Jump to content

Recommended Posts

Posted

So, new-ish pilot. ~80 hours, all in Cubs and 172s. Interested in Mooneys for the speed and efficiency, like most of you.

Would a Mooney make a good first plane?

Our home field is a 2100' grass strip, with trees at either end. The 172s have STOL kits. They don't really need them, but it doesn't hurt on hot summer days. The Cubs, on the other hand... make sure your instructor is skinny when its hot out or the squirrels will be throwing acorns at you from the trees at the end of the runway.

 

 

Also, I've never actually sat in a Mooney. Anyone in NH/MA/ME mind showing me your plane? Want to see how well a 6'4" me fits in one.

Thanks

 

Posted

Welcome!

 

You'll fit fine in any Mooney, unless you're in the 300+ lb range or have really strange proportions.  Al Mooney was 6'4".  

 

I would not take a Mooney into a 2100' grass strip, especially with trees at each end.  2100 paved is fairly sporty in a Mooney, especially for a new pilot, as any extra speed on landing will very quickly eat up hundreds of feet of runway.

 

Having said that, with a good Mooney CFI, you should be able to safely transition into a Mooney without difficulty.  

  • Like 2
Posted

2100 feet of grass while "doable" is not Ideal for a mooney , our gear doesn't "like grass"  and the landings will have to be within 5 MPH of 75 mph or its going to be exciting to say the least.....  and you cant stop it with the brakes if the grass is wet......Sounds like a great field for a 182 ....

Posted
  On 12/11/2014 at 2:03 AM, KSMooniac said:

Welcome!

 

You'll fit fine in any Mooney, unless you're in the 300+ lb range or have really strange proportions.  Al Mooney was 6'4".  

 

I would not take a Mooney into a 2100' grass strip, especially with trees at each end.  2100 paved is fairly sporty in a Mooney, especially for a new pilot, as any extra speed on landing will very quickly eat up hundreds of feet of runway.

 

Having said that, with a good Mooney CFI, you should be able to safely transition into a Mooney without difficulty.  

 

I read 6'5''!

Posted

Its an awesome little airport, and about a mile from my house. I've read that Mooneys don't like to slow down, which is why I'm asking.

 

 

 

 

Dimensions: 2100 x 170 feet / 640 x 52 meters Surface: Turf in Good Condition Edge Lighting: Non-Standard
RY 02/20 NSTD LIRL; 85 FT FM RY CNTRLN.
  Runway 02 Runway 20 Gradient: 0.4 0.4 Traffic Pattern: Left Left Displaced Threshold:   300 Feet
RWY 20 NSTD DSPLCD THR; SINGLE RED/GREEN LIGHT EACH SIDE. THRESHOLD SITING SURFACE 10:1 SLOPE.
Obstacles: 50 ft Trees 120 ft from runway, 100 ft left of center 4 ft Fence 0 ft from runway
APCH SLOPE 8:1 DUE TO 60 FT TREE 490 FT FROM DSPLCD THLD 10 FT L OF CTRLN.
 
Posted

I used to visit a 2000' grass strip that was 8nm from my base, and 200 yards from work. Short body Mooneys like my C had no problems. HOWEVER:

I always went light (2 people and half tanks max)

I have a 3-blade prop for good climb

Dropping below the treetops, crosswinds always stopped

If fast, go around!

Beware if the grass is long or the ground is wet, it's hard to take off.

Beware when the grass is wet or frosty, it's hard to stop.

One time I floated 500-600 feet in ground effect, throttle at idle, and was watching the cement factory's gravel pile approach without hearing the stall horn. So I raised the flaps, the nose lifted and she sat right down. Didn't even need to brake much. The float was at about 4 feet agl; don't try this any higher!

Posted

As a 2000+ hour Mooney pilot, my advice to you is as follows:  Given your experience, runway, short field, grass strip, inexperience, obstacles, weather, temperature, humidity,  and other unknown variables, I would NOT do it. Period. Buy a Mooney, learn your plane, practice, and practice, and practice, then determine if what you airplane offers you makes perfect sense for you. Just my opinion!

  • Like 2
Posted

I'm with the rest of the gang. I've been into some small strips with my m20j 201. Hoopa is about 2,300' with a river on one end and broken pavement. No trees. I'm glad, because I have to drag it in at close to stall speed and aim for numbers. It's doable but takes precision....one time carrying an extra 5 knots and float for another 100'

I'm 6'3" and have tons room. I love my plane, but time to sell. Let me know if you're interested.

  • Like 1
Posted

I would give it some time that is I would give your self some time. Looking back when I was under 100hrs putting around in My 150 and learning the do and dont's of flight control I can't imagine myself at that stage flying a Mooney into and out of a 2000 ft grass strip. My short body is real easy to land but just as easy to screw up. Get it wrong on the field you describe could be a disaster make good choices for your mission. Honestly if I was based at that field I would likely be flying a 172 with the 180hp STC a bit slower but you can drop in and out like no body's business

Posted

The 172s I rent have no problem making it down and stopping by midfield without braking, if I get my speeds right.  They also have no problem getting out near gross.  Plenty of training does sound like a good idea, especially since I don't have my Complex endorsement.

Posted

Where is your nearest paved strip?

Get a Mooney, put it on the paved surface. Graduate to shorter and soft fields when you are ready...

Only you will know. Nobody can make that judgement for you...

There are apps that can help you measure your landing and take off skills.

There are new sensors available to help control some other important details.

Best regards,

-a-

Posted

I have to say that the recipe of Mooney + 80 hour pilot + 2100 foot runway = disaster in the making. Not to mention the grass field. The shortest I've landed on was 2375' at Oceano, CA with no obstructions at either end and I thought that's about the shortest runway I'd want to land on.

My advice is, DON'T EVEN TRY IT.

  • Like 1
Posted

I guess anyone who wants to sell his plane to you will land there within 800' :D

 

To have your own airplane in front of the door is really best, you will enjoy to be around her all the time.

In terms of soft strip, you have to evaluate the surface. Grass is not grass and 2100' is not that much, but a shortbody makes it. Check with other (experienced) pilots on site.

Sure, you should practice at an adequate field until you feel safe.

Posted
  On 12/11/2014 at 4:46 AM, UngaWunga said:

The 172s I rent have no problem making it down and stopping by midfield without braking, if I get my speeds right.  They also have no problem getting out near gross.  Plenty of training does sound like a good idea, especially since I don't have my Complex endorsement.

 

Speed control is very crucial in a mooney.  They tend to glide for a very long time if you come in the least bit fast.  I'm based at a 5k foot runway, so I don't beat myself up over 1 or 2 knots, but you'd have to be a little more wary of your numbers when landing.

Posted

Nothing wrong with buying a Mooney as your first plane I did.  I had about 150 hours and had a 15 year hiatus from flying.  Like others have said keep it at a longer paved strip and practice your short / soft field technique early and often before going to the small strip.  Load the plane up to gross during pracitce so you will know what the limits are and have a CFI with you for an objective observation.

 

 

Keep the plane as light as possible when taking off and if it is hot do your math.  Know your plane well how it floats how it lands and what you can do with it.  I regular land mine on the latter part of a grass runway but I did have the advantage of being able to get it down to just a few feet above the ground and make it float to where I want to be.

Posted

Let me start with I'm no expert by any means, I have a lot to learn.

Two weeks after Mooney purchase I took my family to Plum Island 2B2 (2100x50 asphalt, 2300x100 grass), there were no sweaty hands in or out of the paved or grass strip there (I preferred the grass actually).

At home 2400-3000' is the majority of the local airports that I use, most being grass and plenty of trees. I can land the M20F just a few hundred feet longer than a 172, little to no braking being necessary. This is safe and doable, we are not landing on a comet here.

Short fields require nailing your pattern speeds but most of all it's being ahead of the airplane the entire time. When I got my complex check out in the Mooney I asked the instructor for strips 3000' or less so my picture would be familiar when I got it home to 8GA9.

I think that the biggest challenge for a 80+hr pilot will be staying ahead of the airplane in different load and weather conditions. Weight, density altitude, crosswinds, etc. can make a huge difference in landing distance. I would recommend lots of landings at a longer paved strip using the first taxiway off before stepping up to the tree lined 2100' grass strip.

Posted

My opinion, which is only that -

Mooney as a first plane, why not! It is a great choice. 

A Mooney with a new pilot on a 2100' grass strip? That is more risk than I would take. Not impossible, but not advisable. Better check your insurance for training time, grass strips, runway length, etc.. Many policies won't allow you to land complex a/c on short or grass fields. And for good reason. 

  • Like 2
Posted

If you can safely fly in and out of a 2100' grass field consistently without any incidents then you're a hell of a better pilot than I and the average stick out there at 80 hours.

Personally, I've been flying long enough that I don't want to be an anonymous subject of an NTSB report.

  • Like 2
Posted

Familiarity breeds competence. I go in and out of 1600 feet 18 feet wide with powerlines 400 feet past with no problem. But I learned in and land it like a Taildragger. I recommend, if you can, to find some old fart Taildragger instructor to teach you in your plane. Go practice some place where it won't kill you if you mess up, and don't quit until you can actually touch down where ever you want to on the runway every time, pointed straight down the runway and not drifting to either side. The Mooney is an honest airplane will crab, slip and land crosswind just fine. It's all about speed control and understanding how to bleed off your energy to arrive with no extra at the touchdown point while keeping it pointed straight down the runway.

I was in no rush and learned on an airport that was really difficult and I think it was 694 landings before I was satisfied, and went for mycheckride. You can do it, just go do it!

Posted
  On 12/11/2014 at 2:03 AM, KSMooniac said:

 

 

I would not take a Mooney into a 2100' grass strip, especially with trees at each end.  2100 paved is fairly sporty in a Mooney, especially for a new pilot, as any extra speed on landing will very quickly eat up hundreds of feet of runway.

 

Having said that, with a good Mooney CFI, you should be able to safely transition into a Mooney without difficulty.  

 

This advice is worth it's weight in gold.  Grass and Mooney's together aren't ideal - Grass, Mooney's and short fields DO NOT go together at all.  After some practice with a Mooney qualified CFI, a 2000 Foot paved strip is about as short as you'd want to go in and out of routinely with no restrictions with winds or weight.  And that's after your really good at it.  Until 100 hours plus in a mooney I'd stick to 2500-3000 ft paved as a minimum.   

Posted

And let's say you get your Mooney and train extensively to where you are 100% on your approaches and landings. Any one here that good I know I'm not. With that being said do you have the absolute disaplin to make the go around decision if the numbers aren't exactly right and never try to force the landing every time no exceptions cause with that kind of field you likely wont be able to recover in time if you don't. The folks in Alaska fly Cessnas pipers and huskies for a reason. They are not efficient cruisers but well you know. I wish you well and hope you find a workable solution.

Posted
  On 12/11/2014 at 1:55 AM, UngaWunga said:

So, new-ish pilot. ~80 hours, all in Cubs and 172s. Interested in Mooneys for the speed and efficiency, like most of you.

Would a Mooney make a good first plane?

Our home field is a 2100' grass strip, with trees at either end. The 172s have STOL kits. They don't really need them, but it doesn't hurt on hot summer days. The Cubs, on the other hand... make sure your instructor is skinny when its hot out or the squirrels will be throwing acorns at you from the trees at the end of the runway.

Also, I've never actually sat in a Mooney. Anyone in NH/MA/ME mind showing me your plane? Want to see how well a 6'4" me fits in one.

Thanks

To answer your first question, absolutely! There's value in learning to fly in your own airplane that you'll be flying for the long term.

To answer your second question, no! You're new to flying and no Mooney time. The Mooney does not forgive sloppiness. It demands precision otherwise it will bite! But give it half a chance and it will reward you.

2000 ft strips, when light, can become routine once you learn to control airspeed with reproducible consistency.

Learn to do it in a Mooney on a long paved runway. Not on a short grass strip with trees on either end.

Personally I refuse to put my Mooney in anything unpaved. Just personal preference.

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.