My Mission

[Bill_Carter]

Hi all,

 

I haven't been around here for quite a while. Due to not being able to fly much in the last couple years I had to go out to the local airport and do some training with my old instructor. Just got current again and have landed a new job that will facilitate the need for a nice cross-country plane. I need to be able to quickly travel from D.C. area to Indiana on holidays and most weekends, as well as heading down to FL and other places for vacations (out west maybe?).

 

Looking at most a 150K budget, but not sure I really want to go that high. I am considering 201, 231, 252, Bravo, lower end Ovation. I am really thinking the 201 would suit me best, but I have seen a few Bravos and an Ovation or two in that range. I sort of have analysis paralysis at the moment trying to decide. I called on a few 201s that looked good, but so far no luck.

 

I don't have any complex time and have around 100hrs total. My local CFII just sold his 201 not long ago. I missed out on that one.

[Mooneymite]

Bill, it sounds as if the 201 would be a good plane for your mission. However, the DC area is a tough area to find either a convenient, or affordable hangar.

Have you explored the various airports? Which airport will be closest to where you'll be living, or working?

[Bill_Carter]

I will be living around Manassas VA, near KHEF. 

[Bill_Carter]

Oh, once I get out to VA, I will be starting IFR training. I will try to get it knocked out and not drag it on.

[Mooneymite]

I will be living around Manassas VA, near KHEF.

KHEF is one of the better DC locations with respect to the DCA SFRA. How long is the hangar list there?

My brother kept a plane there quite a few years ago, but an outside tie-down was the best he could do.

[rbridges]

Is icing a big issue for that area during holidays? A non fiki plane may not fit his mission.

[Shadrach]

Any Mooney will work for your mission. An M20C probably delivers the most value depending on payload.  If I were single and only needed room for 2, I would get an E model. I have flown from KHGR to KMCX many times.  It's an easy nonstop in any Mooney.  

[Bill_Carter]

I just called HEF; they said there is a list of 50 for a T-Hangar, but they have tie-downs available. Auto-pilot coupled to a GPS is one of my must haves. Coupled to the HSI is even better. I haven't seen to many Cs with autopilot like that. I have been looking at Es and Fs as well though. For the most part, it will be me and my wife and dog flying. 

[Marauder]

As mentioned above, if you have a requirement to be there on a schedule, you may find the winter trips tough due to icing.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Bill_Carter]

I agree icing could be a problem and a consideration to either have FIKI or make a no-go decision if no-FIKI. What are my options if I want FIKI? Bravo or Ovation?

[The-sky-captain]

Bill- PM sent.

[Seth]

I have to say it but the Mooney Missile is in the $110k-$135k range and gives you Ovation speed and Ovation fuel burn.

 

The extra speed makes a huge difference in the DC to Indiana trip as well as the DC to FL trip.  I used to fly an M20F - 145-150 knots is great.  175-185 decreases your trip time considerably.  The fuel burn is greater per hour but the distance covered is greater as well.

 

The C, E, F, and J are going to be a better fuel burn.  The C, E, and F will be a much better price point.

 

Maybe an F manual gear J clone?

 

The M20J is fantastic, but a nice E as mentioned will be your best bang for the buck for 2 people and seats for more just in case.  If normally 1 or 2 people, a $50,000 E in great shape could be the ticket.

 

FIKI is the only concern as noted, especially in the wintertime.

 

Take care,

 

-Seth

[KSMooniac]

Even with FIKI, there is plenty of winter weather that you will want to avoid.  A former M20R w/FIKI used to do a similar commute to Connecticut from IN (I think) year-round and he posted some pretty harrowing tales.  But, he was very experienced and made good decisions, and had a well-equipped Ovation.  Even with that, many times he had to shift his schedule or take the airlines.  I'd caution you to not expect to make many or most trips in the winter time unless your schedule if flexible.

 

Having said that, any Mooney will do the job except for the winter weather ops, in which case you'll need to consider FIKI planes, of which there are far fewer.  An Ovation is probably the best choice for that route.  With low time and no instrument rating currently, it wouldn't be the worst idea in the world to start with a C/E/F or J and try out ownership, get the IR finished, and make a few trips to get some real experience.  Normally I preach buying the plane you want, and then getting proper instruction, but going from 100 hrs and no IR into a fast, heavy, complex plane with lots of systems might not be the best idea.  I also wouldn't want to leave my plane outside, but I guess you don't have much choice in the DC area.  If you concede making winter trips, then there are many more options. 

[Bill_Carter]

I think I can tone down the trips in the winter and make only those where I am sure the weather will be acceptable. Every plane I have called on so far has been under contract. Any thoughts on how to get a plane to a Mooney authorized center for a PPI when you aren't checked out in it?

[KSMooniac]

That is a tough situation... you'll likely have to hire a qualified pilot that is acceptable to the seller and his/her insurance company.  Or you can ask the seller to move it, but that takes time and money as well and the seller might not want to do so.  You should also filter out planes remotely to the extent possible by reviewing scanned logs, lots of detailed pics, AD & SB compliance records, etc. so you don't incur a lot of expense on a goose chase.  

 

EDIT:  you might consider shopping first at some of the major Mooney brokers like All American (TX) and LASAR (CA, but they're not really brokers, just listers) as they know Mooneys very well and can give the new buyer straight answers.  I know All American has worked with shops in TX to move planes for PPI work too.

[gsxrpilot]

Even if you have Mooney time, unless you're Don Kaye or Parker Woodruff, I'm probably not letting you jump in my Mooney and fly it to an MSC. The easiest way to acquire a Mooney is probably to go see Jimmy or David at All American.

 

BTW - My C would fit your avionics requirements, with an STech 30 coupled to a 530W and HSI. So they do exist.

[Bill_Carter]

Even if you have Mooney time, unless you're Don Kaye or Parker Woodruff, I'm probably not letting you jump in my Mooney and fly it to an MSC. The easiest way to acquire a Mooney is probably to go see Jimmy or David at All American.

 

BTW - My C would fit your avionics requirements, with an STech 30 coupled to a 530W and HSI. So they do exist.

 

LOL, Parker had that 252 I wish I could have bought. I don't blame you. I have been looking at AA down in Texas. I still wouldn't feel comfortable without at least a PPI by Don down there. I have only flown a 201 once. Loved it, but it sure didn't get me checked out with just one flight. Then there is the Cherokee I have been flying.....ugh. Not a bad plane really, just not for me. 

 

I might give AA a call and see what they can do for me.

[Seth]

You can also ask the local or trusted MSC's to you that you are looking.  They know their customers and often know of a plane that may be coming to market soon that could be perfect for you.  That's how I purchased my F model.  

 

The Missile was through a broker used by the seller.  www.strategicaircraft.com.  Tim represented his client well and we worked toward an agreement.  He's very knowledgeable about Mooney's and worked with Bruce Jager.  The guys at All American have a great reputation on this site (except one individual) and Tim is an alternative.  He's located in Minnesota.  All American is in Texas.

 

Let me know when you arrive in the DC area.  There's a growing group of Mooney pilots based in this region.

 

Take care,

 

-Seth

[Jerry 5TJ]

I just flew your approximate "mission" last Saturday -- Chicago to Baltimore.   It was just under 4 hours in the "C" model at 145 knots over the ground, and I burned 36 gallons.  It was mostly VMC last weekend and there was no ice as the freezing level was above 15,000.    You can fly the route year-round, but you will have to cancel more frequently in the winter. 

 

I'd want TKS if I were planning to make that trip on a schedule.   

 

There is one TKS equipped, turbo-normallized "F" model on controller.com right now.   At $79K  it is the only de-iced Mooney anywhere near your price range. 

[KSMooniac]

Except that TKS on an F cannot be FIKI...yes, it is still useful, but you could easily be called into question launching into widespread winter IMC in such a plane.

[Bill_Carter]

I called David at AA in Texas. They have all the answers it seems. Can even get me checked out for endorsement and insurance purposes. I will not be on a must go schedule going to Indiana and back. If I need to cancel or take commercial that will be OK now and then. 

 

Seth - I will be out there next week. As soon as I get settled in I plan on starting IFR. Hopefully within 3 or 4 weeks. Maybe sooner if I am lucky.

[Bill_Carter]

I see several 231s in my price range. Any reason I shouldn't consider a 231 over a 201? I have really been leaning toward a 201, but I could change my mind. Would insurance kill my wallet?

[carusoam]

Look at anything written by MSer Amelia...

East Coast pilot.

Loves her K.

Having one could improve one's writing skills...?

Search for a couple of threads regarding operation of 231s, 252s and Bravos. You get a basic engineering class including EGTs, TITs and the importance of exhaust clamps...

PPIs include some internal inspection of the turbine and oil flow through the bearings...

Great machines for more serious X-Countries. A little extra cost if you don't use the extra ability.

Best regards,

-a-

[Shadrach]

I see several 231s in my price range. Any reason I shouldn't consider a 231 over a 201? I have really been leaning toward a 201, but I could change my mind. Would insurance kill my wallet?

 

it's a great airplane, but its going to cost you more to run than a 201. I'd also bet that you will make the majority of your west bound trips down low.  I have flown from MD to IN and OH many times. I have seen as much as 246kts GS in my F at 11,500 east bound.  I have seen as little as 110kts GS westbound and that was at 3000ft.  Winds out of the west at turbo altitudes and be over 100kts on occasion.

[DonMuncy]

I have a 231. It is great on x-country trips. Ability to get over most weather, and more importantly, high enough to see the weather you need to go around, is great. It doesn't hurt to have the extra speed available at higher altitudes.

The downside is, two extra cylinders increase the cost of maintenance and overhauls. The turbocharger is another item to maintain and occasionally repair.