Engine Mount ,Shock Mounts, Proper Alignment

[Bob R]

All,

I have a two part question pertaining to the same issue.

1. I am looking for information as well as advice. I am ready to install, this Friday I hope, my 0 time engine back into my 69 M20E, finally. I am looking for confirmation to the following information I have received. I have been told when installing the shock mounts, the hard puck is installed on the engine mount, firewall side, on the top and towards the engine on the bottom. Is this correct? It seems, if this is correct, in order to have enough room for the larger and softer puck on the bottom (firewall side, I will have to take the bottom of the engine mount off the mounting point on the firewall. For the life of me, I cannot find any specific documentation on this subject.

2. No too long ago, I ran across an article which discussed how to get the engine to sit at the proper angle utilizing different thickness shims. I now cannot find it. Do any of you happen to have this article or can you direct me as to how to accomplish this goal?

Thank you for the help and advice,

Bob

[lamont337]

Shim article:

http://donmaxwell.com/aligning-your-engine-using-shims/ 

 

[carusoam]

While waiting for somebody with mechanical skill to arrive...

Which engine mounts did you get, Lord’s?  Dynafocal? (I’m not sure if this is a brand or a type...)

As far as mounting an engine, isn’t there a Maintenance manual with procedures for that?  Maybe a couple of drawings?

I’m thinking this is pretty standard IO360 kind of stuff. Not really specific Mooney related...

I bet the Lord mounts cost about $100 for each piece of rubber... matching the gear donuts in expense for what you get...

Let us know what you find out...

Best regards,

-a-

[ArtVandelay]

I’m thinking this is pretty standard IO360 kind of stuff. Not really specific Mooney related...

I bet the Lord mounts cost about $100 for each piece of rubber...

More like $200....I just order 4. BTW, 2 of my old mounts had blown out their silicone gel inserts. So if your engine sags a bit, it might be the bad mounts.

[RLCarter]

On the engine mounts you are correct, the "harder" half of the mount is installed so its under compression. Mine were installed incorrectly when we went to replaced them. 

[Guest]

11 hours ago, Bob R said:

All,

I have a two part question pertaining to the same issue.

1. I am looking for information as well as advice. I am ready to install, this Friday I hope, my 0 time engine back into my 69 M20E, finally. I am looking for confirmation to the following information I have received. I have been told when installing the shock mounts, the hard puck is installed on the engine mount, firewall side, on the top and towards the engine on the bottom. Is this correct? It seems, if this is correct, in order to have enough room for the larger and softer puck on the bottom (firewall side, I will have to take the bottom of the engine mount off the mounting point on the firewall. For the life of me, I cannot find any specific documentation on this subject.

2. No too long ago, I ran across an article which discussed how to get the engine to sit at the proper angle utilizing different thickness shims. I now cannot find it. Do any of you happen to have this article or can you direct me as to how to accomplish this goal?

Thank you for the help and advice,

Bob

The engine mount half with the ring in the rubber goes aft on the top and forward on the bottom. It shows in this picture from the IPC.  Do you have a maintenance manual for this?

Clarence

 

[Culver LFA]

And this as well showing the correct upper and lower mount orientation (from the Barry Application sheet)

Airpower inc has the Barry mounts on sale, $385.26 for 4

[Bob R]

Thanks everyone. I do not know why the engine exploited view is not in my manual. I expected to find but did not. For whatever reason, I look on the Lord and Barry site but did not find the install sheet. I am using Barry mounts. I was dry fitting the other day and would have to take the lower engine mount loose to get the larger, softer puck to fit so I thought I had the information backwards. Oddly, when I took the engine out, there were same size washers between the engine and the molded assembly which spaced out the engine equally. I am not sure why since I do not have the 201 style cowling and there was certainly no clearance issues with the prop even if the washers had not there. We are going to put it back original and see what we have. Has anyone seen this before? OOPS, should have read the article first.

Thanks, BR

Edited November 20, 2018 by Bob R

[ArtVandelay]

The engine mount half with the ring in the rubber goes aft on the top and forward on the bottom. It shows in this picture from the IPC.  Do you have a maintenance manual for this?
Clarence
 

I was surprised by the size of the bolts holding the frame to the firewall (#16 , 17) in the diagram. They seem undersized to my untrained eyes.

[takair]

15 minutes ago, teejayevans said:

I was surprised by the size of the bolts holding the frame to the firewall (#16 , 17) in the diagram. They seem undersized to my untrained eyes.

They always seemed small to me too.  The top ones are in tension too...so just threads holding things together.  Al must have done a good job though, never heard of one fail....and I think they use the same bolts for even the big engine conversion...so my little 200hp should do all right.

[carusoam]

TJ,

Bolts holding the mount to the firewall....They are incredibly small compared to expectations...

Important to use the proper hardware and torque for that.

when you look at the four bolts holding the engine to the mount, they seem meaty in comparison...

My M20C elected to break the two tabs off, pilot side, lower mount...  leaving 180hp pulling unevenly on the three remaining small bolts...

Some flights, the engine mount tube would rest on the small aluminum block affixed to the fire wall... on another flight, the tube would slip off the aluminum block and the engine would appear to have sagged... hardly noticeable at all...

The light came on, when the mount was resting on the block again, appearing to have fixed itself...

Nothing mechanical ever fixes itself... one way trip to the MSC...

Best regards,

-a-

[Guest]

Unfortunately Mooney manuals don’t really have much to say about removal and installation of the engine other than to reinstall the shim washers in the same locations that they were removed from.  That doesn’t help much if the last guy to remove the engine didn’t keep track of them.  

It be nice if they noted something like the top of the cylinders relative to the leveling points on the airframe and tip of the spinner to the wingtips for lateral alignment.

Clarence

 

[BKlott]

Did you send your engine mount out for inspection and repair?

[mike20papa]

If new engine mounts are being installed then you may not need any shims.  For me, the challenging part of the job is aligning the bolts as they are all angling in toward the "dynamic center" of the engine.  They don't really want to line up with the engine case until the engine is hard against the mounts and the engine is not hard against the mounts until you tighten the bolts.  Catch 21.  Be patient, use grease to lube the bolts to help get thru the case.  If you have a battery box mounted on the firewall, remove it (probably already removed) for access.  The shims I have utilize slotted holes that can be added after the engine is hung/checked.  Loosen the engine bolts, insert/remove shims to level. 

Enjoy your new engine & mounts!  Joe

[Andy95W]

You probably don't need the shims, but I would suggest installing them now, one at each mount point.  This way, when the time comes in 500 hours to adjust it, it will be easier than having to add shims later.  Also, this is per Don Maxwell's write up.

[Bob R]

I used the Barry mounts.

[TX-Champ]

There are a few other threads here regarding this topic.  

I wrote one a few months back about my Lord mount replacement experience on a C-model.  Hope it helps: