2020.....What happens when?

[RLCarter]

Ok, have a buddy that installed a GDL-82 but he hasn’t flown it in “Ruled” airspace and it doesn’t look like he will before the end of the year (down for annual). Question is once he’s going again how do you fly over say “Charlie” airspace to get your performance report?

[PaulM]

Your friend should just go fly... the avionics shop can  certify  the transponder for ADSB performance with ground test equipment.  The mode-c transponder needs its 2 year check.

 The check in rule airspace is only required  for the rebate, it has no regulatory requirement.    If the shop can't do a ground test then the pilot can get a performance report anywhere that the ground stations can receive the signal.   Qualifying for the rebate requires the 30 mins in rule airspace, but none of that is a requirement for 2020 compliance.  

[RLCarter]

Thanks, Kinda what I figured, no ground test unless his A&P/IA has the equipment, which I doubt 

[Jerry 5TJ]

The average avionics shop does not have a full Mode S + UAT test suite & so the airborne test is a good post-installation test to verify the configuration as well as the hardware.   

[Andy95W]

The avionics shops that exist inside a Class B Mode-C veil (or at a Class C airport) will probably have to have the actual test equipment to verify proper function.

[M20F-1968]

I just put in a GTX-345.  How does the rebate work?

John Breda

[flight2000]

24 minutes ago, M20F-1968 said:

I just put in a GTX-345.  How does the rebate work?

John Breda

No more rebates are available:

https://www.faa.gov/nextgen/equipadsb/rebate/

"Thank you for participating in the FAA's rebate program. We are no longer accepting new reservations. All of the 20,000 rebates have been reserved."

Brian

[carusoam]

Up to a few weeks ago...

There were a few left that would get recycled on Wednesday afternoons at exactly noon...

Trying to get the system to work was an effort in futility...

Seeing if you could answer the questions properly faster than the rebates ran out....

Let me know if anyone sees any open up on Wednesday....

Best regards,

-a-

[ZuluZulu]

3 hours ago, carusoam said:

Up to a few weeks ago...

There were a few left that would get recycled on Wednesday afternoons at exactly noon...

Trying to get the system to work was an effort in futility...

Seeing if you could answer the questions properly faster than the rebates ran out....

Let me know if anyone sees any open up on Wednesday....

Best regards,

-a-

Eastern?  Central?

[RLCarter]

3 hours ago, ZuluZulu said:

Eastern?  Central?

Eastern time, I had a rebate expire and was able to get another one 3 weeks later

[Mooneymite]

January 1 is bearing down on us.  Has anyone read/heard how ADS-B violators will be dealt with?

Will the FAA start out with a gentle reminder note sent to the address on your registration, or will your Mooney be immediately seized and sold to recoup the money spent on the rebate program the first time it crosses into forbidden airspace?

 

[Jerry 5TJ]

To a “pop-up” request I suspect that controllers will issue “remain clear” advisories to non-compliant aircraft after January 1.   
 

[RLCarter]

3 months ago they (ATC) couldn’t tell if you had the equipment or not down here, im not sure the FAA is 100% ready either 

[McMooney]

1 hour ago, Mooneymite said:

January 1 is bearing down on us.  Has anyone read/heard how ADS-B violators will be dealt with?

Will the FAA start out with a gentle reminder note sent to the address on your registration, or will your Mooney be immediately seized and sold to recoup the money spent on the rebate program the first time it crosses into forbidden airspace?

 

I'm hoping for seized and sold 8)  JK.

From an article I read the other day, there are procedures in place for noncompliant aircraft.

also according to an aopa article, due to how adsb is implemented, atc may not know the source of your position data on their screens.

 

https://www.aopa.org/news-and-media/all-news/2019/november/pilot/ads-b-and-atc

 

[Greg Ellis]

For those who are unaware, the site to get your performance report from the FAA is

https://adsbperformance.faa.gov/PAPRRequest.aspx

I did it as soon as my ADS-B was installed to make sure everything was working correctly.  I know of a couple of people who had ADS-B installed, was told by their avionics shop that all was well but failed the performance report.

The performance report looks something like the one attached.  If there is nothing in highlighted in red then everything is okay.PAPR_20190224_A89E24_70570520.pdf

[Hank]

4 hours ago, Jerry 5TJ said:

To a “pop-up” request I suspect that controllers will issue “remain clear” advisories to non-compliant aircraft after January 1.   
 

That's what ATL Approach does to me anytime I come near, VFR or IFR anyway . . . so no big change! CLT and CIN are much nicer--they let me inside the Bravo even when only transiting elsewhere [like through CLT-B going to RDU] . . .

[Mooneymite]

4 hours ago, Jerry 5TJ said:

To a “pop-up” request I suspect that controllers will issue “remain clear” advisories to non-compliant aircraft after January 1.   
 

 

I'm sure if ATC is talking to the non-compliant aircraft the situation can be worked out. 

I'm wondering about the random VFR flight, not talking to anyone which wanders into ADS-B only airspace.

Or, perhaps the non-communicating pilot who thinks his ADS-B is working, but it isn't.

What will the first indication be that there was a violation?  A public hanging, or will it be a private execution?

[Marauder]

19 minutes ago, Mooneymite said:

 

I'm sure if ATC is talking to the non-compliant aircraft the situation can be worked out. 

I'm wondering about the random VFR flight, not talking to anyone which wanders into ADS-B only airspace.

Or, perhaps the non-communicating pilot who thinks his ADS-B is working, but it isn't.

What will the first indication be that there was a violation?  A public hanging, or will it be a private execution?

I suspect it will be handled like the rules for Mode C today -- if they can determine you have it or not. I know I have heard the military bases around my area (Dover, Patuxent & McGuire) calling out GA planes by N numbers on 121.5 for heading towards restricted areas. It sounds like they have it. Not so sure, like RLCarter above stated, all of the rest of the FAA facilities have it.

[Danb]

I suspect many military bases have the equipment, a week or so ago I was inside the Desoto MOA in Alabama VFR and the controller advised there were two f-16’s approaching me would I like a heading to stay clear. My last four long cross country trips I did flight following instead of filing and had complete following from Wilmington to my destination, weather permitting significant time was saved along with the ability for me to make more efficient decisions, seems like ADSB actually is changing the system for the better.

[thinwing]

3 hours ago, Marauder said:

I suspect it will be handled like the rules for Mode C today -- if they can determine you have it or not. I know I have heard the military bases around my area (Dover, Patuxent & McGuire) calling out GA planes by N numbers on 121.5 for heading towards restricted areas. It sounds like they have it. Not so sure, like RLCarter above stated, all of the rest of the FAA facilities have it.

According to FAA website,all FAA airport towers,traffic areas and center are fully equipped,with last one about a month ago

[carusoam]

So my friend that hangs out at the airport all day... approached me and asked if I was ADSB compliant yet?

Because he saw me land, and was not getting my ADSB data on his idevice....

This is at An uncontrolled field, class G all around....

 My wishful thinking that I may someday get a rebate has come unceremoniously to completion...

Time to turn the ADSB system on....  
 

PP thoughts only, not an ADSB expert...

Best regards,

-a-

[RLCarter]

7 minutes ago, Danb said:

I suspect many military bases have the equipment

Not sure seeing not all the military aircraft are equipped with ADS-B, my guess is their equipment is much better at "Seeing" than the FAA's. Years ago I was on an IFR flight plan under military ATC , just before they handed me off they asked me to verify I was on V13, a little freaked out, both myself and my CFII checked and double checked and confirmed we were on V13, controllers replay was "Roger, we're showing you 1/4 mile to West".....lol

[EricJ]

6 minutes ago, thinwing said:

According to FAA website,all FAA airport towers,traffic areas and center are fully equipped,with last one about a month ago

We had our local Deer Valley (DVT) airport user pancake breakfast a few weeks ago and one or two of the controllers always talks for a bit and makes themselves available.   I talked to them for a while and right now they have a few display modes that they can switch between, and only one of them integrates the ADS-B data, and most of the controllers don't use it (although the guy I was talking to said that he does).   Apparently there's an issue with the data fusion in that mode where some of the traffic "stitches" (as he called it), where a target won't move for a bit and then jump to a new location.   He thought it was under development to get that fixed, but that was the situation at the time.  IIRC, he said that even in that mode they don't see tail numbers, just altitude and ground speed.   Apparently everybody squawking 1200 (which is nearly everybody around DVT) is just a blue dot to them.   He was lamenting that they're not allowed to have any kind of personal electronics during duty, otherwise he'd be using flightradar24 or similar tools to keep track of who's who a little better.

[thinwing]

That’s interesting..I assumed the controllers screen showed N number and speeds etc.,like flight aware or radar24 etc

[Hank]

4 hours ago, thinwing said:

That’s interesting..I assumed the controllers screen showed N number and speeds etc.,like flight aware or radar24 etc

Well, you know what happens when you assume . . . . .