For those mechanics and others that ignore manuals and still pull the tail down cause it’s always worked before

[KB4]

 

[N201MKTurbo]

That’s a funny looking Mooney.

[N201MKTurbo]

It looks to me like the tail stand failed, not the tie down hook. If you watch the video you can see the two telescoping metal tubes moving with relation to each other. I think the pin or bolt holding them together came out. I think the tie down broke after the tail stand failed. 

[N201MKTurbo]

Can you show in the Questair Venture maintenance manual where you cannot use a tail stand for jacking?

[KB4]

4 minutes ago, N201MKTurbo said:

Can you show in the Questair Venture maintenance manual where you cannot use a tail stand for jacking?

Is pulling down the tail unique to Questair?  or whatever that thing is.  No bud it’s not. I think I posted to a Mooney site No?
 

Why?
Many here use this technique despite MM guidance, and I don’t want any member to experience that. 

[RoundTwo]

The guy is an idiot and is at total fault for what happened. The tie down ring failed as a result of the accident. It didn’t cause it.

I submit two screen captures of his video. His tail tie down is not bolted together. The only thing holding down the tail is the winch cable. The winch started to back off and his sections of strut simply slipped apart until the ends met. Look at the red knob on the spool of the winch, see how it has moved. This belongs in the Hangar Fails Compilation of 2023.

[Shadrach]

3 hours ago, KB4 said:

Is pulling down the tail unique to Questair?  or whatever that thing is.  No bud it’s not. I think I posted to a Mooney site No?
 

Why?
Many here use this technique despite MM guidance, and I don’t want any member to experience that. 

The video is misleading. It’s obvious that the tail stand was not properly secured. It looks as though he was using the winch to hold the tail down and it went slack. This thread is just as misleading. The only case it makes is that the OP has a very poorly constructed axe to grind…

[KB4]

I know the haters will hate. Do what MM recommends against.  This video isn’t for you if you have macho invulnerability.
 

 it’s an example of what CANNOT happen if Mooney MM is followed.

That’s all. Not an accident investigation video. There are no cases to be made. No axes, sorry to burst ur worthless addition to the thread.  Your comment has zero substance, just weird, speculation and conjecture without any basis of support.  Schmucks are what they are. 

[N201MKTurbo]

It would be better if you could show some damage to a Mooney from using a tail stand. I’ve never seen any. 
 

The only one hating around here seems to be you.

[ragedracer1977]

8 hours ago, KB4 said:

 

Just watched it frame by frame. Had nothing to do with tying it by the tail. It was his stupidity. His stand wasn’t long enough. The 2 sections were so close to separating, he couldn’t get a pin in the holes and was relying on the cheap winch, which failed.  
 

 

[ragedracer1977]

5 hours ago, RoundTwo said:

The guy is an idiot and is at total fault for what happened. The tie down ring failed as a result of the accident. It didn’t cause it.

I submit two screen captures of his video. His tail tie down is not bolted together. The only thing holding down the tail is the winch cable. The winch started to back off and his sections of strut simply slipped apart until the ends met. Look at the red knob on the spool of the winch, see how it has moved. This belongs in the Hangar Fails Compilation of 2023.

Jesus Christ, look at his jacks. I didn’t even notice that at first

[Skates97]

57 minutes ago, ragedracer1977 said:

Jesus Christ, look at his jacks. I didn’t even notice that at first

I've seen some bad home built ones, but bad home built with extensions on top? Good grief! 

[EricJ]

1 hour ago, ragedracer1977 said:

Jesus Christ, look at his jacks. I didn’t even notice that at first

Yeah, the whole jack and tail stand arrangement was a failure waiting to happen.    +1 that the janky tailstand failed first and caused the tie down casting to fail.   This has zero to do with how anybody decides to support a Mooney, since the Mooney MM methodology has changed several times over the evolution of the MM.  The old MM's said to use a prop stand, but now we know that's not a good thing to do.   The MMs have all kinds of things that have to be taken as suggestions rather than gospel.   They're not FAA Approved.

That video is a testament to how not to build jacks and stands.

[skykrawler]

Hmm.  Why is it called a tail stand when it's pulling down?

[KB4]

16 hours ago, N201MKTurbo said:

It would be better if you could show some damage to a Mooney from using a tail stand. I’ve never seen any. 
 

The only one hating around here seems to be you.

Reasons why members have left.  Some just feel the need to personally attack and criticize without any substance to their posts.  Please reread the post.  This isn’t for you!  It’s for those that follow or want to follow the MM. not for those that know more than the manufacturer.  
 

Didn’t always agree with him, but he shared his insights here and many including me, valued his Mooney knowledge.  Who? Try searching gsxrpilot.  He’s gone now. Why?
 

 Only reason I’m sticking around is for Clarence not you or anyone else who chases the good talent away from MS. 

[201Steve]

@KB4 Don’t take yourself so daggum serious. It was a poor example of a matter you are clearly passionate about. You should have just DM’d Clarence and gsxr about it.   It’s the internet, good luck governing it. Woosah. 

[EricJ]

1 hour ago, KB4 said:

Reasons why members have left.  Some just feel the need to personally attack and criticize without any substance to their posts.  Please reread the post.  This isn’t for you!  It’s for those that follow or want to follow the MM. not for those that know more than the manufacturer.  
 

Didn’t always agree with him, but he shared his insights here and many including me, valued his Mooney knowledge.  Who? Try searching gsxrpilot.  He’s gone now. Why?
 

 Only reason I’m sticking around is for Clarence not you or anyone else who chases the good talent away from MS. 

I'd suggest the title you gave the thread kinda set the tone.    If that wasn't what you wanted, then an edit might be a good idea.

[N201MKTurbo]

3 hours ago, KB4 said:

Reasons why members have left.  Some just feel the need to personally attack and criticize without any substance to their posts.  Please reread the post.  This isn’t for you!  It’s for those that follow or want to follow the MM. not for those that know more than the manufacturer.  
 

Didn’t always agree with him, but he shared his insights here and many including me, valued his Mooney knowledge.  Who? Try searching gsxrpilot.  He’s gone now. Why?
 

 Only reason I’m sticking around is for Clarence not you or anyone else who chases the good talent away from MS. 

Huh, I thought @gsxrpilot isn’t around much because he sold his Mooney.

[N201MKTurbo]

2 minutes ago, bluehighwayflyer said:

I thought he left because he got offended by criticism here of the Mooney Caravan’s handling of the in-flight collision they suffered a few years ago en route to Oshkosh, but as far as I know, he never said why he left. He just left.

It’s a shame. Paul is a nice guy.

I didn’t follow that thread. It was to emotional for me. So, you are probably right. I PMed him a few times and he was always decent to me.

[EricJ]

17 minutes ago, N201MKTurbo said:

Huh, I thought @gsxrpilot isn’t around much because he sold his Mooney.

I think he still has his airplane.   He's on the Mooney FB groups from time to time.

And, yeah, I miss his posts here, too.

[EricJ]

10 minutes ago, bluehighwayflyer said:

I thought he left because he got offended by criticism here of the Mooney Caravan’s handling of the in-flight collision they suffered a few years ago en route to Oshkosh, but as far as I know, he never said why he left. He just left.

It’s a shame. Paul is a nice guy.

Apparently there were a few who didn't like that, although I don't know that Paul was one of them.   It seemed odd and unfortunate to me because I thought the criticisms of the incident handling were fair.

I've kept my fingers crossed that he starts posting here again, as I always found his contributions worthwhile.

[201Steve]

Paul’s engine was in overhaul at the same time mine was, at Jewell. I talked to him a few times on the phone about it, but never got an update past the shakedown flights. Hopefully his went better than mine. He at least had the upper hand in that, SWTA did the install on his and thus, a second and better look at it.  

[ilovecornfields]

Funny, I thought I was the reason everyone left. Relived to know it’s actually @N201MKTurbo’s fault.

I liked Paul too and appreciate his contributions and always found him to be kind and respectful. Hopefully he’ll be back someday. 
 

The video seemed like clickbait and didn’t show what it was purported to show.

[N201MKTurbo]

A friend is resurrecting a Turbo Saratoga (oddly enough, we made the first flight on ester), it was the first flight in 18 years.
 

I was just now reading the POH and came across this paragraph. It seemed applicable to this discussion, seeing that we have gone beyond Mooneys. 

[rbp]

some of these comments are ironic given the sarcastic and arrogant reception I got when I asked about blocking people in another thread. perhaps if it was possible to block repeat offenders, people wouldn’t up and go.