Rocket Coming out!

[carusoam]

The bragging rights are cool...

But...

Modern day sailing, is even cooler...  select a good tailwind, and get in it... LOP!   
 

Are you guys using any ADSB-in Or XM for wind speed at altitude?

Best regards,

-a-

[aviatoreb]

20 minutes ago, carusoam said:

The bragging rights are cool...

But...

Modern day sailing, is even cooler...  select a good tailwind, and get in it... LOP!   
 

Are you guys using any ADSB-in Or XM for wind speed at altitude?

Best regards,

-a-

A balloon will go a hundred knots.  With a hundred knot tail wind.

i once did 327 knots ground speed on a good day at 17k.

[bonal]

9 minutes ago, aviatoreb said:

A balloon will go a hundred knots.  With a hundred knot tail wind.

i once did 327 knots ground speed on a good day at 17k.

I don't think it possible for a balloon to have a head wind or a tail wind or even a cross wind...just sayin.

[aviatoreb]

7 hours ago, bonal said:

I don't think it possible for a balloon to have a head wind or a tail wind or even a cross wind...just sayin.

True that - the life of a balloonist - all winds are tail winds.  Sounds lovely.

[FloridaMan]

[PJClark]

Holy Crap!  300 kt grounspeed?  I guess I'm going to have to push it up at least once for bragging rights @aviatoreb!

I'll have GTX345R for ADSB in and out.  no XM for now--gonna see how I like ADSB, and whether my copilot says she wants music from something besides her phone.  Next Spring, inshallah.

[mooneyspeed]

I managed that one day too. FL210 197TAS in a 231 with 75% power. Made for a quick 650 NM night.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[exM20K]

On 10/27/2019 at 9:05 PM, carusoam said:

Are you familiar with time share properties, Erik?

LOLZ.  Here is the high speed cruise from the type S POH:

GPH====>	2much
1000	189
2000	191
3000	194
4000	196
5000	199
6000	201
7000	203
8000	205
9000	208
10000	210
11000	212
12000	214
13000	217
14000	219
15000	221
16000	223
17000	226
18000	228
19000	230
20000	232
21000	234
22000	236
23000	238
24000	240
25000	242

 

 

Standard day.  Never have flown mine this way, but... the curve depicted on the chart is not accurate for the M20TN "S"

-dan

Edited October 29, 2019 by exM20K

[aviatoreb]

23 minutes ago, exM20K said:

LOLZ.  Here is the high speed cruise from the type S POH:

GPH====>	2much
1000	189
2000	191
3000	194
4000	196
5000	199
6000	201
7000	203
8000	205
9000	208
10000	210
11000	212
12000	214
13000	217
14000	219
15000	221
16000	223
17000	226
18000	228
19000	230
20000	232
21000	234
22000	236
23000	238
24000	240
25000	242

 

 

Standard day.  Never have flown mine this way, but... the curve depicted on the chart is not accurate for the M20TN "S"

-dan

Graph attached.  Are those POH numbers?  I am presuming yes, and this seems more reasonable to me as this graph is not concave up but appears slightly concave down.

I am guessing though these numbers are not cruise speeds (75%?  78%?  80%?) but rather the "bragging rights" speed using full take off power 100% engine power to show absolute max speed the airplane can make itself go in level flight even if it will burn up the engine.  And I assume that is standard practice in these advertising numbers and what is shown in all the airplanes.

[aviatoreb]

2 hours ago, PJClark said:

Holy Crap!  300 kt grounspeed?  I guess I'm going to have to push it up at least once for bragging rights @aviatoreb!

I'll have GTX345R for ADSB in and out.  no XM for now--gonna see how I like ADSB, and whether my copilot says she wants music from something besides her phone.  Next Spring, inshallah.

Even a balloon can go 327 knots with a 327 knot tailwind.

This is from before I upgraded my panel a bit more.

[ArtVandelay]

I don't think it possible for a balloon to have a head wind or a tail wind or even a cross wind...just sayin.

Constant no, but I would think gusty winds could provide all of the above for short periods of time, until the balloon accelerates to match the wind.


Tom

[exM20K]

11 minutes ago, aviatoreb said:

Graph attached.  Are those POH numbers?  I am presuming yes, and this seems more reasonable to me as this graph is not concave up but appears slightly concave down.

I am guessing though these numbers are not cruise speeds (75%?  78%?  80%?) but rather the "bragging rights" speed using full take off power 100% engine power to show absolute max speed the airplane can make itself go in level flight even if it will burn up the engine.  And I assume that is standard practice in these advertising numbers and what is shown in all the airplanes.

Yes, POH numbers which I've interpolated between the even-thousands altitudes.

This is best power, 30.5 x 2500 and 21+GPH.  So, bragging speed, sales demo speed, but not the way I choose to operate my plane.

-dan

Edited October 29, 2019 by exM20K

[aviatoreb]

1 hour ago, exM20K said:

Yes, POH numbers which I've interpolated between the even-thousands altitudes.

This is best power, 30.5 x 2500 and 21+GPH.  So, bragging speed, sales demo speed, but not the way I choose to operate my plane.

-dan

WOW - the TN is quite an impressive machine if it will do those book numbers or close on that which seems is what - 75%?

So - really - you can do 189TAS at 1000ft?  SO at 1000ft that is almost equal to 189 IAS on 75%.  WOW.  That airframe is way more aerodynamic than mine since the power is the same.

Edited October 29, 2019 by aviatoreb

[PJClark]

KGXY to KSLN this afternoon.

RRRRRocket!

[carusoam]

152kias...

189tas...

236kts... GS...

Great day of sailing!

Way to go PJ!

Great pic.

Best regards,

-a-

 

[PJClark]

A bit less "sailing" today.  72% power instead of 65%

[aviatoreb]

1 hour ago, PJClark said:

A bit less "sailing" today.  72% power instead of 65%

Welcome to team Rrrrocket!  Extra rrrrr

... I still have panel envy though.

[carusoam]

Monster X-wind component... 57kts.

Very interesting how the graphics display heading vs track...

Getting adjustable rudder trim for the Rrrrocket would be coool.... have Siri step on the ball. 

PP thoughts only, not a CFI...

Best regards,

-a-

[aviatoreb]

18 minutes ago, carusoam said:

Monster X-wind component... 57kts.

Very interesting how the graphics display heading vs track...

Getting adjustable rudder trim for the Rrrrocket would be coool.... have Siri step on the ball. 

PP thoughts only, not a CFI...

Best regards,

-a-

Even with a cross wind, in level flight the ball would be centered if perfectly rigged and no rudder input necessary.  Filling the ground track in cross wind is by crabbing into the wind but still no input in level flight.  But that ball seems close to centered so I bet it’s awfully close to rigged.  I wonder with the autopilot off and hands off feet on the floor trimmed for level flight if the ball is centered. Or is that new autopilot slightly cross controlling?  If so or if slightly out of rig maybe there’s a bit more speed in that machine.

[PJClark]

Well, now you've shown me where to ask the questions running through my noggin.  See, while 199 KTAS is great at 15k, the book speed for the Rocket is cloer to 208 or even 210.  I'm slow.  Could be the nice cold air?  I did see 197 KTAS at 14k on 65 pct in Aug.  Hmmm....???

Plus, I'm a bit hot.  #2 and #5 both running  hot enough that to keep them under 380 F I had to open the cowl flap to the cruise mark (252, electric, continuously variable cowl flap)  And run a bunch of fuel through it.

So the questions are:
 

1. Look at the green velocity vector (in the pic it's just to the left of the altitude tape). It's right on the horizon line, meaning I'm in level flight. BUT...look at where the nose is:  about a degree or degree-and-a-half BELOW the horizon. So I'm pushing through the air just a bit like a wheel barrow.  Any idea how to "fix" that?  Or is it normal?  Or would we not have this conundrum without this awesome display?  could it be an empennage rigging change to get it all lined up?  or is it a loading issue--need more weight in the back?  (my plane CG is right on 47.73 inches--right on top of the fuel station.  I thought almost perfectly balanced--definitely NOT "forward" like some Rockets.  So, what's up with this nose low wheelbarrow thing?

2.  the heat.  Cowling was off when I got to the avionics shop this past Wed.  I noticed a cut in the baffle seal about 2 inches long on the copilot's side, and there's a gap (or I imagine one) back in the aft pilot side corner where #2 is.  Also when they put the cowling on they said the seal right in front of #5 wants to fold down rather than up.  the question here is:  do some holes in the baffles make this much difference?  I have heard "yes"...so I'm very tempted to get this done very soon. Advice?

3.the heat.  I don't have GAMIs.  the spread at cruise leaned to 1500 TIT is about 120 F between hottest (#5) and coolest (#1) EGTs  #1 and #6 run coolest CHTs.  Go GAMI? What's that cost, about $1k?

4.  NOT the HEAT--idle mixture.  this is a Rocket only question.  ON the ground the thing won't run smoothly at idle unless I lean almost 1/3 of the way out, usually around 3.4 gph keeps it smooth.  A little less in Greeley at 4300 MSL.  Slightly more alarming- if I were to push the mixture to full rich approaching the pattern, then chop to idle, it''ll stumble and nearly die. Except I'm quick to put the throttle back in to give it more air to get it leaner.  Bottom line--I spend a lot of time fiddling with the mixture.  Have gotten good at it already (about 20 hours in the machine) so not that worrying.  But should something be done or is this "normal Rocket"???? If something should be done:  who's "the GUY" to tweak the mixture on a TSIO-520NB in a Rocket?

5. AND last--cowling fasteners. I found some older posts on this.  Painter painted all the fasteners, removing them made the paint flake off.  I want all new SS fasteners.

a.  where do I get a "kit" that'll work for the Rocket?  Or is it a stock M20K cowling kit?

b.  do I need the receptacles?  Kits I see on SkyBolt specifically don't include them (and they don't seem to hint at where to buy them)

thanks

Paul

Edited November 4, 2019 by PJClark
added info

[aviatoreb]

1 hour ago, PJClark said:

Well, now you've shown me where to ask the questions running through my noggin.  See, while 199 KTAS is great at 15k, the book speed for the Rocket is cloer to 208 or even 210.  I'm slow.  Could be the nice cold air?  I did see 197 KTAS at 14k on 65 pct in Aug.  Hmmm....???

Plus, I'm a bit hot.  #2 and #5 both running  hot enough that to keep them under 380 F I had to open the cowl flap to the cruise mark (252, electric, continuously variable cowl flap)  And run a bunch of fuel through it.

So the questions are:
 

1. Look at the green velocity vector (in the pic it's just to the left of the altitude tape). It's right on the horizon line, meaning I'm in level flight. BUT...look at where the nose is:  about a degree or degree-and-a-half BELOW the horizon. So I'm pushing through the air just a bit like a wheel barrow.  Any idea how to "fix" that?  Or is it normal?  Or would we not have this conundrum without this awesome display?  could it be an empennage rigging change to get it all lined up?  or is it a loading issue--need more weight in the back?  (my plane CG is right on 47.73 inches--right on top of the fuel station.  I thought almost perfectly balanced--definitely NOT "forward" like some Rockets.  So, what's up with this nose low wheelbarrow thing?

2.  the heat.  Cowling was off when I got to the avionics shop this past Wed.  I noticed a cut in the baffle seal about 2 inches long on the copilot's side, and there's a gap (or I imagine one) back in the aft pilot side corner where #2 is.  Also when they put the cowling on they said the seal right in front of #5 wants to fold down rather than up.  the question here is:  do some holes in the baffles make this much difference?  I have heard "yes"...so I'm very tempted to get this done very soon. Advice?

3.the heat.  I don't have GAMIs.  the spread at cruise leaned to 1500 TIT is about 120 F between hottest (#5) and coolest (#1) EGTs  #1 and #6 run coolest CHTs.  Go GAMI? What's that cost, about $1k?

4.  NOT the HEAT--idle mixture.  this is a Rocket only question.  ON the ground the thing won't run smoothly at idle unless I lean almost 1/3 of the way out, usually around 3.4 gph keeps it smooth.  A little less in Greeley at 4300 MSL.  Slightly more alarming- if I were to push the mixture to full rich approaching the pattern, then chop to idle, it''ll stumble and nearly die. Except I'm quick to put the throttle back in to give it more air to get it leaner.  Bottom line--I spend a lot of time fiddling with the mixture.  Have gotten good at it already (about 20 hours in the machine) so not that worrying.  But should something be done or is this "normal Rocket"???? If something should be done:  who's "the GUY" to tweak the mixture on a TSIO-520NB in a Rocket?

5. AND last--cowling fasteners. I found some older posts on this.  Painter painted all the fasteners, removing them made the paint flake off.  I want all new SS fasteners.

a.  where do I get a "kit" that'll work for the Rocket?  Or is it a stock M20K cowling kit?

b.  do I need the receptacles?  Kits I see on SkyBolt specifically don't include them (and they don't seem to hint at where to buy them)

thanks

Paul

some notes on your questions.

- could your engine be sagging a tad bit / a common condition for a big bore engine that’s been hung a decade ago.  Those rubber pucks that the engine frame sits on fatigue over time and the engine will droop slightly.  Thus the prop thrust will be slightly out of line with the centerline.  And a tad bit of lost speed.  Replacing pucks and or shins can get your engine standing straight again if that’s happening.

-how is the rigging?  The ball looks decently centered but not perfect.  How is it with the autopilot of trimmed and in level flight.

anyway both of those together can be a couple of knots.

- the condition of wanting to sputter our upon landing is a common nuisance in rockets but it can be tuned to not do that and you definitely want to do so.  You need a rocket experienced msc.  For mine I think it involved turning up the idle a tad and some adjustment to idle fuel flow.

- my cylinders are very cool in cruise and I never fly w cowl open

- taxi at 1000rpm I lean to 2.4-2.5 gph once very warm but <3 anyway while she is still warming up but warm enough to taxi.  That you need 3.5 and hotter cylinders makes me wonder if that’s related.

[carusoam]

1) attitude not showing level in level flight... simple adjustment like any other attitude indicator... no?  Somebody probably set it on the ground, and has included the extra four degrees or so.  There is no parallax, so nobody expected the 4° nose up attitude most Mooneys get... Long Bodies get 8°... probably listed under ‘calibration’.(?)

2) Rudder trim is more of a challenge... It can be adjusted for one cruise situation...  Long bodies have an electric adjustable rudder trim... that gets used for T/O, climb, cruise, descent and prep for landing... check all things related to control rigging prior to making any rudder trim changes...

3) Fuel set-up... get to know a good Rocket engine mechanic... Learn as much as you can about Rocket engine ops... even the prime for start steps is interesting...
 

PP thoughts only, not a mechanic... Not an instrument tech either...

Best regards,

-a-

[PJClark]

Thanks guys.

Engine overhauled by Victor in 2013...exhaust and engine mount by Rocket  at same time

Attitude...4 deg nose up on the ground..set correctly

 MSC: Maxwell did the prebuy, didn't  have these as any of the minor issues.  Was thinkng about taking it to him for first annual Next March anyway.  I'll give them a call and see if they know a Rocket engine guy closer to me in OH in the meantime.

I do have about 1/4 inch of up aileron on the left side in level flight so there's  at least one small rigging issue

[aviatoreb]

7 hours ago, PJClark said:

Thanks guys.

Engine overhauled by Victor in 2013...exhaust and engine mount by Rocket  at same time

Attitude...4 deg nose up on the ground..set correctly

 MSC: Maxwell did the prebuy, didn't  have these as any of the minor issues.  Was thinkng about taking it to him for first annual Next March anyway.  I'll give them a call and see if they know a Rocket engine guy closer to me in OH in the meantime.

I do have about 1/4 inch of up aileron on the left side in level flight so there's  at least one small rigging issue

Ah - sounds like my guess - engine sag - aint an issue in your airplane.  Well it was worth asking.

Maybe a little rigging issue.  I bet there's a knot or two to squeeze out for better rigging.

[PJClark]

Somehow a lonely neuron is saying it recalls hearing of some Mooney rigging wizard up in...maybe Minnesota?   Ever hear such a thing?