Propeller dilemma

[DonMuncy]

I had a prop strike and replaced my McCauley two blade prop with a three blade MT. The old prop had very minor damage at the tips. Figuring that I could recoup some of my loss, I took the old prop to a prop shop. The guru determined that he could repair the blades with a loss of about 1/2 inch in length. However, the book says that for a 231, no length reduction is permitted. I am well aware that one could never detect any performance degradation from a half inch prop reduction, and I would bet a large amount on money that a pre-buy would never pick up a half inch short prop, but I would never try to deceive anyone with a repaired prop that was technically illegal. The prop guru said they could repair the prop for $500. He also indicated that the blades on this prop (90DHB-16) also fit J models. If someone wanted the blades, I suspect the hub would likely be worth very little. It seems that the "hot prop" disc and whatever goes with it is only good for turbo models. I have the spinner with only some minor scratches when it was removed. I figure I could list it on Ebay and see what it would bring, but would prefer to have someone in our community have a shot at it. 

[KSMooniac]

Don, if the spinner is common to the J, I would be interested in it for mockup use, not flying it. If you feel like it still has life left in it, though, I'd rather see it go to a new owner that needs one to fly.

Sent from my VS985 4G using Tapatalk

[DAVIDWH]

Did you say prop strike?

There must be a story there somewhere??

 

[PTK]

If it's not legal for a 231, how is it for a 201?

I don't know the  legalities and I'm just curious.

Edited October 7, 2015 by PTK

[DonMuncy]

DAVIDWH,

I thought everyone had already heard me whining and moaning about my prop strike. I was taxiing on soft ground after a recent rain. I hit a low spot and the prop dug into the dirt. It was not bad at all, but in a fit of caution, I had a teardown and inspection. The insurance covered the cost of the teardown and I had enough hours SMOH that I opted for an overhaul. In addition, I changed to a 3 blade MT prop. It is really nice. Very quiet, smooth, and sexy looking. I am not astute enough to discern whether my cruise speed is affected.

PTK

Strangely enough (according to the book the prop guy checked), the shortening is legal for a J, but not for a K. He opines it is the turbo aspect which makes it illegal for a K to shorten it.

Don

[carusoam]

Thin air operations at very high altitudes, probably...  The K is certified to 20+k' (?) a little higher than the J.

Don, you are going to have to attempt uploading a photograph using the new MS software! 

Best regards,

-a-

 

Edited October 8, 2015 by carusoam

[DonMuncy]

Carusoam,

Are you wanting to see photos of the prop damage?

[carusoam]

No Don, I was just waiting to see you post a photo! 

I had to get personalized instructions from Marauder the last time I tried to post a photo...

The new MS software may be easier.

I was really interested in your new prop.  The composite MT prop is getting more traction in the Mooney community.

Scott from Kansas has one. Erik went with the four blade version on the Rocket. I was interested in one for my O a few years ago, but it wasn't available yet.

As for pictures of bad props, I've seen enough.  It doesn't take very much...

Best regards,

-a-

Edited October 8, 2015 by carusoam

[Andy95W]

I've had problems posting pictures as well.  The only luck I've had was to copy a picture and then paste it into the body of my message.  Not sure what the buttons to choose files or insert media are supposed to do.

[DonMuncy]

Carusoam,

Just for you, I have attached a photo of my hangar elf.

Don 

[Andy95W]

Perfect.  Especially the wrench he's holding. 

[Marauder]

Carusoam,

Just for you, I have attached a photo of my hangar elf.

Don 

He's a little heavier than I remember. Even a little shorter too...

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Danb]

Don, are you sure s(he)s not a special someone, kind of sweet. Eh!   BTW I just got back from Canada Eh!  I'll relearn how to tawk  by Xmas. Eh!

[DonMuncy]

As an update, in case anyone cares. I arranged a sale of the prop blades (at a price that was substantially lower than I had hoped)  predicated on my getting them repaired and certification they are airworthy for a J model.

I called the prop shop, Byam Propellers in Ft. Worth, and told them to go  ahead with the repair, subject to the airworthiness assurance. He hemmed and hawed, and said "let me see what we can do, and I will call you." After waiting several days with no call, I called back a couple of times and left word asking him to call. After a week or two, I sent him an email asking for a response. Still nothing. I was somewhat unhappy with the lack of response. Today, I went to their shop and told them I was there to pick up my prop. His only statement was "sorry we couldn't help you". I still do not know what the problem is. I'm still looking for options. The profit margin on this proposed sale is slim enough I can't see paying very much in shipping costs trying to work the deal 

[Marauder]

As an update, in case anyone cares. I arranged a sale of the prop blades (at a price that was substantially lower than I had hoped)  predicated on my getting them repaired and certification they are airworthy for a J model.

I called the prop shop, Byam Propellers in Ft. Worth, and told them to go  ahead with the repair, subject to the airworthiness assurance. He hemmed and hawed, and said "let me see what we can do, and I will call you." After waiting several days with no call, I called back a couple of times and left word asking him to call. After a week or two, I sent him an email asking for a response. Still nothing. I was somewhat unhappy with the lack of response. Today, I went to their shop and told them I was there to pick up my prop. His only statement was "sorry we couldn't help you". I still do not know what the problem is. I'm still looking for options. The profit margin on this proposed sale is slim enough I can't see paying very much in shipping costs trying to work the deal 

Sorry to hear about this.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[jetdriven]

Did you get your blades back?  The hub?  

[DonMuncy]

Yes Byron, I got the hub/blades back. They have not been disassembled.

[Danb]

Don you gotta love the repsponsevor lack thereof from some vendors, there time is all that matters.

 

Id love to see pix of the new addition.

[chrisk]

My guess is the vendor doesn't feel comfortable performing the work after they indicated they would.   Maybe it was marginal or would exceed their skill and after sleeping on it, they just don't want to proceed.   Now the vendor has to call the owner up and explain why.  Never a fun conversation, and sleeping on it more might bring in a different decision, so procrastination wins.  Perhaps not the most professional way to deal with things, but I've seen it happen.

 

 

[jclemens]

My guess is that the prop shop found out the blades are below minimums and are worth their weight in aluminum.  Donate it to a school, hang it on the wall, lean it in a corner in the hangar.  Take it apart yourself to learn how it works.  Don't fly it.  

[Cody Stallings]

I would get a second opinion.

Measuring Width an Thickness on a blade is not very time consuming.

[Awqward]

On October 7, 2015 at 05:56:53, DonMuncy said:

I had a prop strike and replaced my McCauley two blade prop with a three blade MT. The old prop had very minor damage at the tips. Figuring that I could recoup some of my loss, I took the old prop to a prop shop. The guru determined that he could repair the blades with a loss of about 1/2 inch in length. However, the book says that for a 231, no length reduction is permitted. I am well aware that one could never detect any performance degradation from a half inch prop reduction, and I would bet a large amount on money that a pre-buy would never pick up a half inch short prop, but I would never try to deceive anyone with a repaired prop that was technically illegal. The prop guru said they could repair the prop for $500. He also indicated that the blades on this prop (90DHB-16) also fit J models. If someone wanted the blades, I suspect the hub would likely be worth very little. It seems that the "hot prop" disc and whatever goes with it is only good for turbo models. I have the spinner with only some minor scratches when it was removed. I figure I could list it on Ebay and see what it would bring, but would prefer to have someone in our community have a shot at it. 

The 2A3 TCDS Rev 53 gives the following specs for the M20J propeller:

 

(a) (2) Propeller, McCauley, B2D34C214 hub, 90DHB-16E blades 
   or -16EP blades............................................................................................  49.5 lbs.  ................... -35.5 
   (See Notes 11, 16) 
   Pitch setting @ 30.0 in. Sta. (S/N 24-0378 & on) 
    Low  13.9° ±  0. 2° 
    High 33.0°  ±  0.5° 
   Diameter: Maximum 74 in. 
    Minimum allowable for repairs 73 in. 
   No further reduction permitted. 
   No reduction permitted when equipped with deice boots.