Teach me about audio panels

[gsxrpilot]

The PMA 450B is easily the best upgrade in my, pretty well upgraded, panel. No question about it. It's also the one upgrade that really benefits the passengers as much as the pilot.

[Davidv]

15 hours ago, Mscheuer said:

Better triple check @Davidv 

Thanks, so the PMA450B will allow the music and ATC to mix like my Bose  Bluetooth?  

[Tahir K]

I see a lot of talk about the PMA450B audio panel. Here is a great link that does an in depth review of the audio panel for those that want a deeper understanding of it's features.

 

 

[Mscheuer]

1 hour ago, Davidv said:

Thanks, so the PMA450B will allow the music and ATC to mix like my Bose  Bluetooth?  

Yes, you’d turn music mute off for the pilot (copilot and passengers can listen to their own music and set up their music muting and volume independently).

Pilot audio source selections: (independent music volume and muting)

Music 1

Music 2 

BT 1

BT 2

BT1 and BT 2

Music 1 and BT1

Music 1 and BT2

SAME FOR COPILOT

Passengers:(volume control and muting for pax)

Music 1

Music 2

BT 1

BT 2

Hope this helps.

Mark

PS Engineering

[Davidv]

30 minutes ago, Mscheuer said:

Yes, you’d turn music mute off for the pilot (copilot and passengers can listen to their own music and set up their music muting and volume independently).

Pilot audio source selections: (independent music volume and muting)

Music 1

Music 2 

BT 1

BT 2

BT1 and BT 2

Music 1 and BT1

Music 1 and BT2

SAME FOR COPILOT

Passengers:(volume control and muting for pax)

Music 1

Music 2

BT 1

BT 2

Hope this helps.

Mark

PS Engineering

Thanks Mark, maybe I’ll switch over to your panel.  I just need to see what if any drawbacks there will be on comparability for an otherwise all Garmin panel.

[jlunseth]

On 8/27/2020 at 1:50 AM, xcrmckenna said:

I’m looking to upgrade. I have a PS8000BT if you were interested.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

They have an upgrade deal. I believe the vendor name is Avionics Source. There is a thread on it around here somewhere. Trade in your old 8000 for a credit on a new 450B. Slide in install, really easy. They ship you the new unit, you do the replacement, they send you a shipping label, you ship the 8000 back. I think the credit depends on which specific 8000 model you have, BT is probably the best credit.  I did it about a month ago, easy peasy.

[carusoam]

Let’s see if the power of MS is working today...

1) We have David, an MSer looking to upgrade his audio panel...

2) We have Mark, the best audio panel builder, directly supplying support for his product... (Thanks fo the great support, Mark!)

3) We can invite Brian @bmcconnaha, the Avionics Resource guy who works with Chase (our most familiar AR guy)...

4) Avionics Resource has a discount code that Brian left us with earlier in the week...

Did I miss anything?

Go MS!

PP thoughts only, not an avionics guy... Just an ordinary MSer...

Best regards,

-a-

[Skates97]

32 minutes ago, jlunseth said:

They have an upgrade deal. I believe the vendor name is Avionics Source. There is a thread on it around here somewhere. Trade in your old 8000 for a credit on a new 450B. Slide in install, really easy. They ship you the new unit, you do the replacement, they send you a shipping label, you ship the 8000 back. I think the credit depends on which specific 8000 model you have, BT is probably the best credit.  I did it about a month ago, easy peasy.

If you need anything reach out the Chase @Avionics Source, I bought a few things from him and always a pleasure to deal with. The Dual G5's I just got from him are almost ready to go in the panel. I probably would have finished up the wiring yesterday but I need a couple more feet of the cable for the CAN BUS. Fortunately Spruce is close by, they were just closed when I figured out I was short. 

Not total thread drift, I also have a 450B going in along with a GNC 355. 

[J0nathan225]

42 minutes ago, jlunseth said:

They have an upgrade deal. I believe the vendor name is Avionics Source. There is a thread on it around here somewhere. Trade in your old 8000 for a credit on a new 450B. Slide in install, really easy. They ship you the new unit, you do the replacement, they send you a shipping label, you ship the 8000 back. I think the credit depends on which specific 8000 model you have, BT is probably the best credit.  I did it about a month ago, easy peasy.

does the 450b isolate background/panel noise better than the 8000?  Idk if I can justify the $1600 upgrade just for BT, my headphone jack works well. 

[bmcconnaha]

48 minutes ago, carusoam said:

Let’s see if the power of MS is working today...

1) We have David, an MSer looking to upgrade his audio panel...

2) We have Mark, the best audio panel builder, directly supplying support for his product... (Thanks fo the great support, Mark!)

3) We can invite Brian @bmcconnaha, the Avionics Resource guy who works with Chase (our most familiar AR guy)...

4) Avionics Resource has a discount code that Brian left us with earlier in the week...

Did I miss anything?

Go MS!

PP thoughts only, not an avionics guy... Just an ordinary MSer...

Best regards,

-a-

Thanks!

use discount code Mooney for an extra $10 off, or email me at bryan@avionicssouce.com.  

I have had two 450B and a 7000/8000 PS engineering.  all great units, but the 450b takes the cake.  soon as i can get to an avionics shop ill be putting a 450b in the J i just bought.  

[gsxrpilot]

33 minutes ago, bmcconnaha said:

soon as i can get to an avionics shop ill be putting a 450b

What do you have in there now? You might not need an avionics shop. I didn't.

[bmcconnaha]

Just now, gsxrpilot said:

What do you have in there now? You might not need an avionics shop. I didn't.

its got an old king.  def needs a shop.  unfortunately i have more pressing needs at the moment... No ads B, and my transponder decided to check out last week anyways.  they dont have time to do it all, but can get to my Lynx NGT9000 and Avidyne IFD550 this time.  next time it will be dual or triple aspens and the 450b

[Mscheuer]

4 hours ago, Davidv said:

Thanks Mark, maybe I’ll switch over to your panel.  I just need to see what if any drawbacks there will be on comparability for an otherwise all Garmin panel.

Thanks David for your vote of confidence and I don’t blame you for being cautious.

No incompatibilities what so ever. Been Plug ‘N Play since 2004 with the GMA340, not one instant of an incompatibility ever uncovered.

Like I mentioned, make sure you are clear about the Music muting of the GMA345. Ask “can I choose to have everything mute the music, only the radio mute the music, or not have the music mute at all.”  Then ask “what happens to all of the others who are listening to your music“. Remember, everyone hears either Music 1, Music 2, or Bluetooth, unless you configure switch the rear mounted switch to have the passengers always hear music 2. To the best of my know,edge, there is no music distribution.

Mark 

PS Engineering

[carusoam]

Brian,

Your commitment is awesome! 

best regards,

-a-

[Davidv]

18 hours ago, Mscheuer said:

Thanks David for your vote of confidence and I don’t blame you for being cautious.

No incompatibilities what so ever. Been Plug ‘N Play since 2004 with the GMA340, not one instant of an incompatibility ever uncovered.

Like I mentioned, make sure you are clear about the Music muting of the GMA345. Ask “can I choose to have everything mute the music, only the radio mute the music, or not have the music mute at all.”  Then ask “what happens to all of the others who are listening to your music“. Remember, everyone hears either Music 1, Music 2, or Bluetooth, unless you configure switch the rear mounted switch to have the passengers always hear music 2. To the best of my know,edge, there is no music distribution.

Mark 

PS Engineering

Thanks, I guess I’m an easy sell since I just told my installer to cancel my 345 order and get the 450b instead!

[bmcconnaha]

Just now, Davidv said:

Thanks, I guess I’m an easy sell since I just told my installer to cancel my 345 order and get the 450b instead!

let me know if you want one

[StevenL757]

On 8/30/2020 at 1:50 PM, Davidv said:

Thanks Mark, maybe I’ll switch over to your panel.  I just need to see what if any drawbacks there will be on comparability for an otherwise all Garmin panel.

Drawbacks?  I doubt you’ll find any.  You’ll love the PMA450.

[Davidv]

Yes I’m sure I will.  The only thing I was thinking about was being able to switch comms directly on the G3X but the only audio panel that will let me do that is the GMA245 which is experimental so clearly not an option.  The PMA450 has been ordered.

[thomas1142]

Just now, Davidv said:

Yes I’m sure I will.  The only thing I was thinking about was being able to switch comms directly on the G3X but the only audio panel that will let me do that is the GMA245 which is experimental so clearly not an option.  The PMA450 has been ordered.

The GMA 245R MKR, PMA works directly with the G3X, and is for certified aircraft. I called Garmin today and verified it. 

[Davidv]

Just now, thomas1142 said:

The GMA 245R MKR, PMA works directly with the G3X, and is for certified aircraft. I called Garmin today and verified it. 

Thanks, oh well, I’m sure I’ll like the PMA.

[Mscheuer]

10 hours ago, Davidv said:

Thanks, oh well, I’m sure I’ll like the PMA.

You have my word you will not be disappointed. In fact, I believe you will feel you made the best decision for your airplane’s audio system. 

Thanks for trusting 

Mark Scheuer

[Tahir K]

Does anyone have any personal experience with Sonalerts? The PMA450B can tie to the audio alerts from the Sonalerts and I was looking at replacing the GEAR UP/DOWN lights with Sonalerts to get audio verification. I have never used them but wanted to know if anyone else has and whether or not they liked them. 

[Vance Harral]

54 minutes ago, Tahir K said:

Does anyone have any personal experience with Sonalerts? The PMA450B can tie to the audio alerts from the Sonalerts and I was looking at replacing the GEAR UP/DOWN lights with Sonalerts to get audio verification. I have never used them but wanted to know if anyone else has and whether or not they liked them. 

I'm not sure your question makes sense, though I could be wrong.

First, gear up/down lights are not "alerts", they are "indicators".  If you replaced your visual indicator lights with audio indicators, that would result in a continuous noise being made any time the gear is up, or down, which is essentially all the time.  Certainly not what you want.

Mooneys do already have "alerts" for gear warning, and in all E and F models with which I'm familiar, the alert is implemented by a Mallory Sonalert.  It's likely your airplane already has a Sonalert installed for a gear warning, though it's possible it is broken and that's why you're not aware of it.  The logic which triggers the Sonalert is a combination of gear position and throttle position: the alert sounds if the gear is up and the throttle is low.  If you put your airplane on jacks, turn on the master, raise the gear, and pull the throttle lever all the way out, you should hear a tinny beeping noise - that would be the Sonalert.  It's not that loud compared to ambient cabin noise, especially when wearing headsets, so it's possible yours is working and you've just never heard it.

Whether you already have a Sonalert installed or not, understand that a Sonalert is just a piezo buzzer - an electrical device that makes an audible sound when a DC voltage is applied across its terminals.  It does not generate an electrical audio signal and therefore cannot be wired to an audio panel.  In fact, there is no "output" from a Sonalert other than air pressure waves that stimulate your eardrum.  So if you want your audio panel to make voice announcements about gear warnings, stall warnings, etc, you'll need something like an Electronics International AV-17 Voice or Aircraft Components Voice Alert 2040.  Those devices take a simple trigger input (typically a terminal being pulled from floating to ground), and produce an audio electrical signal as output, which can be wired to an unswitched input of an audio panel.  One method of hooking up a voice annunciator's input trigger is to wire it to one of the terminals of an existing Sonalert, which may be why you heard of Sonalerts being involved in voice annunciator warnings.  But you need more gizmos than just the Sonalert itself.

[Vance Harral]

So... I stand a bit corrected here, after reading the PMA-450 installation manual.  Turns out the PMA-450 does have built-in audio messages, and if you have one you don't need a separate voice annunciator.  But you still have to provide the trigger input to the PMA-450.  Note that the PMA-450 installation manual discusses *replacing* a sonalert with an audio warning.

[Mscheuer]

55 minutes ago, Vance Harral said:Note that the PMA-450 installation manual discusses *replacing* a sonalert with an audio warning.

I’m pretty sure it doesn’t say you can replace any TC part. A sonalert installed by the factory can not be removed.

flightmate is in addition to the sonalert NOT a replacement.

Sure would appreciate it if you could point me to the manual that indicates replacing something.

Thank you!

Mark