Most desirable year for an m20j ?

[zerotact]

Hi,

 With all the changes through the years, what would you say is the most desirable year to have, and why?   I know the newer machines. Lost some payload.    Etc...

[carusoam]

The most desirable year is the one you own....

Just guessing,

-a-

[ArtVandelay]

Actually the newer ones got an increase max gross weight, +160lbs

78 got faster gear speeds and push-pull controls

Everything else was incremental, 205 got 4 knots of aerodynamic improvements, but many 201s have been retrofitted.

It's hard to tell what year a J is because many have been modified.

[jetdriven]

The older ones from 1977-1980 have a higher useful load.  The later ones modified to have the higher gross weight also have similar useful loads, but at 160lbs higher weight.  

1977s also have the 153 mph gear speed, it's retrofitted via a service letter.  

1978 and later do have the more modern landing gear emergency extension, push pull engine controls as noted, and the annunciator panel, better fuel selector, and flush latch on the baggage door.  1979? got the vastly improved overhead ventilation system, but I retrofitted that.  

1984 got split folding rear seats. 

[cnoe]

I'm curious what mods make it a 205. One-piece belly came in '84 but the 205 didn't arrive until ’87. New gear door design gives you 4 mph? Are there 3 door panels? Not sure how those look.

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[Bennett]

I currently own a 1983 J, and like many others have added the one piece belly pan, and many other the 205 features like the split reclining rear seats. The 205 has rounded side windows, and a gross weight increase that via a STC applies to a relatively few earlier 201s. I see the 205 as more of a marketing ploy, or an incremental evolutionary change along the lines of just about all Mooney models. Personally, I think just about any J is a great platform to build (modify) into a fine aircraft that can meet your specific wants.

[Bennett]

One more comment. Paul at LASAR developed the the third gear door mod (that the factory used (copied?) ) on the 205. My 261 was the first to try Paul's mod, and as clever as it was, I doubt if it added more than a knot or two. I keep asking Paul if he could add the third door mod to my J, but the subject gets changed quickly to other matters. Perhaps the STC has expired, or maybe my mod was done on s field approval.

[mike_elliott]

2 hours ago, jetdriven said:

 

1984 got split folding rear seats. 

and the one piece belly

[carusoam]

Then somebody hung an IO550A on it and called it a missile...

Not to be out done, the factory took the missile idea and stretched the baggage area and called it the (280hp IO550G) O...

Not to be outdone by the factory, the Missile guys took the O and bumped it's power up to 310hp.  Making it a Standing O.

Not to be outdone by the aftermarket guys, the factory bought the 310hp STC and applied it to the O3...

So, if you like the NA type Mooney, consider everything from B,C, D, F, G, J, R, to S...

Compare their panels and included equipment.  Verify their UL.  Select the one that meets your financial needs.

A solid PPI is the best way to protect your wallet.

There have been a few fully refinished Js here.  (Better than new) style...

Best regards,

-a-

[Bennett]

As carusoam points out, you can take the basic J (and some of the older models) and convert them to real hot rods, or you can keep the engine it came with, and spend your money on paint, interior, and panel. Mooney probably has more easily available speed mods than any other certified single. Not too difficult (though expensive ) to add 7-10 KTAS with the Lopresti cowl (great ram air box), a Power Flow exhaust system, a Top Prop, and a bunch of the LASAR speed mods, plus smooth polished paint, and a well rigged wing.

[PTK]

Here's a tabulation displaying the evolution of the 201...

http://www.mooneyevents.com/201hist.xls

 

[mooniac15u]

8 hours ago, jetdriven said:

 

1984 got split folding rear seats. 

I'm pretty sure the split seats came in 1982. 

[KSMooniac]

8 hours ago, jetdriven said:  

1984 got split folding rear seats. 

I'm pretty sure the split seats came in 1982. 

Actually some late 81's have the split rear seats...starting somewhere around s/n 24-1220 as best as I can tell.

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[Cruiser]

1984 and newer all have the latest upgrades and speed mods. With the one piece belly pan being the last. Other options were added like inner gear doors and speedbrakes but they didn't effect performance so much as standard equipment and appearance. i.e round windows, interior design etc. 

[Guest Mike261]

I think we all have learned there's no simple answer to this question...when i was looking I thought i wanted the latest model i could get. I figured the rubber parts would be fresher and basically everything would be newer and would need less attention. I ended up buying a J model  from the last model year they made them. I've still had to deal with most of the issues the older models have, but yet i paid more for the newer model. Changed the motor mounts, the gear pucks need to go, new mags, there has been various and sundry other components replaced as well. The tanks will need to be sealed soon as they are starting their trademark weeping in all the telltale places.

One glaring example of newer isn't better is my fuel pressure sensor. the later models use a Kulite sensor that costs about 6 AMU...I opted for a complete JPI monitor for a little more money...in an older model the cost of the fuel pressure sensor is much more affordable, and i wouldn't have had to spring for the JPI...I'd have that nice new GPS instead.

I do like the engine monitor though, and I'm glad i have it now.

on the flip side...I have no corrosion issues to deal with, the paint is good and i have two independent magnetos not driven by a common shaft...which is a huge thing for me.

The first thing I considered when looking was safety, hence the mag setup was important. the second thing was dispatch rate...I figured pay upfront for a better platform and not have to deal with the endless little repairs. the third thing, and perhaps this is really number one...the airplane had to make me happy when i walk up to it on the ramp and see it. It has to make me smile when I open the hangar door...

I had a list of stuff i wanted. had a list of deal breakers. Separate mags were a must. didn't want a high time engine...mid time was good. I had to have auto pilot, i'm happy with all these decisions.

speed brakes were a deal breaker, had to have them, I used them a lot in the beginning while getting accustomed to the airplane. Now i hardly touch them unless i get dumped down 1000 feet on a bad vector to final on an ILS approach, they sure do make that easier. in retrospect though, they shouldn't have been on my deal breaker list.

I could have bought an older model with some of the fancy new GPS stuff for less money, and paint that would make me happy when i saw it...and i would probably be dealing with a lot of the same issues i have dealt with in my newer plane, there's a lot to weigh when you decide what year you want.

search the site and find out the common issues everyone here has dealt with. You will be dealing with them too. a lot of the issues are universal, some are particular to a model year. Fuel tanks are a big one I thought i might escape given a 1998 model...nope.

overall I am happy i decided on the model i bought...I smile every time i open the hangar door.

The rounded window corners, something about the rounded window corners...looks more modern, looks faster...totally irrational, but I had to have them.

go figure.

Mike

[Yetti]

Interesting that the 75 Fs have split reclining rear seats that the seat backs come out if needed. I think the later Fs were basically prototype models for stuff that would go on the J.

 

[Ron McBride]

My 69F has split, reclining rear seats also.  Easy to remove backs for a huge baggage area.

Ron

[kpaul]

6 hours ago, Yetti said:

Interesting that the 75 Fs have split reclining rear seats that the seat backs come out if needed. I think the later Fs were basically prototype models for stuff that would go on the J.

 

My 75F has the one piece non-reclining, not easy to remove rear seat.

[Marauder]

2 hours ago, kpaul said:

My 75F has the one piece non-reclining, not easy to remove rear seat.

That is interesting. The other 3 1975 F owners I know on this site have split rear seats like mine.

[kpaul]

30 minutes ago, Marauder said:

That is interesting. The other 3 1975 F owners I know on this site have split rear seats like mine

I wish it had the split seats.

 

Edited May 11, 2016 by kpaul

[cnoe]

Sometimes I wish my J had split seats but I'm not sure why. Unlike a certain person on this forum who's been known to transport a roto-tiller in his Rocket, about the biggest thing I've carried is my snowboard (which fit fine) or my boy Eli (95# fuzzball, shown). I'm truly curious; what's the practical use for split seats?

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[carusoam]

So your snowboard and fuzz ball can both fit at the same time.

Fuzz ball is going to have to sit up though.

Best regards,

-a-

[mooniac15u]

7 hours ago, cnoe said:

 I'm truly curious; what's the practical use for split seats?

Bicycles. 

[aviatoreb]

28 minutes ago, mooniac15u said:

Bicycles. 

Yup - I often bring bicycle(s).  Not just on fun trips.  But my business trips too.  It is how I keep fit.

[TWinter]

Split rear reclining on my 74E

It's actually pretty interesting looking at so many different configurations. Seems like some years there was a mix/match of different options. I'm assuming it would have been out of the ordinary for customers to spec order planes, but sometimes there seems to be some oddball mixes that came out of the factory.

My E has split rear seat, has emergency gear extension in the center between the seats and quad control. It was kind of a mix of E-F and J. This was the period when Mooney was bankrupt, changing ownership and production..You wonder if they were using current supply while still maintaining the builds within specs trying to keep costs to a minimum.  

I like my configuration, especially since I prefer the quad controls.

 

-Tom