TruTrak Autopilot Pre Order's / Status Update

[Hector]

I can only speak about my personal experience flying a Trutrak in a Cherokee. It is far better than the Britain Accutrak I have in my C. I can preset the altitude I want to climb to and the rate of climb and course before I take off. After takeoff I engage the AP and it climbs to my preset altitude at the rate I asked for. It has envelope protection so if you ask for a rate of climb that it can’t deliver it will not stall. It holds altitude very well and follows the GPS on the magenta line. It does not have a heading bug but you can dial in whatever GPS course you want. In my experience It does not make much of a difference. If ATC tells me to turn heading 090 I just dial in 090 course in the TruTrak and I get no complains. On occasion I’ll make just a minor change in the course I set because I know the winds so I’ll dial in a few degrees left or right of the heading given by ATC to compensate. Only do this if the x-wind is significant. Most time I don’t bother. It also shoots an LPV approach well. Yes, it is not approved below 700 but the AP doesn’t know that so it will fly the approach to the numbers. I don’t do a lot of IFR so for my C it is all I need. The GFC500 is a better AP without question and probably the better choice for some airplanes and mission, but at less than half the installed cost it will do fine for me. The only unknown fir me is whether it will perform just as well in a Mooney as it does on a Cherokee. At this point I have no reason to suspect otherwise but I will wait for the first real reviews.


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[McMooney]

so flipping the coin, extended range tanks or aerocruz 100 as my next upgrade. hmmmmm

hard hard decision

[carusoam]

1 hour ago, McMooney said:

so flipping the coin, extended range tanks or aerocruz 100 as my next upgrade. hmmmmm

hard hard decision

If you have no autopilot…

Get the autopilot….

 

Extended range fuel tanks are good…

But flying with precision, by hand… is cognitively draining….

 

So…

Arrive somewhat refreshed, even if it takes a fuel stop to go the whole distance…

 

I never figured out why flying my M20C was so tiring…. Until I was flying the M20R between the same places… 

Driving to the same places was equally tiring… so i didn’t notice anything amiss…

If your 40yrs old, and take a nap after flying 250nms… get an AP.    And check your CO monitor… 

 

Pp thoughts only,

-a-

[McMooney]

18 minutes ago, carusoam said:

If you have no autopilot…

Get the autopilot….

 

Extended range fuel tanks are good…

But flying with precision, by hand… is cognitively draining….

 

So…

Arrive somewhat refreshed, even if it takes a fuel stop to go the whole distance…

 

I never figured out why flying my M20C was so tiring…. Until I was flying the M20R between the same places… 

Driving to the same places was equally tiring… so i didn’t notice anything amiss…

If your 40yrs old, and take a nap after flying 250nms… get an AP.    And check your CO monitor… 

 

Pp thoughts only,

-a-

I have the brittain b5ish ap,  tracks mag heading, follows magenta line,  can shoot approaches, unfortunately no altitude hold.   tough decision.

[cliffy]

Slow down and smell the roses

Flying  a Mooney is supposed to be fun and not a marathon

I've done  5+15 once in my C model and that was 30 years ago and I vowed never to do that again. 

At least when I did 5+ in  Boeing I could go back and take a leak properly !    :-)

Did know one guy in an E model that did PHX to Columbus Ohio    8+ standard fuel, big tailwind, LRC power 

[MBDiagMan]

On 3/15/2022 at 11:00 AM, LANCECASPER said:

Please don't do that on here. Most of us come on Mooneyspace to get away from all of the divisive garbage going on.

I saw nothing divisive about the post.  The man was simply stating facts.

Edited September 27, 2022 by MBDiagMan

[Shadrach]

On 8/17/2022 at 3:12 PM, carusoam said:

There are no Dutch roll tendencies to any Mooney… but, flying in bumps can cause yaw…

 Yours must have both been exceptional because mine can certainly Dutch Roll in tubulance.

[LANCECASPER]

1 hour ago, MBDiagMan said:

I saw nothing divisive about the post.  The man was simply stating facts.

He deleted the last line after I made that comment.

[DXB]

56 minutes ago, Shadrach said:

 Yours must have both been exceptional because mine can certainly Dutch Roll in tubulance.

I thought it was a phenomenon specific to swept wing aircraft, but I would swear I've experienced it before my C model. At the very least, the short bodies don't have the best yaw stability.  If I ever upgrade my 2 axis STEC-30 to something modern, I'm going with the yaw damper option for sure.

[Shadrach]

1 hour ago, DXB said:

I thought it was a phenomenon specific to swept wing aircraft, but I would swear I've experienced it before my C model. At the very least, the short bodies don't have the best yaw stability.  If I ever upgrade my 2 axis STEC-30 to something modern, I'm going with the yaw damper option for sure.

Dihedral can induce Dutch Roll as well. I think the Mooney airframe is a great design. It’s not as susceptible to Dutch Roll as some other singles but it’s not immune either.

[carusoam]

 

 

I asked Alexa for a pic of a Dutch roll….

I haven’t seen any of these in my Mooney…

 

Best regards,

-a-

[EricJ]

Regarding the TruTrak availability, I had this exchange with AS last week.   Haven't heard back since.   The Aerocruz 100 is still in my order queue with "Preparing for shipment" as the status, which has been the status for quite some time.

Chronology from the bottom up.

____________________
 

Hi,

With delivery uncertain there's no way I could agree to an up-front charge with a No Cancel No Refund stipulation.    This seems very unusual and not confidence-inspiring to me.

Will Aircraft Spruce offer the product when it becomes available?   I'm very interested in one and have been waiting for its availability for quite a while, but can't pre-pay under those circumstances.   I'm more than happy to order and pay for a unit when they are available to ship.

Thanks,

Eric Jacobsen
 

On 9/23/2022 10:14 AM, AS wrote:

The card in this case is charged up front by the factory.
 

On 9/22/2022 2:20 PM, Eric Jacobsen wrote:

Hi,

When would my card be charged?   I don't want to get into a situation where my card is charged, delivery continually gets pushed out, and I'm not allowed to cancel if it appears the product won't become available.

Also, can I ask if you're sourcing this from Bendix-King or from Duncan?

Thanks much,

Eric Jacobsen
 

On 9/22/2022 1:33 PM, AS wrote:

No Cancel No Return.
 

On 9/22/2022 1:22 PM, Eric Jacobsen wrote:

Hi,

I'm still interested in this.   What is NCNR?

Cheers,

Eric

On 9/22/2022 12:54 PM, AS wrote:

Hi Eric,

We have been advised by the factory that your AEROCRUZE
has a lead time of about 120 days. It will also be NCNR.Shall
we proceed with this order or Cancel? We apologize for any
inconvenience this may cause.

--

Warm Regards, Customer Service Aircraft Spruce & Specialty Co. 225 Airport Circle, Corona, CA 92880 (P) 951-372-9555

 

[carusoam]

What happens if you order it 120 days from now?

Any price protection?

Any price discount for them sitting on your dough?

Or is price going to get adjusted as time goes on…?

 

We’re still talking BK right?

Best regards,

-a-

[cliffy]

I paid up front a month ago when I was told they were ready and 3 days later got the email that the order had been cancelled by BK/TT as to no availability. now or in the future.  I called Spruce and they said they never charged my CC BUT it appeared on my statement for the next billing cycle. I called AcS again and they said they didn't show any charge to  my card.  I called the card company and they showed the charge so I am now in a "Disputed Charge" venue with them. It looks like I'll be OK but?

On another front. I have my Dynon HDX installed and working fine but for the autopilot

I was talking with a Boeing guy the other day and he related that he too has an HDX and was working in SEA 

with the FAA and got to talking about  the Dynon approval that is going through the SEA office. He was informed that the FAA has until the end of the year to either approve or cancel the rating system on the (IIRC) 737 similar type rating (no separate rating required ) and at that time they will have more personnel to work on the Dynon approvals.  

[Ragsf15e]

Page 56 of this thread is not inspiring confidence.

[cliffy]

My opinion now?   It'll never happen

[NotarPilot]

4 hours ago, cliffy said:

My opinion now?   It'll never happen

Are you talking about Dynon or Aerocruze?

[Lionudakis]

I have a customers AC100 on order and paid for. What I can’t fathom is BK had zero components available, even being 100% sure the stc was a done deal. The servos are all the same for all systems, the controllers are the same, the brackets and program settings are unique to the mooney. Makes me wonder if the pay 100% upfront is because they had no capital to continue produce parts and have them sit awaiting approval. 

[LANCECASPER]

1 minute ago, Lionudakis said:

I have a customers AC100 on order and paid for. What I can’t fathom is BK had zero components available, even being 100% sure the stc was a done deal. The servos are all the same for all systems, the controllers are the same, the brackets and program settings are unique to the mooney. Makes me wonder if the pay 100% upfront is because they had no capital to continue produce parts and have them sit awaiting approval. 

I doubt they lack capital. They are owned by Honeywell. 

[Jesse Saint]

Boeing, the distributor, doesn't charge you for parts until they ship.

[EricJ]

Two things seemed odd in my recent exchange with them, the No Cancel No Return policy after an up-front charge, and the statement that "The card in this case is charged up front by the factory."    The factory charges the card?    Maybe that's why @cliffy is having trouble?

I'm also curious why AS called Cliffy to cancel his order, but not mine, and instead I got the No Cancel No Return offer.

Whatever is going on, it's very strange.   

[cliffy]

9 hours ago, NotarPilot said:

Are you talking about Dynon or Aerocruze?

Aerocruz

And not a word out of BK  No communications is the real quandary- WHY?

Honeywell still has to send the money to BK Just because you are part of a larger organization doesn't mean you will get funded. 

If you read their "Vision" statement (BK) they are transitioning to a "connected- wifi- subscription service" model for the future.  You'll pay a monthly fee for everything. Discreet components (autopilots etc) don't  look to be in the offing going forward.  

Edited September 28, 2022 by cliffy
add

[MBDiagMan]

On 9/27/2022 at 6:43 PM, LANCECASPER said:

He deleted the last line after I made that comment.

Okay.  That makes sense.

[EricJ]

7 hours ago, cliffy said:

Aerocruz

And not a word out of BK  No communications is the real quandary- WHY?

Honeywell still has to send the money to BK Just because you are part of a larger organization doesn't mean you will get funded. 

If you read their "Vision" statement (BK) they are transitioning to a "connected- wifi- subscription service" model for the future.  You'll pay a monthly fee for everything. Discreet components (autopilots etc) don't  look to be in the offing going forward.  

I had kind of been hoping that the guy who grew TruTrak and sold it to BK would still be championing it within Honeywell, but if you look at his LinkedIn profile he's totally moved on to other very different things within the company and it's probably completely off his radar.    So the people within Honeywell/BK that are managing this stuff are doing it with probably not a lot of motivation.   I'm still struggling with why a vendor would demand pre-payment with No Cancel No Return terms unless they were just trying to fulfill some minimum deliveries, maybe to meet whatever agreement they had with Duncan for finishing the STC.  It would seem really out of place to demand prepayment and No Cancel No Return for a product that you intend to continue to sell and support.

Who knows?   We can only speculate because, as you say, there's essentially no communications.   

[cliffy]

Question-

Is Duncan getting any shipments of any TT/BK autopilots for any airframes or experimentals?

Are there even any experimental systems available anywhere?

Seems they have all dropped off the earth