Considering upgrade to a Mooney...

[Lowbid]

Hello all,

I currently fly a 1966 172G.  I've owned it for three years and have easily flown it over 200 hours.  I am studying to take the IFR written test but have  not started IFR lessons.  I need to go faster...and I need autopilot.  Is upgrading to a Mooney the right choice?  And which Mooney model to buy?  I would think purchasing a model with a GPS system coupled to the autopilot would be a wise choice.  I fly with a Garmin 396 currently and love it.  I am looking to spend around $100K...hopefully less.  Is there a thread discussing this issue?  If  not, let's start one!!  Thank you for your input.

[Parker_Woodruff]

Welcome to Mooneyspace.

I've owned both a C172 and a Mooney M20J.  For under $100,000, you can buy a really nice Mooney M20J or even an M20K (if you want to fly high and a bit faster).

Your cost per mile will probably be the same or less in the Mooney...just as a function of speed.  Plus, i assume your C172 has 6 cylinders.  Now you'll have 2 less to worry about if you go the M20F or M20J route.  If you can afford the M20J, get that over the M20F.  It's a much cleaner airframe and its value continues to hold.

The M20J is an excellent instrument platform.

The only thing a Mooney won't do well is go to rougher strips, especially where you need the ground clearance from the high wing.

Most Mooney M20J and M20K airframes will be equipped with an autopilot.  There's plenty out there right now.  My suggestion is get the nicest, cleanest, most well maintained airframe you can find.  If that plane happens to have nothing good in the panel, you can sell off everything that's installed and start fresh.  That said, you should be able to finda  nice M20J with a Garmin 430W and an autopilot.

[Lowbid]

Thanks for the reply.

I've seen M20J MSE's listed?  What does MSE mean and what makes it different?

Also, does a Turbo mean more fuel and maintenance costs than a non-turbo model?

[rbridges]

I trained in a 172 and bought an M20C.  I miss the 2 doors, but I love the extra 40 knots cruise speed.  I'd recommend at least a nicely equipped J model given your price range. 

[GeorgePerry]

http://www.mooneyspace.com/index.cfm?mainaction=posts&forumid=2&threadid=9

 

some reading you might enjoy...

[scottfromiowa]

MSE...Must Sell Everything...or Mooney Special Edition.  Late Model J's were called "MSE"  Round Side windows, newer model year Mid 90'sish.  Out of your price range of $100k.  Pre-1989 J is within your price range.  Look for best maintained best avionics...Split removable rear seats are A NICE OPTION and came in that time period.  If you plan to fly mountains...a lot buy a turbo.  In mid-west a J will seem like it is turbocharged vs. a 172.  Have a Leinie's Honey Weis for me, eh.  Yes, a turbo is more to overhaul and cost more to maintain generally speaking.  Say "HI" to the Gobler's up there in Altoona for me.  Good luck,  Scott

[KLRDMD]

Quote: Parker_Woodruff

 If you can afford the M20J, get that over the M20F. 

[Parker_Woodruff]

Quote: KLRDMD

Not necessarily. You can't get a J with manual gear. I've owned both electric and manual gear Mooneys and don't plan on ever going back to electric.

[Shadrach]

I have flown both F's and J's... Both are very nice aircraft. Block time wise there will likely be less than 10kts difference between the 2 airplanes in stock form. If I had a choice I would take a well modified 66-early 68 F with manual gear/flaps over a J every time...no exceptions. The modded F will be lighter, have better payload and be just as fast (some maybe faster, but that's heresay). There are some poorly modded birds out there, so fly it and get back to us with you numbers. The GW increase of 160lbs (to 2900lbs) on the later Js just put's their payloads back into F territory. The later J's do OK at the 2900lb GW, but you can certainly feel it.

My ugly old box stock F with a heavy 50amp Generator, ADF, remote compass and other crap has a FF payload of just under 700lbs.

I like Js a lot, but IMHO there is little reason (I can think of none) to by one over a similaly equiped and moded F unless you just want to spend a bit more.

[Shadrach]

Quote: Parker_Woodruff

I'm not too concerned over manual & electric gear, mainly because the Mooney gear is the simplest of any electric landing gear I've ever dealt with.  However, I would absolutely love having your RayJay TN system and feel it's the single greatest attribute of your plane.

[KLRDMD]

Quote: Parker_Woodruff

[kerry]

Barnstormers.com has a 1968 m20f for 51k.  It's got a lot of mods.  It look like a 201 MSE with the rounded windows.  It has a johnson bar manual gear and a s-tec 50 auto pilot.  Nice looking plane for the money.  Might be worth a look.

[fantom]

I'm not surprised....F owners prefer F's and J owners prefer J's.

[DaV8or]

If the OP has $100,000, I'd go for the latest and best equipted J that money can buy. The only things I can think of that could be argued in favor of the F over the J is manual gear, hydraulic flaps and retractable step. These features are only found on some '66 to '68 Fs, but not all. I think in '69 they went to standard electric gear and flaps and fixed the step. Also Fs have a slightly better view over the panel.

Other than these things, the J really is new, improved and faster in almost every way and you won't regret owning it at all. If I'd had the money, I would have gone J. On the other hand, I really do like my F and have no regrets.

[markeg1964]

My budget was around a third or a quarter of yours.  But I traded a Cessna 170A for an M20B and love my Mooney.  I miss the tail wheel and find I don’t enjoy teaching friends how to fly the Mooney like I did the Cessna but I really like flying faster.  I’m also using less fuel.  I also plan on getting my IFR in the Mooney.  See if you can't find someone to give you a ride in a Mooney and I think you will be sold.

[Lowbid]

Great discussion and very interesting to read.  Just got back from a day business trip to Madison from Eau Claire in my 172.  A great day for flying although a little windy.  Had a steady xwind both down and back, probably 20 knots.  Averaged around 95 knots both ways.  The distance to Madison is 139 nm.  Flew 3,500 Ft going down and 4,500 Ft on the way home.  Very bumpy ride home.  After flying this slow for three years, it's time to go faster.

I will definitely look into both an F and J model.  One thing about switching planes, it's time consuming.  Due diligence, etc...plus selling mine can take time...which a guy never seems to have enough of.

So my whole reason for spending a little more now is I would rather keep my next plane a LONG, LONG time rather than upgrade again five years from now.

With fuel costs increasing, it just seems that Mooney has the best performance for fuel dollars spent. 

[Parker_Woodruff]

Quote: Lowbid

Great discussion and very interesting to read.  Just got back from a day business trip to Madison from Eau Claire in my 172.  A great day for flying although a little windy.  Had a steady xwind both down and back, probably 20 knots.  Averaged around 95 knots both ways.  The distance to Madison is 139 nm.  Flew 3,500 Ft going down and 4,500 Ft on the way home.  Very bumpy ride home.  After flying this slow for three years, it's time to go faster.

I will definitely look into both an F and J model.  One thing about switching planes, it's time consuming.  Due diligence, etc...plus selling mine can take time...which a guy never seems to have enough of.

So my whole reason for spending a little more now is I would rather keep my next plane a LONG, LONG time rather than upgrade again five years from now.

With fuel costs increasing, it just seems that Mooney has the best performance for fuel dollars spent. 

[THASE]

I just listed my M20J on Controller. I love it but it's time to upgrade. By the looks of other ads there, I may be on the low side. Check it out if still interested in a 201. 

www.controller.com/listingsdetail/aircraft-for-sale/MOONEY-M20J-201/1984-MOONEY-M20J-201/1200639.htm? 

[DaV8or]

Quote: Lowbid

So my whole reason for spending a little more now is I would rather keep my next plane a LONG, LONG time rather than upgrade again five years from now.

With fuel costs increasing, it just seems that Mooney has the best performance for fuel dollars spent. 

[GeorgePerry]

THASE

Good luck getting $90K for a 5000+ hour airframe with a mid to high time motor.  Hope it works out.  For what it's worth VREF values your bird somewhere between $75-80K.