Avionics upgrade; Sarasota avionics

[Bravoman]

Im biting the bullet and upgrading the panel in my 98 bravo. Putting in gtn 650 that will drive the Aspen pro I already have. Also adding 106a CDI for 430w that is already there. Also adding gtx 327 transponder and GDL 88 for traffic and wx which will be displayed on 650 and 430. Taking out old mx 20 mfd, king nav-com, CDI, and transponder which were original to aircraft.

Thinking of Having Sarasota avionics do work. The previous owner had work done there(aspen, 430w, etc) and speaks highly of them. I personally have not had installs done there but have purchased stuff from them and they seem top notch. Their pricing seems very competitive also. Thought about having my shop here in Atl. Area do work, but they are only a Garmin dealer and because of proprietary matters cannot do the install such that the 650 talks to the aspen, which is obviously important. Sarasota can get this done because they are Garmin and Aspen dealer.

I wanted to get input on Sarasota avionics and perhaps other good shops in the S.E. which can get this job done. Btw, my local shop is Avionics West at kryy which ihas done excellent work for me in the past and are really good guys.

Thanks and best regards to all. Frank

[scottfromiowa]

Don't you need 330 transponder to be compliant in a few years? Why not do that now?

[Bravoman]

No, it is my understanding that is accomplished by GDL 88 in conjunction with 327, but I will double check.

[BigTex]

Don't you need 330 transponder to be compliant in a few years? Why not do that now?

If you already have a GNS430W, all you need is to add a GTX330ES and you're good. No need for a GDL88 unless you want ADS-B in.

[Jerry 5TJ]

If you plan to fly the Bravo above FL180 you will need Mode S after January 1, 2020.   

 

See

 

http://www.faa.gov/nextgen/implementation/programs/adsb/faq/

 

"The rule specifies ADS-B Out equipment compliant with either Technical Standard Order (TSO)-C154c (Universal Access Transceiver) or TSO-C166b (1090 ES). However, to operate in Class A airspace, aircraft are required to equip with avionics certified to TSO-C166b."

[scottfromiowa]

So is a 327 with GDL 88 Mode S 2020 compliant, or do you need a 330?

[flyboy0681]

We had a lot of work done by Sarasota at their Lantana facility and they did a very good job. In early 2011 we had one of the first GTN 750's installed along with a SAM GPS Steering module, and while they did have a learning curve to contend with (namely wiring, panel space and connecting to other equipment), they had the job completed in a few short weeks. Since that time we had some other work completed by them, including a rebuild of the KX 165 and repairs to the KT 76, and each one was done right the first time at a reasonable cost.

 

I would highly recommend them.

[BigTex]

So is a 327 with GDL 88 Mode S 2020 compliant, or do you need a 330?

Scott, The GDL88 or your GPS will need to be WAAS and if you plan on flying below FL180 you are good. At or above FL180, you'll need an Extended Squitter (ES) transponder in addition to a WAAS GPS.

[Marauder]

So is a 327 with GDL 88 Mode S 2020 compliant, or do you need a 330?

Scott - above FL180 I believe you need to be on 1090 and can get this only with an ES transponder (33 or 330 ES or the KT-74 if it ever get through all of its hurdles). The GDL-88 is on 978 but will be able to get you the "in". Confused yet? I was just typing it...

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[Jerry 5TJ]

So is a 327 with GDL 88 Mode S 2020 compliant, or do you need a 330?

YES to both....

 

The 327 (Garmin transponder with Modes A and C) plus GDL 88 (with a WAAS GPS navigation source) is fine for all but class A airspace within the USA

 

and Yes,

 

You need Mode S (a Garmin 330 ES transponder is one way to comply) that meets requirements of TSO-C166b if you plan to fly above 18,000 in the USA OR if you plan to fly outside the USA where the Universal Access Transceiver (UAT) is not universally accepted.

[peter]

It seems a little unusual that "proprietary matters" prevent your Atlanta shop from interfacing to the Aspen equipment. That information is included in and is part of the Aspen STC, which you clearly have rights to since it is already installed in your aircraft ....

 

Take it to Kirk at Sarasota. They know what they are doing, do good work, and are good people that will treat you well. 

 

Peter

82 M20k 231

[Bob_Belville]

Frank, I had my panel redone ~18 months ago by Robbie Greer, Twin Lakes Avionics, @ 8A7. (Advance NC, near Winston Salem) www.greeraerospace.com/

 

New Aspen EFD 1000P, GTN750, GDL88, GTX327, GMA340,  JPI EDM 930 plus complete fabrication of the panel.

 

http://mooneyspace.com/gallery/image/33692-new-panel-dec-2012/

 

I am well satisfied. Not a single call back or squawk from all that work. We kept a WX900 Stormscape, Stec50, and KX155. They integrated all that including hard wiring for GPS696. 

 

And unlike some projects reported here, it was completed pretty close to schedule.

[Marauder]

Frank, I had my panel redone ~18 months ago by Robbie Greer, Twin Lakes Avionics, @ 8A7. (Advance NC, near Winston Salem) www.greeraerospace.com/

New Aspen EFD 1000P, GTN750, GDL88, GTX327, GMA340, JPI EDM 930 plus complete fabrication of the panel.

http://mooneyspace.com/gallery/image/33692-new-panel-dec-2012/

I am well satisfied. Not a single call back or squawk from all that work. We kept a WX900 Stormscape, Stec50, and KX155. They integrated all that including hard wiring for GPS696.

And unlike some projects reported here, it was completed pretty close to schedule.

Bob -- does any of the ADS-B stuff display on the Aspen?

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[Bob_Belville]

Bob -- does any of the ADS-B stuff display on the Aspen?

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No, just on the 750. The only graphic info I've seen displayed on the EFD is airports.

[Bob_Belville]

No, just on the 750. The only graphic info I've seen displayed on the EFD is airports.

Chris, when the Aspen is in ARC mode it displays airports. I suppose that info if from the BU GPS but I don't know for sure.

[Marauder]

Chris, when the Aspen is in ARC mode it displays airports. I suppose that info if from the BU GPS but I don't know for sure.

Bob - the PFD will display flight plan data as well as airport or Nav information regardless of whether it is in Arc or compass mode (see pictures below). The PFD (and/or) can also display weather radar from their XM source as well as lightning strike from a WX-500 and traffic from several sources.

The MFD does contain a Nav database that can be updated and does not rely on the GPS as a source.

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[Bob_Belville]

Hum, I don't see the graphic airport displays when in 360 mode. I note my pics are all @ 30 nm range while my ARC pics are tighter... that might be the difference. I get all the text info you have on the PFD but the only graphics are the airports. My stormscope is a WX900 w/o pass through capability. I have NEXRAD, traffic, etc through the GDM 88 rather than XM and none of that info passes to the PFD, I don't know if it could. But the 750 display is fine. Do you get traffic or weather on your Aspens?  

[Marauder]

Hum, I don't see the graphic airport displays when in 360 mode. I note my pics are all @ 30 nm range while my ARC pics are tighter... that might be the difference. I get all the text info you have on the PFD but the only graphics are the airports. My stormscope is a WX900 w/o pass through capability. I have NEXRAD, traffic, etc through the GDM 88 rather than XM and none of that info passes to the PFD, I don't know if it could. But the 750 display is fine. Do you get traffic or weather on your Aspens?

Not sure what year your Aspen was installed, but they went through several revisions over the past couple of years that have added a number of features.

The compass and arc mode support their own range level. In other words, if you have the map in compass mode scaled to 30 nm and you bring up the arc mode and adjust to 10 nm, when you switch back and forth, they will stay with at the range level you selected, no matter how many times you jump back and forth.

Another feature is the auto zoom. If you have an active flight plan being sent over from the GPS, you can push the range button up or down to the max range and hold it (or press and hold it a second time) and the range will show a little "A" next to the range number. What this does is keep the next active waypoint half scale all the time. It will scale up and down to keep it display. Not particularly helpful if you are going cross country and have a point 100 miles out, but on an approach with an overlay, you will see the next waypoint clearly.

If you are only seeing the airports, what happens when you select a waypoint. Do you see it? I am pretty sure they show up if they are in the flight plan. I know they do when I have the unit in arc mode and I am pretty sure they show up in compass mode (I will confirm). I do know the VORs show up.

Here is an approach into Chester County with the approach loaded and in arc mode. Quite honestly, with the PFD next to it, I usually am looking at it when I need a map view.

Currently I have nothing displaying in the way of weather or traffic displaying on the Aspens. I am waiting to see if the GDL-88 eventually or if I will need to buy the Aspen version when it is available. I use the GDL-39 with Garmin Pilot to get weather today.

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[Bob_Belville]

Chris, I had not noticed the auto zoom feature. I do know that the compass and ARC can be set on different ranges which are preserved when toggled. Waypoints and VORs are displayed. My new panel, including the PFD, was completed in November 2012, I'll have to make note of the rev.#. 

 

With the larger screen GTN750 beside it I frankly have not spent a lot of time exploring the graphics of the Aspen. There's so much good text info there, TAS, Winds, ALT alert, etc. I keep keep the ALT set, the BARO set, HDG set, GPSS on/off...

 

I have approach plates on both the 750 and the 696 but I will not continue those costs at the next renewal. I have XM radio on the 696 playing jazz. Nice.

 

Now I just have to work in a little time to look out the window. Scan management 101, I guess. 

[Bob_Belville]

Chris, FWIW, my PFD: 

MAP ver: 2.6

IOP ver.: 2.0.3

s/n: 11889

 

auto zoom is set "on" in both ARC and 360 modes.

[ArtVandelay]

Im biting the bullet and upgrading the panel in my 98 bravo. Putting in gtn 650

Thinking of Having Sarasota avionics do work.

Me too, just delivered it to PGD location to have the work done.

[Mooney_Allegro]

I've had extensive avionics upgrades done by Sarasota Avionics & I'm happy with their quality of work, attention to detail, pricing, and post support. They are very innovative as well to do their best to customize any additional requests you have.

[N601RX]

I've purchased a few large items from Sarasota to install myself before.  They have good prices and stand behind their stuff.  Recently I purchased an engine monitor and they had told me that all the sensors were included.  It later turned out that one of the sensors was not included and was an extra $300.  They stood behind what they had told me and included the sensor anyway at no additional cost.

[Bravoman]

Thanks to all for the helpful replies. I am going to have the work done by Sarasota. The only bummer is having to bring plane so far, leave it, and having to fly commercial back and forth.

[carusoam]

Cobb County, GA to Bradenton, fla....?

Trying to get a feel for how far away you need to go.

Best regards,

-a-