Locked in my Mooney! Send help…

[Joe Larussa]

Landed today after an hour flight. Taxied to my hangar and the door latch wouldn’t move. So this is how it ends I was thinking. I called my A&P and he just happened to be around the corner. I handed him the key through the tiny window and he unlocked the door. Apparently the lock cylinder had turned in flight and locked the door from the outside. I’m guessing it’s time to remove it and take it to a locksmith? Lol

[hammdo]

Oh, the joy… hope I don’t go into a ghost town airport and have that happen…

you were very lucky - and I assume you had a phone…

-Don

[DCarlton]

Happened to me once too.  Was able to radio the FBO and have them come open the door from the outside.  Since then, I’ve wondered how hard it would be to kick the door open if necessary.  

[Joe Larussa]

26 minutes ago, DCarlton said:

Happened to me once too.  Was able to radio the FBO and have them come open the door from the outside.  Since then, I’ve wondered how hard it would be to kick the door open if necessary.  

I had terrible visions of the jaws of life opening my door like a can opener.

[hais]

1 hour ago, Joe Larussa said:

Landed today after an hour flight. Taxied to my hangar and the door latch wouldn’t move. So this is how it ends I was thinking. I called my A&P and he just happened to be around the corner. I handed him the key through the tiny window and he unlocked the door. Apparently the lock cylinder had turned in flight and locked the door from the outside. I’m guessing it’s time to remove it and take it to a locksmith? Lol

Why not the cargo door? It came in handy for me in a similar scenario. My predicament was maintenance induced. A MSC did not secure the latching bolts, and they shifted in flight.

[ArtVandelay]

Why not the cargo door? It came in handy for me in a similar scenario. My predicament was maintenance induced. A MSC did not secure the latching bolts, and they shifted in flight.

I usually lock the baggage door since it has been known to pop open.

[Graf_Aviator]

I usually lock the baggage door since it has been known to pop open.

With the emergency release you can still open a locked cargo door from the inside…


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[Greg Ellis]

1 hour ago, Graf_Aviator said:

With the emergency release you can still open a locked cargo door from the inside…


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Unfortunately, like my 63 C model, not all Mooney's have an emergency release.  There are plans for retrofits but not all of them have it.

[Graf_Aviator]

Unfortunately, like my 63 C model, not all Mooney's have an emergency release.  There are plans for retrofits but not all of them have it.

Thanks for clarifying! Was not aware of that!
However, that is quite scary actually…


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[dkkim73]

10 hours ago, Joe Larussa said:

Apparently the lock cylinder had turned in flight and locked the door from the outside. I’m guessing it’s time to remove it and take it to a locksmith? Lol

Wow, that's a big potential emergency egress issue. TY for sharing. Are the designs the same on all M20's I wonder? I'll have to look at the design sometime. 

At least my baggage door is supposed to open from the inside, even while locked...

[Shadrach]

11 hours ago, Joe Larussa said:

Landed today after an hour flight. Taxied to my hangar and the door latch wouldn’t move. So this is how it ends I was thinking. I called my A&P and he just happened to be around the corner. I handed him the key through the tiny window and he unlocked the door. Apparently the lock cylinder had turned in flight and locked the door from the outside. I’m guessing it’s time to remove it and take it to a locksmith? Lol

Unfortunately, this is a bug with the Medeco door locks. It has happened in our plane a few times to different operators. It has always occurred on a flight that followed the unlocking of a locked door. Apparently if the Medeco locks are not rotated to the stop in the unlock position, they can  back off just enough to prevent the door latch for moving.

It happened to me once after landing after hours at drome away from home. Took several passes before I could get security to stops and pass him the key through the pilot’s window. 
I sat there thinking how grateful I was to not be on fire. I fashioned a cable release for the baggage door shortly there after.

Even without a baggage door cable, I am pretty sure that I could pry the inner trim off the baggage door and actuate the latch pretty quickly…but I would not want to do that in an emergency.

[Shadrach]

10 hours ago, DCarlton said:

Happened to me once too.  Was able to radio the FBO and have them come open the door from the outside.  Since then, I’ve wondered how hard it would be to kick the door open if necessary.  

It’s pretty robust as I think the strike plate is anchored to the roll cage. It’s likely doable for someone with a fairly substantial build, but would take multiple blows. The Pilots side window might be a better bet as it’s already structurally compromised by the small window.

Again prying the trim off baggage door with screwdriver will give access to the latch mechanism. I never fly with the baggage door locked as that would take it out of the equation as an emergency exit.

[DCarlton]

1 hour ago, Shadrach said:

It’s pretty robust as I think the strike plate is anchored to the roll cage. It’s likely doable for someone with a fairly substantial build, but would take multiple blows. The Pilots side window might be a better bet as it’s already structurally compromised by the small window.

Again prying the trim off baggage door with screwdriver will give access to the latch mechanism. I never fly with the baggage door locked as that would take it out of the equation as an emergency exit.

I've never been comfortable flying without the baggage door locked.  I think I could kick the door open if I had to but yes it would take multiple blows.  

[Shadrach]

3 minutes ago, DCarlton said:

I've never been comfortable flying without the baggage door locked.  I think I could kick the door open if I had to but yes it would take multiple blows.  

Why?  I can envision no scenario where a latched baggage door "unlatches".  It has striker plates and latch pins on the fore and aft sides of the opening with a full length piano hinge at the top. It's far more robust than it needs to be (look at a Cessna baggage door sometime).  In order to open, the over center mechanism in the latch would need to defy physics and then in addition push the flat latch actuator forward and out into the slipstream. If all that takes place, I am pretty sure whatever super natural force that wants the door open can work around the Medeco lock.

[201Mooniac]

1 hour ago, Shadrach said:

It’s pretty robust as I think the strike plate is anchored to the roll cage. It’s likely doable for someone with a fairly substantial build, but would take multiple blows. The Pilots side window might be a better bet as it’s already structurally compromised by the small window.

I agree, the door is pretty robust but with the side windows you should be able to kick them out.

[Shadrach]

Just now, 201Mooniac said:

I agree, the door is pretty robust but with the side windows you should be able to kick them out.

The door window is secured with 18 machine screws and lock nuts that hold down 9 rectangular aluminum plates that sandwich the window against at least 1" of of overlapping door skin to which it is glued.  I'm not saying you could not break it, but it is not going to be easy, mostly because it will flex, distributing and absorbing the energy from a kick

[PeteMc]

13 hours ago, Joe Larussa said:

Apparently the lock cylinder had turned in flight and locked the door from the outside.

Is this the good ol' Mooney lock (he says with a bit of a smirk) or did you ever have it replaced? 

And I'm guessing my K has the same type cylinder as your J.

 

[dkkim73]

3 hours ago, Shadrach said:

Unfortunately, this is a bug with the Medeco door locks. It has happened in our plane a few times to different operators. It has always occurred on a flight that followed the unlocking of a locked door. Apparently if the Medeco locks are not rotated to the stop in the unlock position, they can  back off just enough to prevent the door latch for moving.

@Joe Larussa Was your door lock a Medeco as well? 

I have a Medeco cylinder for the ignition, but a conventional pin tumbler lock (short-key, I think 5 pins or so) in the door and baggage compartment. Do the conventional locks not suffer from the spontaneous rotation problem? 

I've always known Medeco were secure. Really secure, apparently, locking themselves...

[Shadrach]

29 minutes ago, dkkim73 said:

@Joe Larussa Was your door lock a Medeco as well? 

I have a Medeco cylinder for the ignition, but a conventional pin tumbler lock (short-key, I think 5 pins or so) in the door and baggage compartment. Do the conventional locks not suffer from the spontaneous rotation problem? 

I've always known Medeco were secure. Really secure, apparently, locking themselves...

I was assuming that my baggage and door locks were Medeco because the keys are identical to my Bendix ignition all are cut differently. Some of my key say Medeco some are unbranded but they all slide perfectly in tall all of the locks/ignition. I know because I have an unlabeled set and If I use them it almost always takes three tries to get the right one no matter what I’m trying to do. The locks both look like a simple cabinet lock as @kortopates mentions above.  

[LANCECASPER]

1 hour ago, Shadrach said:

I was assuming that my baggage and door locks were Medeco because the keys are identical to my Bendix ignition all are cut differently. Some of my key say Medeco some are unbranded but they all slide perfectly in tall all of the locks/ignition. I know because I have an unlabeled set and If I use them it almost always takes three tries to get the right one no matter what I’m trying to do. The locks both look like a simple cabinet lock as [mention=7862]kortopates[/mention] mentions above.  

Medeco are high security locks. Aircraftsecurity.com sells them and if you buy from them then replacements have to come from them. These are not Bendix ignition keys.

If your Mooney came with them, replacements have to be ordered from Mooney.


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[ArtVandelay]

Before damaging my plane I would just call 911 if there was nobody working at the airport.

[Shadrach]

59 minutes ago, LANCECASPER said:

Medeco are high security locks. Aircraftsecurity.com sells them and if you buy from thn replacements have to come from them. These are not Bendix ignition keys.

If your Mooney came with them, replacements have to be ordered from Mooney.


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It's entirely possible that I am conflating key sets from different aircraft from my past. 

[Shadrach]

56 minutes ago, ArtVandelay said:

Before damaging my plane I would just call 911 if there was nobody working at the airport.

I think the egress comments were centered around an emergency. As in jammed lock after a crash and potential fire hazard.

[natdm]

4 hours ago, Shadrach said:

Why?  I can envision no scenario where a latched baggage door "unlatches".  It has striker plates and latch pins on the fore and aft sides of the opening with a full length piano hinge at the top. It's far more robust than it needs to be (look at a Cessna baggage door sometime).  In order to open, the over center mechanism in the latch would need to defy physics and then in addition push the flat latch actuator forward and out into the slipstream. If all that takes place, I am pretty sure whatever super natural force that wants the door open can work around the Medeco lock.

Isn't there some video of someone's baggage door coming undone and wrapping around the elevator? I think it was a J or K model? 

Did the pilot do something wrong, or was it the door coming undone? 

I lock mine since it scares the sh** out of me to have that happen. 

Edit: Looks like there was something mechanically wrong with the door.
 

 

[Shadrach]

52 minutes ago, natdm said:

Isn't there some video of someone's baggage door coming undone and wrapping around the elevator? I think it was a J or K model? 

Did the pilot do something wrong, or was it the door coming undone? 

I lock mine since it scares the sh** out of me to have that happen. 

Yes,  I’ve seen the dramatic footage. 
 

That incident was apparently a maintenance induced failure. I am not familiar with the “safety clip” referenced in the accident report.

The latch on my bird is pretty much bomb proof. The only benefit I can see to locking it before flight is that it forces the pilot to make sure that the latch is closed.