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Purchase a C, E or J?

Sqrtree

By Sqrtree
in Vintage Mooneys (pre-J models)

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rbridges Grand Master

rbridges

Posted
Posted

Lots of good info everyone. I guess my hesitation with the manual gear is just familiarity. Over the years I got used to the gear handle doing all the work. Im definately open to the manual gear if the right bird comes for sale. With a combination of some speed mods and a nice panel Im going to shoot for an E. Once I get past that hurdle then it will be onto ADS-B.

depends on priority.  manual or electric would be one of my last boxes to check.  There are lots of other things that would sway my decision sooner.  The only thing I could say negative about E and F models are the cylinders are more pricey than C/G models.  Again, not something to sway my decision, but maybe something to add to your mental info.

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Bob_Belville
Bob_Belville

Well Todd, you've had a lot of great advice here. Consider this, I have a 158 kt, 50 year old E model. I suppose the panel which is ready for 2020 (GTN750 + GDL88) has traffic, weather, Stormscope, ST

Marauder
Marauder
Shadrach
Shadrach

Almost any 4 cylinder Mooney will get you withing spitting distance of 150kts (+/-10kts) it's pretty subjective as they will very depending on weight, prop installation and rigging. I met a J owner at

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Marauder Grand Master

Marauder

Posted
Posted

Great post David!

Just a few clarifications on the F:

One piece windscreen came in 1968.

All F's and J's came with 64gals usable, but extended tanks are available for both.

From the very first model in 1966 the F had a MGW OF 2740lbs

In terms of payload/range the manual gear F is likely the best of the breed as most have a real world useful load of over 1000lbs. I'm at 1060lbs. If I really went to town on the panel and replaced the generator with an alternator, I could get mine pretty close 1075lbs.

I can think of no other certified 200hp bird that will take as much....as far... as fast.

One other note, the late Fs (mid 70s) also had a 1 inch stretch over the early Fs.

;)

Bob_Belville Grand Master

Bob_Belville

Posted
Posted

Since you are a mechanic and I don't know your location... I see there is a 63 E model for sale on Craigslist in Colorado Springs. The engine is dismantled due to a cracked case. Has ok radios. Asking $11k. The lady's husband died in April and she is needing to sell it. Just thought I'd throw that out to you as a possibility and maybe help her out.

'63 E? - don't think so.

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Shadrach Grand Master

Shadrach

Posted
Posted (edited)

By way of comparison, our useful has been reduced some due to new heavier/thicker windshield and windows installations and a few add-ons, but is still 975 lbs. Full tanks: 52 x 6 = 312 lbs ... so if we top off the tanks ... there's 663 lbs for people and bags. 

Since we'll never fly much more than three without a "potty break" we could leave about ten gallons off and gain an extra 50-60 lbs. Then we could reasonably expect to carry four small to medium folks with one (1 ea.) each, small-medium bags. The bag space would be ,u first concern. 

I agree those are very solid numbers. However, if I do your exact profile I can put over 800lbs in the cabin and go about 500nm with VFR reserves.  And there is actually a reasonable amount of room for it. I'm not saying it to brag, I'm saying it because these planes have an undeserved reputation as being lousy load haulers. 

Edited by Shadrach
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Marauder Grand Master

Marauder

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Posted
That's the first I've heard of that.  Where? cabin? Tailcone? And what year?

Sorry, I deleted the in my post. This new website shows all of the control codes and I deleted the by accident.

Since everyone was comparing why their Mooney was better, thought I would declare mine was an 1" longer and get some reactions

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BigTex Mentor

BigTex

Posted
Posted

 ... I would declare mine was an 1" longer and get some reactions emoji6.png

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That's what she said...

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MyNameIsNobody Grand Master

MyNameIsNobody

Posted
Posted (edited)

Thanks for all the replies and input. Hank and Bob those are some very impressive panels you have and that is definately at the top of my list. It sounds like a clean C or E would work just fine at this point as its just me and the wife. The mission is less than 500 miles and thats just for vacation and hamburgers. Got the kids out of the house and looking forward to getting back in the air.

 

Just remember that this E owner told you to BUY THE J.  Enjoy your search.  Many have invested gobs of AMU's in more vintage of the vintage.  Those planes are out there and will continue to be available for sale in increasing numbers.  Prices for these will be high until the market reality kicks in and they sell for .50/cents on the dollar (if lucky) on their investment.  Good that you are A&P.  Interior and brakes/flaps systems will all need TLC in these 50ish year old airframes.  You will have fun upgrading, making her yours as everyone here at MS does.  The pride in ownership of brand M is obvious.  There is a LOT to love in a vintage Mooney...I just wish I had retractable rear seats in mine...Lovely AND functional.  YUMMY!  Go ahead, Break the bank.

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Edited by MyNameIsNobody
Jerry 5TJ Grand Master

Jerry 5TJ

Posted
Posted

'63 E? - don't think so.

right:  1964 was first year for the "E" and the only year "E" has rounded windows. 

E models prior to serial 400 did not have PC. Mine was sn 394.  5,000 hours and no autopilot.  

It did, BTW, have 52 gallon tanks. 

 

 

Lood Mentor

Lood

Posted
Posted (edited)

FWIW, here in South Africa, J's still sell, while vintage Mooney's don't, not even at dirt cheap prices - full stop.
When I bought my F, I was 100% sure that I was settled forever and that I would never need to upgrade. Well, it turned out that I was wrong and reality now dictates that I am married to my F. And this is very evident in all other local vintage Mooney's, up for sale.
It seems that buyers have now settled into two rather specific camps: The one lot buy's new TCA airplanes (Beech A36, Cirrus, C182, Acclaim, etc) and the others go NTCA (RV, RV, RV, a few others and did I mention RV). The situation might be different over in the US, but this seems to become the tendency, worldwide.

I would go for a J ...

Edited by Lood
Marauder Grand Master

Marauder

Posted
Posted
FWIW, here in South Africa, J's still sell, while vintage Mooney's don't, not even at dirt cheap prices - full stop.

When I bought my F, I was 100% sure that I was settled forever and that I would never need to upgrade. Well, it turned out that I was wrong and reality now dictates that I am married to my F. And this is very evident in all other local vintage Mooney's, up for sale.

It seems that buyers have now settled into two rather specific camps: The one lot buy's new TCA airplanes (Beech A36, Cirrus, C182, Acclaim, etc) and the others go NTCA (RV, RV, RV, a few others and did I mention RV). The situation might be different over in the US, but this seems to become the tendency, worldwide.

I would go for a J ...

Are you saying you don't love your F?! If so, we may need to revoke your membership in the "Love my F" club.

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neilpilot Mentor

neilpilot

Posted
Posted (edited)

right:  1964 was first year for the "E" and the only year "E" has rounded windows. 

E models prior to serial 400 did not have PC. Mine was sn 394.  5,000 hours and no autopilot.  

It did, BTW, have 52 gallon tanks. 

 

 

Depends....My first Mooney was an E model, SN 198.  It was also a 64E.  But it came off the line in 1963 and the FAA registry describes it as "1963 MOONEY M20E".  

Edited by neilpilot
nels Mentor

nels

Posted
Posted

Depends....My first Mooney was an E model, SN 198.  It was also a 64E.  But it came off the line in 1963 and the FAA registry describes it as "1963 MOONEY M20E".  

Hmmmm, maybe I'm mot stupid after all.

Gary0747 Proficient

Gary0747

Posted
Posted

F vs J ?  Only in the F can you get the simplicity, reliability and low maintence of manual gear.

Also a strong metal cowl versus the fiberglass cowl that often requires repair.   An upgraded F with a new panel is a hard value to beat. 

Jerry 5TJ Grand Master

Jerry 5TJ

Posted
Posted

Depends....My first Mooney was an E model, SN 198.  It was also a 64E.  But it came off the line in 1963 and the FAA registry describes it as "1963 MOONEY M20E".  

interesting, thanks.  So some 64s are 63s.  Similar to automobile model  "year" starting in the fall  

 

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