Mooney Elevator AD

[Dmax]

2023-02-04

[chriscalandro]

18 minutes ago, Dmax said:

2023-02-04

It’s a good thing there is manufacturer support… oh, wait

it’s a good thing you can go the owner produced part route without what’s left of the manufacturer throwing a childish fit…. Oh, wait

Its a good thing there’s good communication from the factory about a path forward for this known issue… oh wait

Edited January 26, 2023 by chriscalandro

[67 m20F chump]

As far as I know this issue has not caused one in flight problem.  How many bonanzas are still flying?  
 

[Dmax]

The factory has been very supportive of this issue. We found the issue and reported it to them. They issued a notice about the issue followed up with Service bulletin which has now turned into an AD. They have hired a vendor to manufacture replacement weights that should be available in February.

You and your mechanic can come up with an Alternate means of compliance and submit it to the FAA. Mooney would have no say.

They issued an immediate notice of the problem for the owners safety. They issued a Service bulletin, The FAA issued an AD and the factory has contracted for the parts to comply with the AD noy sure what else can be done

Don

[Dmax]

It was only a matter of time before before there would have been an accident

[skykrawler]

Don't sweat it Don,  Mr. C is one of those.......sardonic types.

[Gary0747]

 

These airplanes have been flying for 55 years and no accidents recorded.  Now an immediate grounding and then 100 hour inspections?   The ones I have seen in photos with the problem should never pass an annual inspection regardless of the AD.  

If someone has one of these subject to the AD with absolutely no sign of any degradation because it has been properly painted and sealed why subject it to this SB every 100 hours?   Galvanic corrosion will only occur if an electrolyte can get between the two dissimilar metals.   It can happen anywhere dissimilar metals are attached without adequate sealing.  It happens in a variety of places on airplanes but is an AD required or just adequate inspection and maintenance? 
Are they going to allow owners to inspect these since there is no disassembly required to simply monitor for cracks and chips they describe and show in the SB?  I wish somebody had moderated this a bit before it got issued. 

[A64Pilot]

Only time I’ve seen an AD issued without a Notice of Proposed Rule Making was an Emergency AD, and they are rare, usually after multiple fatalities.

https://www.faa.gov/aircraft/air_cert/continued_operation/ad/type_pub

I’ve even seen an NPR period for spar caps that had broken and killed people.

But it seems in this case they jumped straight to final rule, so yes the FAA thinks it’s SERIOUS.

Most AD’s start with a manufacturers SB etc, unless the aircraft is orphaned.

Not read this AD, but I’m certain it spells out who can accomplish it, and exactly what to look for, probably even has pictures.

If it’s just a 100 hour visual, it’s a complete non event.

Being as it’s an Emergency, it means the FAA works overtime and gets it out the same day right?

The FAA normally takes 30 days to issue an Emergency AD   

https://www.faa.gov/aircraft/air_cert/continued_operation/ad/type_pub/type_emerg

 

Without factory support those affected could have been in a world of hurt.

We really, really don’t want our aircraft orphaned

What do Bonanza’s have to do with anything?

[chriscalandro]

In 4 months there has not been a public response to the initial service bulletin. The owners of the factory are members here and have not commented as far as I can tell. 
 

I'm not sure how long it takes to manufacture a weight, but I’m sure it isn’t 4 months. It’s not a complex part. My owner produced up/down lock blocks took far less time than that. 

Edited January 27, 2023 by chriscalandro

[AdamJD]

So stupid question from a new Mooney owner.  How do we tell if we have the affected counter weights?  We can't tell by serial number?  My F is at the avionics shop, so I can't just go out and look.  

[1964-M20E]

11 minutes ago, AdamJD said:

So stupid question from a new Mooney owner.  How do we tell if we have the affected counter weights?  We can't tell by serial number?  My F is at the avionics shop, so I can't just go out and look.  

It is a steel weight inside of a lead casting.  A magnet should do the trick, or depending on the paint you could possibly see the steel insert.

[Gary0747]

From what I read. Neither the SB or the AD specifies who is to inspect.  Some may be at an airport where aircraft mechanics are not available on short notice.   So if the owner can not inspect then I assume the 3000 plus aircraft mentioned as covered and requiring this inspection would be grounded until an IA is available?  Perhaps delaying the inspection requirement to the next annual would be better?  This discussion was started back in October on another posting.  Here is a link for those wanting more info.

 

[PT20J]

FAR Part 1: Maintenance means inspection, overhaul, repair, preservation, and he replacement of parts, but excludes preventive maintenance.

So, per FAR 43.3, your A&P can perform the inspection.

 

[PT20J]

2 hours ago, A64Pilot said:

Not read this AD,

[A64Pilot]

10 hours ago, PT20J said:

FAR Part 1: Maintenance means inspection, overhaul, repair, preservation, and he replacement of parts, but excludes preventive maintenance.

So, per FAR 43.3, your A&P can perform the inspection.

 

Unless the AD specifies otherwise.

I’ve seen AD’s that have a list of qualified inspectors and only those are allowed and or a specific level of NDI certification.

However it seems this AD isn’t yet an AD yet. I’d expect a little more clarification than what I got from the link. It references Mooney’s SB as most AD’s do, but does not include the SB in the AD which is unusual. It also mentions corrosion and cracking, without any explanation of severity.

Nor does it include any types of inspection methods, not even saying visual or use a 20X magnifying glass or anything, nor does it give you a way of determining if you have a discrepant weight. If it’s a steel slug surely a neodymium magnet would be a good way as was mentioned earlier in the thread. I saw neodymium or someone would try a refrigerator magnet you get for advertising.

Mooney’s SB is better with pictures, but still other than visual examination doesn’t tell you a lot. 

Maybe I’m mistaken but I think a good recent paint job could obscure the steel plug, and that the magnet idea has merit

https://www.mooney.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/10/SBM20_345.pdf

If I had a hybrid weight I think I’d get rid of it, whether or not it’s fine, but then on other threads on this subject I’ve recommended buying if possible non hybrid weights if possible, but now I bet either they are way more expensive or the small supply is gone.

It appears there were only 130 weights made, so only 130 affected elevators are even possible

[Ron McBride]

Since the rudder looks similar with a weight also.  Could some of those weights could be up top?

 

[Rwsavory]

The AD has been published. Effective date is Feb 13, 2023.

[JimB]

50 minutes ago, A64Pilot said:

Maybe I’m mistaken but I think a good recent paint job could obscure the steel plug, and that the magnet idea has merit

 

Yes the magnet idea does have merit. 

 

[JimB]

Also make sure when accomplishing or inspecting to reference the correct AD https://www.mooney.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/12/sbm20-345A.pdf 

(1) Before further flight after the effective date of this AD, inspect both elevators to determine if any hybrid elevator balance weight part number (P/N) 430018-1 is installed in accordance with STEP 1.1 of the Instructions section in Mooney International Corporation Service Bulletin M20-345A, dated December 13, 2022. The repetitive inspection and replacement required by paragraphs (g)(2) and (3) of this AD are not required if any hybrid elevator balance weight P/N 430018-1 is not installed.

[Dmax]

Justification for Immediate Adoption and Determination of the Effective Date

Section 553(b)(3)(B) of the Administrative Procedure Act (APA) (5 U.S.C. 551 et seq.) authorizes agencies to dispense with notice and comment procedures for rules when the agency, for “good cause,” finds that those procedures are “impracticable, unnecessary, or contrary to the public interest.” Under this section, an agency, upon finding good cause, may issue a final rule without providing notice and seeking comment prior to issuance. Further, section 553(d) of the APA authorizes agencies to make rules effective in less than thirty days, upon a finding of good cause.

An unsafe condition exists that requires the immediate adoption of this AD without providing an opportunity for public comments prior to adoption. The FAA has found that the risk to the flying public justifies foregoing notice and comment prior to adoption of this rule because corrosion on the elevator balance weight could lead to cracks that, if not addressed, could result in elevator flutter leading to elevator failure with consequent loss of control of the airplane. Because undetected corrosion could have developed over time and therefore the cracks can develop quickly and without warning, the affected elevator balance weights must be inspected before further flight. Accordingly, notice and opportunity for prior public comment are impracticable and contrary to the public interest pursuant to 5 U.S.C. 553(b)(3)(B).

In addition, the FAA finds that good cause exists pursuant to 5 U.S.C. 553(d) for making this amendment effective in less than 30 days, for the same reasons the FAA found good cause to forego notice and comment.

[Dmax]

Mooney use to provide a service center training class every year. Last was 2005. One of the sessions would be on accidents. In the late 90's one of the classes was on flutter. Two Mooney Rockets had lost their tails due to elevator flutter. Both had encounter thunderstorms at high rate of speed. The pics of the elevator and empennages that were found miles from the main impact area were very sobering. Its over in seconds. There is no thinking about it.

The purpose of this AD is to save lives. If it saves one life its all worth it. It takes 5 minutes and a good magnet to confirm if you are affected.

Don

[Yourpilotincommand]

If I stick a magnet to the elevator weights and determine there is a steel insert I may have the hybrid weight, right? That should be an easy test for me, and then my IA at next annual inspection. I’ll make sure this AD gets logged. It doesn’t sound like a big deal, unless I have the hybrid.

[A64Pilot]

25 minutes ago, Dmax said:

Mooney use to provide a service center training class every year. Last was 2005. One of the sessions would be on accidents. In the late 90's one of the classes was on flutter. Two Mooney Rockets had lost their tails due to elevator flutter. Both had encounter thunderstorms at high rate of speed. The pics of the elevator and empennages that were found miles from the main impact area were very sobering. Its over in seconds. There is no thinking about it.

The purpose of this AD is to save lives. If it saves one life its all worth it. It takes 5 minutes and a good magnet to confirm if you are affected.

Don

Good friend of mine, mentor as a Civilian test pilot encountered elevator flutter in a test flight during certification of the Aero Commander 112. He got out, the flutter DER who rode along, didn’t.

Aero Commander being at the time a very big Aerospace company, they built the Apollo capsule, X-15 etc. recreated the accident in a wind tunnel, the time interval from flutter onset to complete empennage destruction was less than 1 sec. 

Aero Commander on the prototype only had one elevator trim tab, in order to prevent excessive down force in the dive Ralph rolled the trim full nose down, it was a combination of a control doublet, with speed, the asymmetrical force from one trim tan and the full travel deflection of the tab that caused flutter. 

https://aviation-safety.net/wikibase/2731

 

[Fly Boomer]

9 minutes ago, Yourpilotincommand said:

If I stick a magnet to the elevator weights and determine there is a steel insert I may have the hybrid weight, right? That should be an easy test for me, and then my IA at next annual inspection. I’ll make sure this AD gets logged. It doesn’t sound like a big deal, unless I have the hybrid.

If a magnet is attracted to the weight, you absolutely have the hybrid.

[takair]

I wonder why they had to specify neodymium magnet?  Why couldn’t they just say “magnet”?  I probably have a dozen magnets in my shop, but I couldn’t be sure if any are neodymium.  It’s the little things that can drive you crazy.