Chasing the Dream

[Utah_Pilot]

Long story and I will do my best to keep this short.  I was a "Top Gun" era kid and the movie was essentially my baby sitter growing up.  I remember my first airline flight at the young age of 4 on an L-1011 and from that moment on, I knew exactly what I wanted to do with my life.  In high school, I enrolled in Junior ROTC, got an Air Force scholarship to FSU (Go Noles!!), became an Air Force cadet in Senior ROTC, and in my Junior Year of College picked up one of 500 pilot slots handed out across the United States in 2006.  I had a goal, a plan, tons of motivation, and I got what I worked for.  One year later on January 9th 2007, sitting in a chair at Brooks Base San Antonio, I was advised by an ophthalmologists that I had a pretiy common eye condition known as an esophoria but that, unfortunately, I was "hard DQ'd" from Air Force flying.  To this guy, I was just a number.  I was literally 4 months from graduated college and starting Air Force Pilot training.  Devastation does not describe how I felt and making matters worse, the Air Force was kind enough to send the information to the FAA (which is required and understandable) and I was forced to fight to keep my 3rd Class.  At the time, I was already a private pilot with more than 150 hours so the fact that I was now facing a threat to my civilian flying, I was forced to spend thousands on lawyers and medical appointments.  

In the last 11 years, I have spent a ton of time fighting the FAA trying to prove that what they thought I had, was much less significant than what the Air Force told them.  I was on a special issuance 3rd Class for 10 of those 11 years.  I was able to continue recreational flying but was unable to fly commercially without a 2nd or 1st Class.  Meanwhile, I spent 8 years in the Air Force as a Police Officer, got out, and became a project manager at a large public transportation agency in SLC making decent money.  When Basic Med came out, I decided to give up hope and move on from the dream.  Shortly after dropping my 3rd Class for Basic Med, however, I decided to request a Statement of Demonstrated Ability (SODA) one last time from the FAA.  They approved my request and shortly after I got a 3rd Class free and clear.  This was a big step considering I had been on a special issuance 3rd class for over 10 years...forcing me to submit paperwork every 2 years to the FAA proving that I was still healthy to fly.  This process was especially aggravating because I had spent a lot of money on the best MD's in the US to prove that I was well within FAA tolerances for not only a 3rd Class--but for a 1st Class as well.  The FAA chose to focus on what the one Air Force Flight Surgeon from 2007 had written on a piece of paper. 

Okay I'm winding this down.  I got greedy this month and decided to press my luck for a 1st Class.  I went to a new AME who was ironically, of all things, a retired Air Force Flight Surgeon.  He called some friends in Oklahoma to ask what the deal was and promised to try to help me out.  I received a call on Wednesday of this week from the AME, asking me to come sign my 1st Class Medical Certificate.  As if my first born had just arrived, I cried when I got that stupid piece of paper.  I was unceremoniously handed the paper by the office receptionist haha...she had zero idea what that piece of paper meant to me. 

So I'm quitting my great job that I have zero passion for this Summer and enrolling in ATP.  I'm chasing the dream knowing that my fight with the FAA may and likely will come up again and again...every 12 months until I'm 40 and every 6 months thereafter.  I don't care.  I'm 33 years old and figure this is probably my only shot...I will regret not trying and even if this doesn't work out, then I will become a CFI and still realize the dream of flying for a living.  What an office. 

Anybody have experience with ATP or even getting on with the regionals, working their way up to a major?  Any current commercial pilots with information on current job prospects?  General advice and recommendations are welcome from all.

Edited March 24, 2018 by Utah_Pilot

[Mooneymite]

Wow!  You are driven....

Best of luck in your training.  At 33 with pilot hiring as it is today, your goal is realistic and doable.

[Bob - S50]

Good on you.  Best of luck.

[Danb]

Great drive, I’ve had a soda for my eyes since the beginning, I only wish I had your motivation to fight your fight,  way to go....good luck!

[thinwing]

Nice...thanks for sharing..with the pilot shortage being talked about ,I think you have an excellent chance considering your motivation!

[steingar]

About 17 years ago NASA started quietly advertising for their new astronaut class.  I was going to apply. With a doctorate in Molecular Bioscience and a pilot’s license I thought I’d stand a decent chance. I talked myself out of it.

i haven’t too many regrets in life, but that is certainly the most painful. Pursue your dreams. Nothing is worse than doing a jog for decades that you don’t like.

i actually like my job a lot. But the thought of being an astronaut...

[bradp]

Nice story of perserverence.  My instrument instructor went through ATP for multi and CFI.  He instructed, flew a king Air for part 91 client, went to colgan, and decided it made flying pretty monotonous so went back and now flies a falcon and a dornier for a F-500 and is loving it again.  

[Marauder]

A friend of mine is 61 and has an ATP. He keeps requests from the regionals to join them. The time is ripe.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

[Mooneymite]

Amen!  The time is ripe.

Because the majors are hiring, there is a sucking sound at virtually all levels in the aviation world....

I remember in the bad old days of 'too many pilots-to few jobs'.  I was a lowly commercial pilot, I had to resort to a job at McDonalds.  I was put to work cooking french fries.  I asked to move up to work on the grill, but was told I had to have an ATP with a type rating to work on the grill.  

Things are different today.  

[MIm20c]

At the pumps last week I started talking to a Cherokee owner if front of me.  He purchased his plane 6 months ago and already has 400 hrs on it. His plan is to get his ATP and get a job for the airlines. At age 51 he will probably have some resistance climbing the ladder but I wish him the best. 

[thomas1142]

Very inspirational, best of luck.

[Rumblestrip]

6 hours ago, MIm20c said:

At the pumps last week I started talking to a Cherokee owner if front of me.  He purchased his plane 6 months ago and already has 400 hrs on it. His plan is to get his ATP and get a job for the airlines. At age 51 he will probably have some resistance climbing the ladder but I wish him the best. 

Funny you should say that because at 48 I'm having career thoughts.

 

Edited March 25, 2018 by Rumblestrip

[MrRodgers]

15 hours ago, Utah_Pilot said:

Long story and I will do my best to keep this short.  I was a "Top Gun" era kid and the movie was essentially my baby sitter growing up.  I remember my first airline flight at the young age of 4 on an L-1011 and from that moment on, I knew exactly what I wanted to do with my life.  In high school, I enrolled in Junior ROTC, got an Air Force scholarship to FSU (Go Noles!!), became an Air Force cadet in Senior ROTC, and in my Junior Year of College picked up one of 500 pilot slots handed out across the United States in 2006.  I had a goal, a plan, tons of motivation, and I got what I worked for.  One year later on January 9th 2007, sitting in a chair at Brooks Base San Antonio, I was advised by an ophthalmologists that I had a pretiy common eye condition known as an esophoria but that, unfortunately, I was "hard DQ'd" from Air Force flying.  To this guy, I was just a number.  I was literally 4 months from graduated college and starting Air Force Pilot training.  Devastation does not describe how I felt and making matters worse, the Air Force was kind enough to send the information to the FAA (which is required and understandable) and I was forced to fight to keep my 3rd Class.  At the time, I was already a private pilot with more than 150 hours so the fact that I was now facing a threat to my civilian flying, I was forced to spend thousands on lawyers and medical appointments.  

In the last 11 years, I have spent a ton of time fighting the FAA trying to prove that what they thought I had, was much less significant than what the Air Force told them.  I was on a special issuance 3rd Class for 10 of those 11 years.  I was able to continue recreational flying but was unable to fly commercially without a 2nd or 1st Class.  Meanwhile, I spent 8 years in the Air Force as a Police Officer, got out, and became a project manager at a large public transportation agency in SLC making decent money.  When Basic Med came out, I decided to give up hope and move on from the dream.  Shortly after dropping my 3rd Class for Basic Med, however, I decided to request a Statement of Demonstrated Ability (SODA) one last time from the FAA.  They approved my request and shortly after I got a 3rd Class free and clear.  This was a big step considering I had been on a special issuance 3rd class for over 10 years...forcing me to submit paperwork every 2 years to the FAA proving that I was still healthy to fly.  This process was especially aggravating because I had spent a lot of money on the best MD's in the US to prove that I was well within FAA tolerances for not only a 3rd Class--but for a 1st Class as well.  The FAA chose to focus on what the one Air Force Flight Surgeon from 2007 had written on a piece of paper. 

Okay I'm winding this down.  I got greedy this month and decided to press my luck for a 1st Class.  I went to a new AME who was ironically, of all things, a retired Air Force Flight Surgeon.  He called some friends in Oklahoma to ask what the deal was and promised to try to help me out.  I received a call on Wednesday of this week from the AME, asking me to come sign my 1st Class Medical Certificate.  As if my first born had just arrived, I cried when I got that stupid piece of paper.  I was unceremoniously handed the paper by the office receptionist haha...she had zero idea what that piece of paper meant to me. 

So I'm quitting my great job that I have zero passion for this Summer and enrolling in ATP.  I'm chasing the dream knowing that my fight with the FAA may and likely will come up again and again...every 12 months until I'm 40 and every 6 months thereafter.  I don't care.  I'm 33 years old and figure this is probably my only shot...I will regret not trying and even if this doesn't work out, then I will become a CFI and still realize the dream of flying for a living.  What an office. 

Anybody have experience with ATP or even getting on with the regionals, working their way up to a major?  Any current commercial pilots with information on current job prospects?  General advice and recommendations are welcome from all.

CONGRATULATIONS!  That is Awesome.  So happy for you. 

[Mooney in Oz]

United Express and Skywest Airlines have been actively advertising for recruits here in Australia for their ERJ and CRJ types.  Go for it while it lasts! 

[Immelman]

I went to great lakes at age 31 - from flying my Mooney and part-time CFI, to skywest for a few years, and onto something better now. It can be done. Get in and out of the regionals as quick as you can, its not a good place to be stuck if the music stops.

Edited March 25, 2018 by Immelman

[toto]

@Utah_Pilot as a point of reference, Dick Karl from Flying magazine chronicled his path to a second career as a charter pilot after 40-odd years in medicine and after beating cancer himself. Yours is a dream that I suspect many of us have shared (at least in hangar-flying daydreams). And if a 70ish cancer survivor can fly 135, I can't imagine you won't have a path to 121 at 33.

[takair]

First, congratulations.  

Some of the active pro pilots can speak to it better, but there are some commercial flying jobs that only require a second class medical, so potentially less exposure for you.  Of course, if you have your heart set on the majors, then first class it is...

[SantosDumont]

Congrats man.  I had a acquaintance get DQ’ed from flying from the Air Force Academy because she ‘had asthma’. She had never had a problem with it before and hasn’t since. 

[Utah_Pilot]

Thanks everybody for the well-wishes and comments.  I'm about 75% through the enrollment process with ATP and, if all goes to plan, I will know my class start date by next week.  I'll spend 6 months in an accelerated program getting my instrument, commercial, CFI, CFII, and MEI ratings.  As all of you know, that is a blistering pace but because this will be my full-time job, I'm expecting to spend 16 hours a day either studying, practicing, or flying.  Following this, I will spend the next year as a CFI, helping new pilots while working towards my ATP rating.  While some career minded folks consider instructing a means towards a regional, I'm very excited about my time as an instructor.  Hanging out with other aviation-driven folks and developing safe/knowledgeable pilots...what an awesome opportunity! There are some inspirational CFI's on this board that I hope to learn from @kortopates

If any others are thinking of making the leap or already have and are interested in being my mentor, please send me a PM.  Thanks again everybody,

Trey

[kpaul]

9 hours ago, Utah_Pilot said:

As all of you know, that is a blistering pace but because this will be my full-time job, I'm expecting to spend 16 hours a day either studying, practicing, or flying. 

Having been through multiple (7) lengthy flight training programs, I will warn you that 16 hours a day is too much.  You wont be able to sustain that for 6 months.  About half that time will probably be sufficient.  Sometimes you have to take some time to just let the information sink in before you can pile more on top of it. Having the ability to focus on it as your full time job will help immensely.  It will feel like the longest 6 months of your life until you are finished and then you will look back and wont believe how quickly it all went.

I am one week from completing a 4 month program.  I am of course dreading the checkride, as I have all of the 30 or so I have taken in my career.

Good luck with your new adventure.

[Mooney in Oz]

10 hours ago, Utah_Pilot said:

While some career minded folks consider instructing a means towards a regional, I'm very excited about my time as an instructor.

And a regional is a means toward a major airline. Don’t forget that the industry is very cyclic and the good times of gangbuster recruiting does not last for ever. When you get an opportunity to advance, don’t let it pass you by as timing is just as important.

Good luck Trey and don’t forget to let us know when you are in the right hand seat of a kero burner.

 

[KLRDMD]

On 3/26/2018 at 3:24 PM, kpaul said:

Having been through multiple (7) lengthy flight training programs, I will warn you that 16 hours a day is too much.  You wont be able to sustain that for 6 months.

Medical residents would disagree and have been doing that for decades  - and much longer than just 6 months.

[Mooneymite]

Fatigue is a major battle front for commercial pilots.  The FAR flight time/duty time regs are finally catching up with reality.  I suspect that the medical profession will also, eventually, follow along.  Fatigue has been cited in many high-profile aircraft accidents, but we tend not to hear about the people killed by over-tired/over-worked physicians.

Sure, we can all work long and hard, but how long we can work safely is another question.

[kpaul]

10 hours ago, KLRDMD said:

Medical residents would disagree and have been doing that for decades  - and much longer than just 6 months.

Well, I guess that makes it ok then...

Chronic fatigue + Aviation = Disaster

There is a reason the military has very specific regulations with regards to flight duty time and the amount of down time (crew rest).  During training 12 hours is the limit.  Operationally, it varies per airframe and mission.   The Air Force also limits the amount of flight time per 7, 30, 60 and 90 days.  This limit is to control the fatigue since that is one of the factors in most error chains leading to mishaps/fatalities. 

[KLRDMD]

8 hours ago, kpaul said:

Well, I guess that makes it ok then...

Chronic fatigue + Aviation = Disaster

There is a reason the military has very specific regulations with regards to flight duty time and the amount of down time (crew rest).  During training 12 hours is the limit.  Operationally, it varies per airframe and mission.   The Air Force also limits the amount of flight time per 7, 30, 60 and 90 days.  This limit is to control the fatigue since that is one of the factors in most error chains leading to mishaps/fatalities. 

Residencies have rules and limits too but they are much higher than what you discuss. Since they are doing it successfully, it musty be possible.