Buyer Beware!!! 1966 M20E $35000

[mooniac15u]

My son was born 1 year after I bought my M20D and I already had a 2-year old in a carseat.  We flew around with two carseats in the back of that M20D for several years.  I am 6'5" so there wasn't an inch to spare behind the pilot's seat.

 

Of course not all carseats are the same.  We looked at all the models at Babys-R-Us and selected the ones with smaller bases and less total depth from front to back.  I don't think the store employees had ever seen someone measuring carseats with a tape measure in the store before.  The Britax Roundabout worked quite well and it is a convertible model so it can be installed front-facing or rear-facing. 

 

Carseats will fit in a short-body Mooney if you are willing to work at it.

[carusoam]

The logic is missing...

But I like how patient other Mooney pilots are.

I'm working on logic first, then patience...

If a person is physically capable of doing their own annual, they are able to do it with a certified plane using the support of a mechanic...

It may only 'sound' like owner assisted, but the money saved and experience gained is real.

Shiny new avionics are still expensive in any airplane. Sure, certified ones cost more, but they aren't free.

If your family looks at you funny for having a GU landing...

How does your family feel about getting in a plane you built that is clearly marked 'experimental' on the door?

How does your finance administrator feel about blowing a 100k wad on a box of plane parts?

Day care can be expensive. Cars with four doors will be on the list. In the next five years your kids will be playing soccer and baseball while you are in the hangar building your project.

Hopefully hangar rent doesn't hurt...

Care and feeding of a kid is a lot more complex than how to fit them through the door.

Sorry for bringing the black rain.

My oldest is getting back at me for making him sit in the back of an M20C for a decade. Oh, the humanity...

STP = Stop, Think, Plan...

Good luck,

-a-

[DaV8or]

I was looking at this plane, and actually made an offer before finding this thread.  After 2000 plus hours in my 66E, and 7 Caravans to Oshkosh, and one of the first members of the Mooney list (when it was on Compuserve), I have again found our group to be the best resource for anything Mooney.  Now, if someone will point me at a decent 65 - 67 M20E, I'll be eternally grateful.

 

Ummm... You have a '66E. Why do you need another one? Something go wrong?

[DaV8or]

I don't really claim to know what I'm doing.  I'm working on the tailkit.  So far building has been fun and not too frustrating.  I'm going to do the quickbuild wings and fuselage, but I still have no idea how long the entire thing is going to take.

 

Typically about 4-5 years if you keep faithful to the work every week. Some take up to 10 years and the majority never finish. They end up selling the partially built kit to somebody at a loss. It all depends on you and the steady work discipline as well as a steady flow of cash when needed.

 

 

A Cessna next spring would solve some of my problems, it's sooooo slow though....  I thought about a 182 instead of a 172, but I also want to get my CFI and flight instruct part time to spread the joy of aviation.  A 172 would be better for this mission vs a 182.

 

A 172 or 182 solves nothing IMO. Still old planes that the wife doesn't trust. Like others have pointed out, the car seat thing is not a big issue. Don't forget the turbo you have as well. That's huge.

 

 

And yes, the flight school here shuts down for the winter.  The airport is still open, but the instructor goes to Florida because winters here suck.

 

Ask around. There is likely a CFI in the area that will work with you in the winter. They don't all run off to warmer climes.

[sufferingcadet]

Yeah, I think the statistic is that only 10% of people who start a kit finish, so that's kind of disheartening.  I want to do as much as I can and if I get to the point where I want to quit, I figure I could take it to a builders assistance place and get help getting it finished up.  http://saintaviation.com/ helps complete builds finish in a month but it's expensive.  I figure maybe finishing a kit may be feasible though or just paying whatever versus calling it quits.  However, only time will tell.

 

A 172 would be great if I became an independent CFI.  The RV would definitely not be good for giving flight training.  You're absolutely right that the wife won't be impressed with a 172 or 182 in terms of condition.

 

I personally LOVE the turbo on my mooney, but I know that wife and kid would not be good with oxygen.  It really is hard enough to convince the wife to fly as it is, so I would like to keep the experience as comfortable and pleasant for her as possible.  Maybe slowly wean her into how the world of small airplanes and general aviation work.  She's only flown once with me while she's been pregnant and refused to fly after because she was worried about the propeller noise affecting the baby.  I could find no research to support that idea, but noone listens to me...

 

I'll ask about CFIs, but it's a small airport.  It would not suprise me if he was the only gig in town.  Same goes for maintenance, we only have one mechanic and there's only enough work at the airport for him part time.  It's so slow here that he has a regular day job too. 

[DaV8or]

If a person is physically capable of doing their own annual, they are able to do it with a certified plane using the support of a mechanic...

 

I agree with you but... people tend to toss this out as though it is simple thing to do. It's not a mechanic you need, it's an A&P with IA. The vast majority of these have no interest in saving some aircraft owner some money and putting his or her name on work they didn't do. Finding these guys isn't always easy and in some people's cases, it's not possible without significant travel.

[kerry]

I have a friend who dumped his Bravo and built a RV-10.  Took him a little more than a year to complete the airplane. It was his first time building an airplane.  He worked on it everyday with his wife beside him.  No reason for him to have an airplane while building because there was no time to fly, plus it gave him more desire to complete the project. He says the RV-10 wins hands down over the turbo bravo.  The plane turned out beautiful.  A lot what Chris says does make sense if you have the time to build.   

[carusoam]

Dave,

Sorry, I was too focused on the work that a pilot can do, and glossed over some important detail.

Our cadet has an interesting conundrum...

If he came back with your A&P and IA response based on his annual experience, he would be making sense, and well on his way to building a plane.

What is the price of raising a child lately?

Somewhere between the price of a well equipped M20E and an R, I hear...

This is why Mooney doesn't have many five seaters. Nobody has the dough to buy the plane and fill the seats....

Leaving out some detail may make it bearable...

Best regards,

-a-

[carusoam]

Kerry,

Was that a few hours a day?

Or that was his job for a year?

His wife worked with him?

Those are signs of commitment...

Best regards,

-a-

[kerry]

He put in many hours per day and his business allowed him the time to do it.  His wife would help on the parts that required extra hands.  She would climb in the fuselage and back the rivets as he hammered them.  I was so surprised how fast he built that plane.  I remember telling him there's no way I could do what he achieved in building an RV-10.  He answered me by saying "if I can do it then anyone can do it."  The plane is absolutely beautiful and I believe in ever way its better plane compared to a Mooney, but I'm shallow and I'm a sucker for the esthetics of a sexy wheels up Mooney.

[kerry]

Jim's rv10 http://flightaware.com/photos/view/2295437-0169e8ea70cb9e4e625c59759b17ebcf91e92ef4/aircrafttype/RV10/sort/votes/page/3

[Marauder]

Kerry,

Was that a few hours a day?

Or that was his job for a year?

His wife worked with him?

Those are signs of commitment...

Best regards,

-a-

Anthony -- sort of like the dedication we saw at the Flying W when we did that fly-in there. Remember the old guy working on some sort of amphib that Alan showed us? Wonder if he ever finished it.

He had to be in his 90s.

[carusoam]

Chris,

I remember that like it was only a decade ago. Fly-in / Drive-in depending on your situation...

You can only imagine what I was thinking...

Pay the bills....

Live like there will always be a tomorrow?

That guy had a plan!

He defined the term positive outlook on life...

Thank you,

-a-

[tonyk628]

I'm the one who started this mess, so my 2cents for what they are worth...  This COULD be a great plane, NDH, complete logs, apparently no internal corrosion; just treated surface stuff.  Easy 180KTAS in the low teens with the Turbo sipping gas for a range of 1200NM by my calculation with the Monroys.  The owner is has been upfront with what it needs, but it NEEDS a lot.  Tank seal (fuel smell in the cockpit; its been patched a few times in it's life, 48 years is time to do the job right), Avionics, Paint, Interior, Windows.  I was going to be buying the plane for $22k when the broker decided that he didn't like the deal he made with me and put it on ebay.  Anything more than that and it's wasn't really worth it to me for what it needs, by my calculator it needs $30-40k to be a good plane, more to be great.  To put it all in perspective the previous owner who did supposedly $20k in engine work and owned the plane for quite a few years sold it to the broker in CA for $20.5k who then flipped it, and then this thread was born.  
 

[Bravoman]

My advice to all... "Walk away" Life is too short to be arguing over this stuff. There are other Mooneys out there to buy, as there is others buyers to sell to... Sent from my overpriced iPad using Tapatalk

Marauder, I got to tell you, being the brash New Yorker that I am, you are hands down one of my favorite dudes on this board!

[Bravoman]

My advice to all... "Walk away" Life is too short to be arguing over this stuff. There are other Mooneys out there to buy, as there is others buyers to sell to... Sent from my overpriced iPad using Tapatalk

Marauder, I got to tell you, being the brash New Yorker that I am, you are hands down one of my favorite dudes on this board!

Oh, I get it now.... It is a Ménage à trois. Sent from my overpriced iPad using Tapatalk

Actually that is what I was trying to quote

[Marauder]

Marauder, I got to tell you, being the brash New Yorker that I am, you are hands down one of my favorite dudes on this board!

Actually that is what I was trying to quote

Thanks Man. I appreciate the comment. I hope this doesn't mean we're in a relationship now. I am actually holding out for Stinky Pants...

a.k.a. Parrot Man. I think our kid would be real cute

[kmyfm20s]

Wow, sound like a formation flight in all your futures:)

[fantom]

Thanks Man. I appreciate the comment. I hope this doesn't mean we're in a relationship now. I am actually holding out for Stinky Pants...

]

A step UP from your rotund female friend, who probably has her own unique aroma.

[rbridges]

A step UP from your rotund female friend, who probably has her own unique aroma.

 

 

good job.  now he's going to end up posting her pic and we're all going to turn gay from looking at it.

[ryoder]

I really like the idea of a brand new four place. If I did a build I might build the Sling 4 which is cheaper to operate than a RV10. All planes are fun and cool but the maintenance of a part 23 old airplane can kill you. So I get it when people want new ones. I only buy brand new cars and stay under factory warranty. I have also only bought new homes and appreciate the new home smell and low maintenance costs. Of course everyone does what they want with their money and it's a free country so whatever you do, don't try to please a single person in the internet message boards. It really only matters what you want as you have to live with the decision.

[rbridges]

. Of course everyone does what they want with their money and it's a free country so whatever you do, don't try to please a single person in the internet message boards. It really only matters what you want as you have to live with the decision.

 

I guess we should lay off Marauder's choice of fat girlfriends.  

[Hank]

I guess we should lay off Marauder's choice of fat girlfriends.

Only if he lays off the pictures . . .

(Now I jinxed us, he'll post it again for sure. Sorry!)

[Marauder]

Only if he lays off the pictures . . .

(Now I jinxed us, he'll post it again for sure. Sorry!)

 

I tried to hold off, but NO, you couldn't leave well enough alone. You left me no choice...

 

My harem...

 

 

 

 

 

You guys are just jealous. What my women lack in looks, they make up for in tonnage.

[Hank]

Thanks for using thumbnails this time! Full size photos would have crashed the server.

What did this thread used to be about?