My First Annual- What Can I Do To Help??

[0TreeLemur]

Yesterday I was using a diamond tipped Phillips driver.  Put enough torque on the heads pushing up from the crawler to start to fail the heads.  I tried some penetrating oil with PTFE and tried again after an hour or so, to no effect.  They are stuck. 

[EricJ]

Careful use of a drill and screw extractor is what I usually see on the bad ones.

[Marauder]

Yesterday I was using a diamond tipped Phillips driver.  Put enough torque on the heads pushing up from the crawler to start to fail the heads.  I tried some penetrating oil with PTFE and tried again after an hour or so, to no effect.  They are stuck. 

You need one of these bad boys. Makes easy work out of the screw removal and reinstallation process.

https://www.amazon.com/DEWALT-DCF682N1-Gyroscopic-Inline-Screwdriver/dp/B011WRUODC/ref=sr_1_4?s=power-hand-tools&ie=UTF8&qid=1543272027&sr=1-4&keywords=dewalt+screwdriver



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[Yetti]

58 minutes ago, M20Doc said:

A  dab of diamond valve lapping compound on the end of a good screwdriver bit often works before getting cutting tools and drills involved.

Clarence

Yes you should have started with a Snap on #2  which will usually prevent stripping in the first place.   

[carusoam]

My Mechanic introduced me to a few tools from the Snap-On truck...

Expensive, and high quality, and it drove by the hangar, and the mechanic could point out the tools that actually work...

Look for that really thin pair of pliers...

Avoid anything powered and cutting near the plane... until you have some practice on something else first...

Best regards,

-a-

[0TreeLemur]

Our first annual update.  There are two issues that my A&P is investigating.  First, rudder motion is about 1/2" side to side with feet on the pedals.   He says that it should be no more than 1/8".   Looking for warn rod ends.   Second, right landing gear seems to be out of rigging- when gear are full up, it is short of touching upper limit of wheel well by about 1/2 inch, which coincides with an approximately 1/2" gap on the gear door.  Left main gear is full up.  We'll try adjusting tomorrow.   

Long day, but hugely interesting for us!   I find it seriously incredible the amount of "stuff" that happens in that 4" deep space below your feet in the M20.  And that the aluminum floor is 0.032" thick.

Oh- installed LED indicator light in parallel with fuel pump.  That is cool.  

 

[Yetti]

It's amazing how they got all those rods and tubes to do that.  

 

[0TreeLemur]

26 minutes ago, Yetti said:

It's amazing how they got all those rods and tubes to do that.  

 

It's also amazing how sharp those little bent metal tabs are around the back end of the nose gear well.

Huh?  What is that electric motor??   Where is the Johnson bar??  What kind of alien craft is this?

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Yetti said:

It's amazing how they got all those rods and tubes to do that.  

 

I hope that the nut on the actuator rod end got tightened, it looks ready to fall off.

Clarence

Edited November 28, 2018 by M20Doc

[TheTurtle]

 

Check this thread.  Might be the steering horn thingy that's loose.  Dan at laser says its usually not the rod ends. 

[Yetti]

1 hour ago, M20Doc said:

I hope that the nut on the actuator rod end got tightened, it looks ready to fall off.

Clarence

The eagle eyes of a professional.   Yep.  I put it there then checked for binding with the video camera.   Then torqued the bolts, then had the grump IA come and check my work.

[Andy95W]

4 hours ago, Fred_2O said:

Second, right landing gear seems to be out of rigging- when gear are full up, it is short of touching upper limit of wheel well by about 1/2 inch, which coincides with an approximately 1/2" gap on the gear door.  Left main gear is full up.  We'll try adjusting tomorrow.   

 

Please do not adjust anything on your landing gear unless your A&P has the landing gear rigging tools.  Paul Steen's former gorgeous M20C will never fly again for probably this exact reason.

There is no "Up" adjustment on the Johnson Bar Mooneys. Only down.  This gets checked every annual inspection with the gear rigging tools.  By adjusting the rod ends to get more up travel, you will remove the pre-load on the overcenter link and the gear will collapse.

It doesn't matter that the right gear doesn't touch the pad in the wheel well.  There is a thread here recently about a broken rod end due to an electric gear Mooney that was pulling the gear up too far.

Your A&P should put a good, critical eye on all of the pushrods to make sure none are bent.  This will require removing the small panels in the gear wells that are inboard and forward to follow the pushrods from the wing into the belly.

If all of the tubes are straight, and the downlock pre-load test is correct per Service Instruction M20-32/ Service Bulletin M20-155 (not the maintenance manual- that was for the original gear links) for both mains and the nose gear, then it's good and you should adjust the rigging of the gear door.

(I'm not right about everything but I'm an A&P/IA that's owned 2 different M20Cs for about 17 years total.)

[0TreeLemur]

8 hours ago, Andy95W said:

Please do not adjust anything on your landing gear unless your A&P has the landing gear rigging tools.  Paul Steen's former gorgeous M20C will never fly again for probably this exact reason.

There is no "Up" adjustment on the Johnson Bar Mooneys. Only down.  This gets checked every annual inspection with the gear rigging tools.  By adjusting the rod ends to get more up travel, you will remove the pre-load on the overcenter link and the gear will collapse.

It doesn't matter that the right gear doesn't touch the pad in the wheel well.  There is a thread here recently about a broken rod end due to an electric gear Mooney that was pulling the gear up too far.

Your A&P should put a good, critical eye on all of the pushrods to make sure none are bent.  This will require removing the small panels in the gear wells that are inboard and forward to follow the pushrods from the wing into the belly.

If all of the tubes are straight, and the downlock pre-load test is correct per Service Instruction M20-32/ Service Bulletin M20-155 (not the maintenance manual- that was for the original gear links) for both mains and the nose gear, then it's good and you should adjust the rigging of the gear door.

(I'm not right about everything but I'm an A&P/IA that's owned 2 different M20Cs for about 17 years total.)

Thanks for writing Andy.  My A&P has the gear pre-load test tools.   Is there a separate set of rigging tools, or is that what you are referring to?

I'll take what you wrote to the hangar with me today.  Then I'll put the two bolts that I removed at location "B" back in position and forget about rigging gear.  Thanks for sharing your knowledge, experience, and observations of past threads.

[Andy95W]

Fred- the pre-load test tools are the ones.  And if I hadn't said it before, good for you for helping with your annual!  There's no better way to know your aircraft's systems than to do what you're doing.

[0TreeLemur]

Thanks Andy- he has those.  Much appreciated!

BTW- my inner engineer was itchin' to adjust the rigging on the gear- my A&P immediately expressed skepticism that it was needed.   I'll give him a notch more credit...

[Andy95W]

The airplane I was talking about in my original post was flown for about 500 uneventful hours by @gsxrpilot.  He sold it when he bought a 252.  The new owner's mechanic adjusted the landing gear at annual and shortly thereafter the gear collapsed while taking the runway for takeoff.  That's what made me scared when I read your post.

It sounds like you guys are doing the work right.  There can be a tendency to adjust the gear and not re-check and double check.  For example, I've seen an adjustment to one nose gear rod change the preload on the main gear.  So my suggestion is to adjust it until everything is right, tighten all the nuts, take a soda break, then check them all again before taking it off the jacks.  And spray some silicone spray on/into the slider handle when you're in there.  It'll stop you having some of the stiff gear issues that @steingar has described recently.

[Shadrach]

On 11/25/2018 at 6:37 PM, EricJ said:

I'd ask the IA what panels he wants opened up, or you may spend a lot of time screwing screws in and out that could be left alone.   The belly will likely need to be opened up, but my IA only wanted a few of

the wing panels opened which saved a ton of time.   Leaving stuff alone that doesn't need to be touched is also a safety issue. 

There's still plenty to do when assisting with an annual.   I was busy the whole time.

 

I second the above. A mirror and a flashlight can make the inside of the wing inspectable in it's entirety without the need to remove all 42 of the access plates. All belly pans should be removed (especially if this is his first time seeing the airplane). You will not be able to get to the inner most screws on the fuel pump access panel without either swinging the gear or disconnecting the left nose gear door (still a bit tight with the gear down).

These small muslin bags with tags are the best way to keep fasteners organized. $30 for 100ct should be a lifetime supply given that they are reusable.  I label them, pull the draw string and hang them on the airframe in the area where they were removed. Your mechanic will appreciate a tidy, organized space to conduct his business (as hard as I try, I occasionally fall down in this regard)

https://www.grainger.com/product/5DJA6?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIoLr59qn33gIV1FmGCh1tCA6kEAkYCCABEgLULPD_BwE&cm_mmc=PPC:+Google+PLA&ef_id=EAIaIQobChMIoLr59qn33gIV1FmGCh1tCA6kEAkYCCABEgLULPD_BwE:G:s&s_kwcid=AL!2966!3!284618243427!!!g!531017805087!

Edited November 29, 2018 by Shadrach

[Shadrach]

1 hour ago, Andy95W said:

The airplane I was talking about in my original post was flown for about 500 uneventful hours by @gsxrpilot.  He sold it when he bought a 252.  The new owner's mechanic adjusted the landing gear at annual and shortly thereafter the gear collapsed while taking the runway for takeoff.  That's what made me scared when I read your post.

It sounds like you guys are doing the work right.  There can be a tendency to adjust the gear and not re-check and double check.  For example, I've seen an adjustment to one nose gear rod change the preload on the main gear.  So my suggestion is to adjust it until everything is right, tighten all the nuts, take a soda break, then check them all again before taking it off the jacks.  And spray some silicone spray on/into the slider handle when you're in there.  It'll stop you having some of the stiff gear issues that @steingar has described recently.

My pre-loads have been in spec and have not changed since I started participating in the annuals 11 years ago. The readings can be subjective depending on the calibration of the eyes and fingers of the person doing the check.

Edited November 28, 2018 by Shadrach

[Yetti]

1 hour ago, Shadrach said:

I second the above. A mirror and a flashlight can make the inside of the wing inspectable in it's entirety without the need to remove all 42 of the access plates. All belly pans should be removed (especially if this is his first time seeing the airplane). You will not be able to get to the inner most screws  on the fuel pump access panel without either swing the gear or disconnecting the left nose gear door (still a bit tight with the gear down. 

 

 

I have found the cell phone to be a really good inspection tool.   It has a light and a camera and then you don't have to contort your head to see.   I usually pop it there take lots of pictures then delete the bad ones.   My other trick is to after several flights take a picture of the tach.   Then save it to the computer.    Also have a directory on the computer of all the parts tags of every component I touch or see.  it's easier than going through the logs to see what parts to order.

[FloridaMan]

This is the screwdriver you want for panel screws. 

https://www.amazon.com/CRAFTSMAN-948025-Pieces-T-Handle-Driver/dp/B00QB80UH8 

along with Apex bits. You *really* want good screwdriver bits and a bunch of replacement screws on hand (see the Illustrated Parts Catalog for the right part number. There are differences between the AN screws and inspection panels are stressed in flight). A&Ps have tricks to getting tough screws out, but ensuring you're straight on the screw and have good pressure, sometimes working a tad tighter and then loose can get a stubborn screw to come out. If you bugger up a head, replace the screw with a new one. And to repeat myself: do not use anything less than a perfect screwdriver, preferably with a long, straight handle to ensure you're directly aligned with the screw. 

https://apexbits.com/446-2R-Apex-1-4-Phillips-2-Hex-Insert-Bits-Limited-Clearance.aspx

Also, don't pull screws out of your fuel tank panels. I've seen people do it. 

[Greg Ellis]

This thread reminds me of why my A&P/IA charges what he does and why I pay it without question.  There is so much that goes into an annual being done properly.

[FloridaMan]

3 hours ago, Yetti said:

I have found the cell phone to be a really good inspection tool.   It has a light and a camera and then you don't have to contort your head to see.   I usually pop it there take lots of pictures then delete the bad ones.   My other trick is to after several flights take a picture of the tach.   Then save it to the computer.    Also have a directory on the computer of all the parts tags of every component I touch or see.  it's easier than going through the logs to see what parts to order.

This, or something similar, is a must-have. 

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0785H3XR7/ref=sspa_dk_detail_0?psc=1&pd_rd_i=B0785H3XR7&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_p=21517efd-b385-405b-a405-9a37af61b5b4&pd_rd_wg=kNFjF&pf_rd_r=RMYBKK8VT51BEVBXCYSW&pf_rd_s=desktop-dp-sims&pf_rd_t=40701&pd_rd_w=YSz8A&pf_rd_i=desktop-dp-sims&pd_rd_r=9163461b-f347-11e8-88d2-3b20857d970c

[ArtVandelay]

This, or something similar, is a must-have. 

That’s a snake camera, hard to control, I think you need a rigid articulating camera :
Vividia Ablescope VA-400 USB Rigid Borescope Endoscope with 180 Degree Articulating 8.5mm Diameter Probe
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00GY7C9ZW/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_tai_BQV.BbVC39ZVJ

[Marauder]

That’s a snake camera, hard to control, I think you need a rigid articulating camera :
Vividia Ablescope VA-400 USB Rigid Borescope Endoscope with 180 Degree Articulating 8.5mm Diameter Probe
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00GY7C9ZW/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_tai_BQV.BbVC39ZVJ

Used mine last night to get the stupid label read on my master cylinder.




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[FloridaMan]

1 hour ago, teejayevans said:

That’s a snake camera, hard to control, I think you need a rigid articulating camera :
Vividia Ablescope VA-400 USB Rigid Borescope Endoscope with 180 Degree Articulating 8.5mm Diameter Probe
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00GY7C9ZW/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_tai_BQV.BbVC39ZVJ

Certainly better, but the snake works well enough and is less of a financial commitment