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Did Erik get a new prop???

FlyDave

By FlyDave
in General Mooney Talk

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aviatoreb
aviatoreb

I already had posted this over on one of the pictures for a reply to Seth,   "I just got it on yesterday and did a quick test flight to confirm all aspects were working well, particularly the govern

Hank
Hank

Maybe he's a visual learner? hmmm, can't paste nothing here. Guess I'll attach it below. It shows up nicely until I Save my post.  Well, got it in and it continues to shrink. Wish I could crop it to

aviatoreb
aviatoreb

Yes - I am. Finally I got the final prop.  The other was a loaner. This one is perfectly fitted.  And Nickel leading edges. Most of all - it turns the rocket into a superbly balanced airplane - it w

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aviatoreb Grand Master

aviatoreb

Posted
Posted

Ooooh - likey likey!

 

Looking forward to the pirep when you're ready Erik - I could do with the CofG movement (and the lbs!) but I'm not prepared to give up much to get it! (ok, I know I'm gonna be giving up Avgas vouchers)

 

It was CofG that got me started researching this about last Nov - and my CofG has moved back 1.6''.  I am carrying around 19lb in the tail still -and trying to decide if I will continue to do so or not.

 

The airplane feels light and harmonized in pitch now in a way it has never felt before.  Its nice to think that there is not so much massive weight on my nose wheel.

 

And I already have back a lot of weight.  30lbs.  But the impact on CG is more important.

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aviatoreb Grand Master

aviatoreb

Posted
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I already had posted this over on one of the pictures for a reply to Seth,

 

"I just got it on yesterday and did a quick test flight to confirm all aspects were working well, particularly the governor.  All checks out.  It is WAAAAAY smoother - and quieter.  I get back a good bit of prop ground clearance.  It moves my CG back 1.6'' which is a good thing on these rocket/missiles particularly that are so nose heavy.  So the airplane is feeling more light and balanced in pitch like I have never felt before.  It is clearly climbing a good bit better and shorter take off roll - and climbing cooler - even though my plane was already a fast climber and pretty cool in climb - its better.  It gives more static thrust was immediately obvious as brakes used to be able to hold 100% full thrust, but no more.  Spool up time is faster and thrust is more so it gets off the ground faster.  I have not yet done official speed tests but I can say by impression it is clearly not slower.  But the spinner that came is not quite right and I will need to wait for the correct spinner - the one that came is too short and so leaves a 4'' gap between the prop and the cowling - and I bet there is a lot of turbulence back there.  So while it may be same or faster, I doubt I will see the final full effect until I get the correct spinner.  Looks cool too eh?!!!"

 

During the one operations test flight - I flew with the AP to confirm the governor was correctly set - he watched the rpms like a hawk as second eyes to make sure I might not possibly overspeed - plus it was fun he came.  Anyway we also went up to 8500 and simply wrote down speed - so computed TAS from IAS and the long formula came out as 3knots faster.  This is interesting since the advertisement says 3 to 5 knots faster - and the flight engineer at MT says that the prop is optimized for high altitude and to expect 3 knots at middle/low altitudes and 5 at higher altitudes.  So the first quick calculation came out spot on - I will back this up with a series of tests this weekend by gps ground - I took some before numbers 1.5 weeks ago.

 

Changes:

-Climb was clearly faster (how do I test this since climb seems to dependent on the conditions of the and pitching exactly the same way?) - rockets are already superb climbers, but now it is a bit better.

-take off roll is shorter - but I do not know how to enumerate how much.  It has more static thrust and also the prop spools up faster so its off the ground in less distance.  rockets are already off the ground quickly - but now more so.

-cruise was clearly not slower, (to be tested - I will enumerate more carefully how much).  rockets are already fast - but no one complains about being more fast.

-It is astonishingly smooth - from taxi....to take off roll, to cruise - SMOOOOOOTH - it was smooth before but now it is just funny smooth - obviously not just because its a four blade (more blades are smoother) but its a compliant material, and also I would guess because the blades are slightly shorter meaning the air at the tip is not experiencing as large a mach number and resulting vorticity?  Anyway whatever reason - way smoother.

-way lighter on the tip of the nose has a major impact on CofG on an airplane that was a mod - so near the front of the CofG range at all times - at least rockets and missiles suffer this and I believe all big continental (and bravo-Lyco) Mooneys do.  I hated the idea of so much weight on my front gear, and wow it sure is a well balanced harmonized in pitch airplane now - I might not remove the tail weights after all.

-a good bit of weight back too for my weight and balance

-this prop has greater thrust than my old one - that is clear since the original engine/prop combo was 210hp (the tsio360) and the brakes were designed for this airplane.  The rocket mod is a tsio520 and my brakes could still hold full thrust.  With the new prop, now I cannot hold full thrust with brakes.  Its not a problem as I can hold almost full thrust - anyway this is a clear sign that static thrust is greater.

-it takes power to rotate a mass (through a draggy medium) and lighter prop will take less power - so the power of the engine goes more to making thrust than to rotating the heavy prop.

-On the two climb-outs I have done so far, the temps were noticably cooler at my same usual cruise climb speed.  This was not a small effect but I did not take before and after numbers to enumerate it.  This makes sense though due to what I said in the last paragraph.  Not that cooling was a problem in the rocket - rockets have superb cooling - but now it is just that much better.

-a lighter prop spins up faster - so on take off roll, or in flight, you get power more quickly if you need it.

-I have 1'' more prop clearance.  That rocket prop came off the cessna 340 and you loose clearance compared to the original 231 2-blade.  So now I get that clearance back.  I like this.

-the cessna 340 is the round tipped mcauley - isn't that a 1960s design?  So the prop is aerodynamically pretty simple.  The mt I have on there now is a highly modern scimtar-like shaped design.  So besides advanced materials, it is advanced aerodynamics.  Normally all things being equal you would think 4 blades would be slower than 3 blades, but climb better - but all things are not equal.  It is probably aerodynamically much more efficient, and it is lighter (so power goes to thrust instead of rotating the heavier mass).  SO the mcauley round tip is easy to beat.  Looking on the cessna 340 stc on the mt page it says "3 to 5 knots faster" and now I am believing it.  On the bravo mt stc page it says 2 knots faster - why so little?  Maybe the bravo prop is already pretty modern shaped and harder to beat?  But the ovation mt stc http://www.mt-propeller.com/en/entw/stcs/mooney_7.htmsays 3 to 5 knots again - so does that mean the ovation prop is not so efficient?  Now I am thinking I will get that much at least moving from the old school mcauley.

 

How did I get an mt on my rocket?  There is no stc?  MT USA got a field approval for my specific airframe-serial number.  I started talking to them in late November and paid for their time for the field approval in mid December and I think it took about 2 or 3 months for the FAA - MT did their side right away.

 

There is a "small" problem that I was hiding with the pictures I posted.  The wrong spinner came - the correct one will come in a few weeks to correct the situation.  There is at the moment about a 4.5'' gap between the spinner and the cowl - this is a substantial gap and I am guessing there is a bit of turbulence forming in that gap - meaning whatever speed tests I will take now, it will only get faster.  It also looks a little funny - side on - front on you can't see it.

 

I love it - very cool.  Now, no one else get one since currently I have the most unique/coolest mooney rocket in the world!  Baby p51.

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Houman Mentor

Houman

Posted
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wow Erik, I got to see that in person, may I ask what kind of AMU are we talking about ???

I personally like the ground clearance, I think the 3 blade prop on the Rocket is so low and prop stike is always on my mind when landing, so this might reduce those worries...

if you want, you can pm me, if you want to keep the price off public.

Thanks !

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Danb Grand Master

Danb

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Congrats on the prop and anniversary..I went away last weekend for our 45th anniversary..they said it would not last..that could still be true.

Real cool look on your rocket. Btw I named my new pup Rocket the other Cruze Missle. Had to keep the Mooneys in mind..

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aviatoreb Grand Master

aviatoreb

Posted
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You tease!!

Tell us all about it!

Yes - I am.

Finally I got the final prop.  The other was a loaner. This one is perfectly fitted.  And Nickel leading edges.

Most of all - it turns the rocket into a superbly balanced airplane - it was nose heavy in pitch, now it is very light in pitch making the whole flight experience feel as if I am in a lighter airplane, thanks to >30lbs off the nose.  This is what got me rolling toward this project in the first place - I was thinking about LR tanks and I was looking at the W&B tables.  Now I won't have a problem in that my next project.

And wow it is smoooooooth.  I mean not a little smooth - it is easily the smoothest piston airplane I have ever been in.

And it is faster but hard to say how much since I took the 3 blade macauley off in the heat of June and now I have this final MT on in the crisp autumn.  So it seems by eyeballing it that I am roughly 5 knots faster in the brief flight thurs coming home (12 min from SLK to PTD) and this mornign instrument approach practice, and briefly I let it go 75% between airports at 6500ft.  I am hoping to see even more at high altitude cruise.  Anyway I am very happy with it.  Oh and I was climbing at 1500-1700fpm sustained to 6500 where I cruised between practice airports.  This is maybe 200fpm improvement at these temps?  Hard to say since I have to remember from last year this time, but that seems right.  I have gotten >2000fpm sustained in the arctic weather temps in the past, so its always been a super climber.

So to my thinking- this is THE PRETTIEST Mooney Rocket in the fleet - ok biased a bit since it IS MINE, but hey, forgive me.  :-)

 

 

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Yes - I am.

Finally I got the final prop.  The other was a loaner. This one is perfectly fitted.  And Nickel leading edges.

Most of all - it turns the rocket into a superbly balanced airplane - it was nose heavy in pitch, now it is very light in pitch making the whole flight experience feel as if I am in a lighter airplane, thanks to >30lbs off the nose.  This is what got me rolling toward this project in the first place - I was thinking about LR tanks and I was looking at the W&B tables.  Now I won't have a problem in that my next project.

And wow it is smoooooooth.  I mean not a little smooth - it is easily the smoothest piston airplane I have ever been in.

And it is faster but hard to say how much since I took the 3 blade macauley off in the heat of June and now I have this final MT on in the crisp autumn.  So it seems by eyeballing it that I am roughly 5 knots faster in the brief flight thurs coming home (12 min from SLK to PTD) and this mornign instrument approach practice, and briefly I let it go 75% between airports at 6500ft.  I am hoping to see even more at high altitude cruise.  Anyway I am very happy with it.  Oh and I was climbing at 1500-1700fpm sustained to 6500 where I cruised between practice airports.  This is maybe 200fpm improvement at these temps?  Hard to say since I have to remember from last year this time, but that seems right.  I have gotten >2000fpm sustained in the arctic weather temps in the past, so its always been a super climber.

So to my thinking- this is THE PRETTIEST Mooney Rocket in the fleet - ok biased a bit since it IS MINE, but hey, forgive me.  :-)

 

 

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Eric,

Welcome to club MT!  It looks awesome.  I'm not sure if it's a spinner size issue or your forward mounts are sagging.  The small gap between the spinner and cowl is the same as my 400.

Clarence

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