 540 and gained another 4+ lbs. UL to put me at 900.95 lbs. UL!

I would consider swapping the speed brakes out, but I can't see the value of dropping ~7 AMU just to lose that last vacuum pump.

But I really would like the standby power supply, so we will see what the next couple of years brings in my Christmas stocking.

  • Like 2
EricJ Grand Master

EricJ

Posted
Posted

I've been thinking of a standby ALT, too, ever since I started approaching the prospect of deleting the vacuum pump.     Seems like a natural replacement for the pump.

  • Like 1
carusoam Grand Master

carusoam

Posted
Posted

remind me...


What is getting in the way of adding the spare alternator on the IO360?

Physical space or STC paperwork or mechanical limitation?

So many people would benefit from the extra alternator as the vac pump is going the way of (insert favorite dodo bird here) :)

 

If this is only an STC challenge we know some people...

Best regards,

-a-

Marauder Grand Master

Marauder

Posted
Posted
remind me...

What is getting in the way of adding the spare alternator on the IO360?
Physical space or STC paperwork or mechanical limitation?
So many people would benefit from the extra alternator as the vac pump is going the way of (insert favorite dodo bird here) 
 
If this is only an STC challenge we know some people...
Best regards,
-a-


It’s an STC issue. I spoke with B&C and they indicated only 1 Mooney (a K model) obtained a field approval. I know it would be difficult to get my Philly FSDO to approve one.

I think if there was enough genuine interest and commitment, B&C might pursue the STC for our Mooneys.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro
  • Like 1
xcrmckenna Veteran

xcrmckenna

Posted
Posted


I’ve been vacuum free for a couple of years. In that time, another Mooney owner has had 2 vacuum pump failures. I’ve been running the Aspens for 7 years and when I had a chance to ditch the vacuum pump, I did. No regrets.

I wish a number of you “suckers” would dump your vacuum pump and join me in the quest to get a B&C standby alternator approved for our planes. Yeah, I know, I have “X hours” with the G5 or Aspen’s internal battery. But what runs your Nav/Com, transponder, pitot heat and electric landing gear?

“Say NO to suction, yes to the standby charge”


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

I love my plane doesn’t suck.....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
  • Like 1
Ned Gravel Grand Master

Ned Gravel

Posted
Posted
On 10/10/2019 at 1:35 PM, bradp said:

Hi all,

Help me work through this - have a dual G5 setup.  Currently the vacuum indicator serves as the "backup" AI to the two solid state AIs front and center.

Thinking about deleting and blanking off the vacuum pump and reinstalling my old TC (to keep the G5 STC install valid).

In addition I bet I have three other AHRSs living in the cockpit.

I always liked the idea of a mechanical AI but that is the only one (so far) that has failed because of the vacuum system.  I kind of need the vacuum gauge to be either gone or moved somewhere else in the panel.

What do you all think?  My inclination is get over it and get rid of the vac pump...

-Brad

So I have read all of the posts above and it appears that the only real need you have for a vacuum pump is to drive an AI for your autopilot.  Just so you know, my avionics shop told me that having dual G5s does not appear to alleviate the need for backups in legacy primary airspeed, altitude, turn coordinator or vertical speed indicator - unlike a dual Aspen setup.  But with two G5s, each is redundant to the other in terms of AI (not certain about HSI and FD redundancy).  

I have one G5 (as the HSI) and I am thinking about either a second G5 for an AI or a uAvionix A30 (once it gets certified). 

While I like the idea of two G5s, I am not really bothered by having the other four legacy instruments as backup - but as regards my vacuum pump, I will still need something to bring up the retractable step - either the vacuum pump or one of the other alternatives currently being offered by entrepreneurial engineers.  The vacuum gauge itself is a 1" device and takes up almost no room on my panel.

However, I would be very interested in hearing what you finally decide and how you get there from here.

 

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