New Member from Los Angeles

[Rudest Buddhist]

Hey Gang! Just introducing myself. Newly minted private pilot (Just finished my first BFR) working on my Instrument Rating out of KSMO. 150TT 102 PIC 11.2 Complex 30 High Performance. Used to fly 4 - 7 hours a month, now I'm doing 10 - 20. Daily driver is currently a 182P but I'm patiently looking for an M20F in the 50K - 70K range which I would hanger out at KEMT.

I'm curious what I should be doing in the meantime. What are the best ways to get my insurance down before I buy. Commercial License? Time in type? I found an M20C a hour or so away from my house and was curious if I did 25 hours in that if it would help with my M20F insurance rate. There's also an M20F available 2 hours flight time away if the model is more important.

This website has been a great resource already. Donated a couple bucks to help keep the lights on.

Cheers!

[ArtVandelay]

Commercial doesn't help according to my insurance agent: instrument definitely as does having a hangar . Welcome.

I would start browsing now: I spent 6 months, keeping track of planes, what they had, prices etc in a notebook or use a spreadsheet. That way you'll know when a good deal comes up.

Welcome!

[Rudest Buddhist]

Thanks! Glad to be here.

That's a good idea with the spreadsheet. How did you handle RT or Type time when you were buying?

[Mooneymite]

SMO?

Fly fast....before they shut it down.  

Is SMO your closest airport?

Welcome aboard.

[mike_elliott]

19 minutes ago, Rudest Buddhist said:

Hey Gang! Just introducing myself. Newly minted private pilot (Just finished my first BFR) working on my Instrument Rating out of KSMO. 150TT 102 PIC 11.2 Complex 30 High Performance. Used to fly 4 - 7 hours a month, now I'm doing 10 - 20. Daily driver is currently a 182P but I'm patiently looking for an M20F in the 50K - 70K range which I would hanger out at KEMT.

I'm curious what I should be doing in the meantime. What are the best ways to get my insurance down before I buy. Commercial License? Time in type? I found an M20C a hour or so away from my house and was curious if I did 25 hours in that if it would help with my M20F insurance rate. There's also an M20F available 2 hours flight time away if the model is more important.

This website has been a great resource already. Donated a couple bucks to help keep the lights on.

Cheers!

underwriters love to see >200 hrs retract and love to see it in make and model. Instrument rating is a huge reducer of the insurance bill, because it really  does make you a better pilot.

Build time in a retract while working on your instrument rating.

[Rudest Buddhist]

Just now, Mooneymite said:

SMO?

Fly fast....before they shut it down.  

Is SMO you closest airport?

Welcome aboard.

Haha it is the closest and it can be frustrating. Although the on-airport community is one of the best I've ever seen...and I grew up at Poplar Grove!

[Oldguy]

Just now, mike_elliott said:

underwriters love to see >200 hrs retract and love to see it in make and model. Instrument rating is a huge reducer of the insurance bill, because it really  does make you a better pilot.

Build time in a retract while working on your instrument rating.

Ditto what Mike says.

And in preparation for a Mooney, make hitting exact speeds the norm in your flying. 

[Rudest Buddhist]

2 minutes ago, mike_elliott said:

underwriters love to see >200 hrs retract and love to see it in make and model. Instrument rating is a huge reducer of the insurance bill, because it really  does make you a better pilot.

Build time in a retract while working on your instrument rating.

Can do! There's a M20C renting for $140 a few hours from my place. I'm planning on spending my weekends in it and racking up hours.

[mike_elliott]

Just now, Rudest Buddhist said:

Can do! There's a M20C renting for $140 a few hours from my place. I'm planning on spending my weekends in it and racking up hours.

Thats almost as cheap as owning one, actually..

[Rudest Buddhist]

Just now, mike_elliott said:

Thats almost as cheap as owning one, actually..

That's what I thought. These rates are crazy: http://duboisaviation.com

[ArtVandelay]

I had 4.5 hrs complex time, 150 total with PP and IR, My insurance was 2.8%, after 200hrs, it dropped to about 1% of hull value.

[Rudest Buddhist]

Just now, teejayevans said:

I had 4.5 hrs complex time, 150 total with PP and IR, My insurance was 2.8%, after 200hrs, it dropped to about 1% of hull value.

Was it a gradual drop or did they set you at 2.8% until you crossed 200hrs RT?

[ArtVandelay]

Was it a gradual drop or did they set you at 2.8% until you crossed 200hrs RT?

Definitely not gradual. As mentioned, 200 is a milestone for insurance companies.

[jaylw314]

38 minutes ago, Rudest Buddhist said:

Hey Gang! Just introducing myself. Newly minted private pilot (Just finished my first BFR) working on my Instrument Rating out of KSMO. 150TT 102 PIC 11.2 Complex 30 High Performance. Used to fly 4 - 7 hours a month, now I'm doing 10 - 20. Daily driver is currently a 182P but I'm patiently looking for an M20F in the 50K - 70K range which I would hanger out at KEMT.

I'm curious what I should be doing in the meantime. What are the best ways to get my insurance down before I buy. Commercial License? Time in type? I found an M20C a hour or so away from my house and was curious if I did 25 hours in that if it would help with my M20F insurance rate. There's also an M20F available 2 hours flight time away if the model is more important.

This website has been a great resource already. Donated a couple bucks to help keep the lights on.

Cheers!

All right, another SMO guy!  I started my private training with Justice Aviation before they closed down.  I finished it up in Oregon.  I have to say, having started in the LAX area with all the controllers really helps with radio work later.  A lot of guys I run into up here have never spoken with ATC and avoid towered airports, so you have a good start to your IFR ticket.

My insurance was about 2.5% of hull value for an M20J the first year with 300 total hours, no complex time or IFR ticket.  My second year was about 1.5% with 120 M20J hours, and I'm hoping next year it will be down further with my IFR ticket.

[Rudest Buddhist]

Just now, jaylw314 said:

All right, another SMO guy!  I started my private training with Justice Aviation before they closed down.  I finished it up in Oregon.  I have to say, having started in the LAX area with all the controllers really helps with radio work later.  A lot of guys I run into up here have never spoken with ATC and avoid towered airports, so you have a good start to your IFR ticket.

My insurance was about 2.5% of hull value for an M20J the first year with 300 total hours, no complex time or IFR ticket.  My second year was about 1.5% with 120 M20J hours, and I'm hoping next year it will be down further with my IFR ticket.

Nice! I was one of the last guys out of Justice. Joe had his retirement party ~4 months after I got my ticket. That school was the best, ended up with a private in 44 hours after the check ride.

[jaylw314]

That's nice to hear, they seemed a good bunch of guys and took care of me.  I was sad to hear when they closed up shop.

[Simon]

Welcome.  I live in Echo Park and fly out of VNY.

 

[carusoam]

Welcome aboard, RB.

Funny thing about insurance...

1) you buy coverage for a year.

2) The price you get is based on all of your experience on day one.

3) you get a lot of experience That first year, then the price drops.

4) you might see insurance cost about 3amu

5) After a year, the price may drop to about 2amu

6) If you could get a lot of experience for 1amu before getting the insurance, this would make sense.

7)10 hours at $100/hr probably isn't enough to tip the experience scales...

8) getting time in a rental Mooney, would be helpful to know what you are buying...

9) spending an AMU getting transition training in your new plane would be a good idea...

Rough numbers based on conversations around here. Don't be afraid to ask these questions to your insurance broker.

Best regards,

-a-

[TomR]

Congrats. As others have said definitely get that instrument rating. That is the single biggest cost reducer early on(not to mention makes you a much better pilot). Hangaring your plane is also important for your insurance rates 

[MIm20c]

I agree with the response from @carusoam  

In my case if I got 200 hrs of complex and an IR it would save enough premium to pay for 5 rental hours. I would fly your 182 as much as possible and continue the IR. Personally I would not rent Mooney time at this point. Just find a good instructor when you purchase. 

[sgrooves]

Bought my M20J fresh off my PPL with about 50 hours, none in type. Only a couple insurance companies would quote me. Best I found, first year was about 2,200. Second year, with more experience and based out of a towered airport actually went up to 2,300. The rationale was fear of retracts, hmmmm.

Four months later, I had 160 hours, over 100 in type, and 85 in the last year. Also had recently gotten my IFR ticket. On a whim I rechecked quotes via the sporty’s promotion and it dropped to 1,350 with 10k additional hull coverage. Paid the short rate cancellation on my original policy, got 1,400 back, to basically get a 4+ month extension and more protection at no cost. Didn’t get all of my money back by cancelling but it was more than worthwhile.  

Biggest costs have definitely been maintenance, both normal and unforeseen. It was awesome getting into my plane each day for instrument training when I was also the last to fly beforehand. And lots of instruction in the plane I’d be flying.

[Skates97]

Bought my C with I think 58 hours in a Cherokee. Insurance was $1,500 for the first year with no complex time and a PPL that the ink was stored on. It was right about 4% of the hull value. Going to be renewing soon and will have over 200 hours and 140+ in type. Assuming it should come down, but honestly it's not that bad. It's a little more than renting that one at Dubois for ten hours. 

I think theirs is a B. That's the school where I got my PPL but I never flew the Mooney. If I remember right @chrixxer flew their Mooney recently before buying his plane,  he could give you a pirep on it. 

[Rudest Buddhist]

Thanks for the response everyone. Sounds like IR + total time is the best use of my time right now.

Sounds like Mike Jesch out of Fullerton is the goto Mooney CFI in SoCal?

Anyone in CA have any recommendations on a decent Mooney A&P? @Simon @Skates97

[carusoam]

RB,

It will be very helpful to add a location to your avatar.  Something close, if unable to be exact....

Best regards,

-a-

[Skates97]

1 hour ago, Rudest Buddhist said:

Thanks for the response everyone. Sounds like IR + total time is the best use of my time right now.

Sounds like Mike Jesch out of Fullerton is the goto Mooney CFI in SoCal?

Anyone in CA have any recommendations on a decent Mooney A&P? @Simon @Skates97

I don't have a recommendation for and A&P for you. I have one that was recommended to me that I have talked to about the doing my annual that is coming up in December. There's also an A&P at Corona that removed my mags, sent them out for the 500 hour, and reinstalled them. I was very happy with that, but that's not really Mooney specific. I am going to talk to him about pricing for an annual as well as I know that he has worked on a number of Mooney's. I'm not sure yet what direction I will be going.