Mooney Factory Annual Inspection

[FAST FLIGHT OPTIONS LLC]

3 part question - I read somewhere the Mooney factory was re-opening (again) and will be conducting annual inspections.  Could anyone confirm if this is in fact the case? If they are doing annual inspections is there anyone here that may have recently used them for this purpose? If so, could you provide any feedback on your experience? Thanks

[toto]

Yes, factory service center is a thing. Promoted here by Jonny back in April:

https://mooneyspace.com/topic/42064-42022-message-from-jonnyservice-center/

 

[FAST FLIGHT OPTIONS LLC]

yea I sort of knew they said they were going to be doing them...now I'm just wondering if they actually are? 

[toto]

6 minutes ago, FAST_FLIGHT-OPTIONS_LLC said:

yea I sort of knew they said they were going to be doing them...now I'm just wondering if they actually are? 

@Brandt seemed to have good experiences at the factory service center.

https://mooneyspace.com/topic/42070-expert-annual-in-the-midwest-where-do-you-go/?do=findComment&comment=726739

 

[mike_elliott]

I just flew a plane today that has been having regular maintenance done by MIke at the factory. The owner is exceptionally happy with the service and quality he has received.

[chriscalandro]

They’re desperate for money, so if you have some to give them, I’m sure they will take it. 

[Ragsf15e]

2 hours ago, FAST_FLIGHT-OPTIONS_LLC said:

yea I sort of knew they said they were going to be doing them...now I'm just wondering if they actually are? 

I want to say maybe @LANCECASPER used them for something too?

[Brandt]

2 hours ago, toto said:

@Brandt seemed to have good experiences at the factory service center.

https://mooneyspace.com/topic/42070-expert-annual-in-the-midwest-where-do-you-go/?do=findComment&comment=726739

 

Have had engine work, metal work, avionics upgrade and annual. All flawless. 

[LANCECASPER]

35 minutes ago, Ragsf15e said:

I want to say maybe @LANCECASPER used them for something too?

Not an annual yet for me, but they do great work. Mike Kneese is a great Mooney IA, and an incredible human being.

Call me crazy but something tells me that if you did happen to need a Mooney manufactured part during your annual that's not in stock, you might get it quicker at the Factory Service Center, since on the other side of that North wall is where they make the parts..

They have gone from 15 to 30 employees in the past few months, including re-hiring an Avionics tech, Jeff, that's outstanding.

[Schllc]

I have been the service center several times, and the entire experience is everything that you could wish for. 
The people are competent, efficient, courteous and great to deal with. 
Mike is one of the nicest, most knowledgeable and decent people I’ve ever met
I haven’t  heard anything different from anyone who has actually been there for service. 
The comments with no first hand experience are neither helpful or necessary.

Can someone remind me how to block someone using an iPad?

[LANCECASPER]

3 hours ago, FAST_FLIGHT-OPTIONS_LLC said:

I read somewhere the Mooney factory was re-opening (again) and will be conducting annual inspections. Could anyone confirm if this is in fact the case? 

Go to https://www.mooney.com/ and the Factory Service Center is the first thing you see with contact info

[LANCECASPER]

4 minutes ago, Schllc said:

Can someone remind me how to block someone using an iPad?

I know how to block @chriscalandro on a computer but not an iPad.

Every once in awhile I'll override the "ignore" on one of his posts just to see if I misjudged him . . .  nope. 

[Danb]

At MOONEYMAX Jonny spoke of the Service Center doing annuals. Speaking to folks that had service there including Lance was nothing but positive. Appears there’s a lot a good reasons to get work where our planes were born.

 

[A64Pilot]

1 hour ago, LANCECASPER said:

Call me crazy but something tells me that if you did happen to need a Mooney manufactured part during your annual that's not in stock, you might get it quicker at the Factory Service Center, since on the other side of that North wall is where they make the parts..

I’d bet lunch your correct, and I don’t bet lunch unless I feel it’s a sure thing.

Plus I’d bet instead of making something work for I don’t know, like cable ends or throttle cable clamps your more likely to get the correct part.

[flyboy0681]

Seems to me that there are still a significant number of planes in the fleet still flying, most over 40 years old, and that a factory refurbishment program could be a profit center. The services would include the airframe as well as interior and panel. I don't think this is a pie in the sky concept.

[1980Mooney]

18 hours ago, flyboy0681 said:

Seems to me that there are still a significant number of planes in the fleet still flying, most over 40 years old, and that a factory refurbishment program could be a profit center. The services would include the airframe as well as interior and panel. I don't think this is a pie in the sky concept.

I suspect that Mooney will never do it because of the General Aviation Revitalization Act of 1994.  It limits manufacturer liability to 18 years even if it is proven that manufacturer negligence was involved.  If the factory "refurbishes" a 30-50 year old Mooney then the 18 year Liability clock starts again for Mooney International Corporation.  You are talking about planes many of which have been patched up or modified bespoke or with a no longer supported STC's and exposed to undocumented stresses/environment over its life.  This is not like starting with new QCed materials and controlled manufacturing process.  I can't imagine that there is enough money in it for the factory/corporation to take that kind of liability.

You are more likely to see a separate smaller shop/legal entity undertake refurbishments many times partial rather than full refurb.  In the past, many have tried full refurbs with the much larger population of Cessna C-172 and C-152 such as the Yingling Ascend 172, Redbird RedHawk, Sporty's 172LITE, and Aviat 152 Reimagined to name a few.  Only a few were refurbished, all were failed ventures and have ceased.

Additionally, if you are talking about interior and panel upgrades then there are plenty of established shops that already do that with lower overhead. 

 

Edited June 21, 2022 by 1980Mooney

[A64Pilot]

19 hours ago, flyboy0681 said:

Seems to me that there are still a significant number of planes in the fleet still flying, most over 40 years old, and that a factory refurbishment program could be a profit center. The services would include the airframe as well as interior and panel. I don't think this is a pie in the sky concept.

I concur. I used to work in Ag aviation, it had its ups and downs following commodity pricing, some years everything sold, others you couldn’t give an airplane away.

In the lean Years Air Tractor does factory refurbishments, fresh paint, new seat covers, seat belts etc as well as ensure all SB’s are done. They make money and don’t lay off as many people. I think it’s keeping jobs that drives them

I tried getting the owner of our Company interested in doing the same, but he had bigger ambitions.

 

[Guest]

I’m only guessing but I think it would be quite different taking your newer Acclaim or Ovation than your fifty year old Mooney to the factory for service.  The factory is going to have to make sure that it meets the original type certificate and any follow on STC’s that have been done over the decades.  After all they are the factory and have a reputation to uphold.  
The owner of a newer model worth $500,000 and up won’t have an issue, but meeting these standards for an older model owner or devoted CB club members may be in for a bit of surprise.  
 

Clarence

[flyboy0681]

2 hours ago, 1980Mooney said:

I suspect that Mooney will never do it because of the General Aviation Revitalization Act of 1994.  It limits manufacturer liability to 18 years even if it is proven that manufacturer negligence was involved.  If the factory "refurbishes" a 30-50 year old Mooney then the 18 year Liability clock starts again for Mooney International Corporation.  You are talking about planes many of which have been patched up or modified bespoke or with a no longer supported STC's and exposed to undocumented stresses/environment over its life.  This is not like starting with new QCed materials and controlled manufacturing process.  I can't imagine that there is enough money in it for the factory/corporation to take that kind of liability.

You are more likely to see a separate smaller shop/legal entity undertake refurbishments many times partial rather than full refurb.  In the past, many have tried full refurbs with the much larger population of Cessna C-172 and C-152 such as the Yingling Ascend 172, Redbird RedHawk, Sporty's 172LITE, and Aviat 152 Reimagined to name a few.  Only a few were refurbished, all were failed ventures and have ceased.

Additionally, if you are talking about interior and panel upgrades then there are plenty of established shops that already do that with lower overhead. 

 

It's not as if the planes would be zero timed. Not sure how installing a new interior would reset the liability clock.

[1980Mooney]

7 hours ago, flyboy0681 said:

It's not as if the planes would be zero timed. Not sure how installing a new interior would reset the liability clock.

The Refurb's that I was referencing involved replacing all the control cables (in the case of the Cessna's), bearings and hinges on the control surfaces, stripping and repriming everything (inside and out - early Cessna's were not primed internally), new glass, etc.  In the case of the Mooney that sort of Refurb would include the removal of all control rods stripped, reprimed and new Heim bearings on every rod, New bearings on all the landing gear hinges and linkages, etc.  And the tail would come off for bearings and hinges. Early J's would likely have the Lever throttle quadrant ripped out and replaced with push/pull vernier controls. and one piece belly installed, etc.  In the case of an accident after such a factory refurb, I suspect the lawyers will be all over Mooney Int. Corp.

In the case of an "interior refurbishment" I agree that a new interior by Aerocomfort, Jaeger or any number of shops including Mooney would not reset the liability clock,

[carusoam]

Nice pireps for Mooney factory service above…

-a-

[PT20J]

How long to do an annual at the factory?

[T. Peterson]

On 6/20/2022 at 2:03 PM, FAST_FLIGHT-OPTIONS_LLC said:

yea I sort of knew they said they were going to be doing them...now I'm just wondering if they actually are? 

My 231 is due in August. I called and they quoted me a price of 3800.00.

Torrey

[chriscalandro]

56 minutes ago, T. Peterson said:

My 231 is due in August. I called and they quoted me a price of 3800.00.

Torrey

Wow that’s over double what I would expect from a normal shop. 

Edited June 23, 2022 by chriscalandro

[elimansour]

1 hour ago, T. Peterson said:

My 231 is due in August. I called and they quoted me a price of 3800.00.

Torrey

That seems fairly close to what I've previously been quoted for MSC annuals for my '98 J. I think I will definitely try them out.