New donuts ?

[Hank]

What if... An individual contracted the manufacturing of 110 urethane toy wagon wheels that just so happened to be the same dimensions and durometer as a Mooney shock disk? It seems like the metal (aluminum?) plates could be reused; why do they need to be bonded to the rubber/urethane? I've no interest in selling aircraft parts but selling wagon wheels might not be a bad small-time venture. Probably not enough CBs out there to make it worth the trouble.

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The brass/bronze plates are adhered to new shock discs when purchasing them from Lord. Running a hundred would most likely require the rubber company to build a mold, and even cheap molds are many AMUs. I've been in plastic molding for far too long, and just don't see how rubber molds, even prototype rubber molds, could be made for less than ~$75 per puck at this quantity.

 

Eleven could be stamped, then machined to round off the edges, for not too much money. I think. That's why I asked for material [urethane], durometer [80-90?] and size; I can't measure mine, they're already installed, which compresses the thickness and makes them larger in diameter. My stack of old pucks was about ¼" shorter than my stack of new pucks.

[MyNameIsNobody]

Seriously, 100 per is just a total ripoff. I would love to pay under half that.

[Yetti]

If someone were to get the fina1 mo1d dimensions, I wou1d be happy to machine a mo1d out of au1m.   I am guessing it wou1d be one piece 1ike a cake pan.   I cou1d do a two part.  A durometer guage is about $1000.00

[Hank]

If someone were to get the fina1 mo1d dimensions, I wou1d be happy to machine a mo1d out of au1m.   I am guessing it wou1d be one piece 1ike a cake pan.   I cou1d do a two part.  A durometer guage is about $1000.00

 

I was going to talk to my new buddy at the rubber manufacturer, see what he'd charge to machine 11 of them. Then just need written request from an owner to make some, right? "Can you please make me 11 rubber things this size, this durometer, from urethane? Thanks! Signed, whoever" is all it should take, as long as "whoever" owns the Mooney that the new pucks are for, right?

[ArtVandelay]

Seriously, 100 per is just a total ripoff. I would love to pay under half that.

That's retail, if you got 100 MSers and order 1100 from the manufacturer, I wonder how much they would be?

[Guest]

While they are not really price with any reality, at 100$ each times 11 pieces, which last an average of 10 years it works out to about 100$ per year, where is the issue? It's the equivalent of dinner out with my wife.

Clarence

[Yetti]

I was going to talk to my new buddy at the rubber manufacturer, see what he'd charge to machine 11 of them. Then just need written request from an owner to make some, right? "Can you please make me 11 rubber things this size, this durometer, from urethane? Thanks! Signed, whoever" is all it should take, as long as "whoever" owns the Mooney that the new pucks are for, right?

Pretty much how I understand the process. I think there are some peop1e on here that understand the STC process.  It wou1d be nice if an association cou1d be formed and ho1d the STC.   I am not sure what amount of change means "not a factory part" and then needs an STC.   The p1ates just seem to act 1ike a bearing surface no big dea1 to put those in.   An easier way may be to buy a sheet of urathane and machine some pucks out.   http://www.universalurethane.com/Urethane_Products/Polyurethane_Urethane_Sheet_Specifications.html#specs%C2'> The skate board whee1 peop1e were cast mo1ding then machining to fina1 dimension/shape on a 1athe.

[ArtVandelay]

Pretty much how I understand the process. I think there are some peop1e on here that understand the STC process. It wou1d be nice if an association cou1d be formed and ho1d the STC. I am not sure what amount of change means "not a factory part" and then needs an STC. The p1ates just seem to act 1ike a bearing surface no big dea1 to put those in. An easier way may be to buy a sheet of urathane and machine some pucks out. The skate board whee1 peop1e were cast mo1ding then machining to fina1 dimension/shape on a 1athe.

Yetti,

I think your L key is broken, your 'l' are '1'

[mike_elliott]

My experience with urethane in automotive applications is that it will infact out last rubber, but then so will steel, and the ride will be about the same! I put a urethane engine mount in my Porsche and removed it almost immediately. Perhaps urethane can be engineered to absorb noise, vibration and harshness, but in every application I've experienced, those qualities suffer for the sake of precision and rigidity.

My former race team sponsor 3M has a division that would be just the folks to analyze existing and supply the "perfect" material for the job.

http://www.earsc.com/HOME/products/DampingandIsolation/index.asp?SID=47

[MyNameIsNobody]

I can buy a car tire for 100 bucks. Size of die, labor to store, materials, storage, handling, shipping of a tire vs a gear puck...come on people it is complete BS created by the FAA.

There are superior formulations of rubber/plastic 50 years later, but no one will go through regulatory hurdles to make a competitive product for less. Because of regulations and testing for a certified little piece of rubber...

B.S.

Chew on that while at dinner with your wife.

[Marauder]

I can buy a car tire for 100 bucks. Size of die, labor to store, materials, storage, handling, shipping of a tire vs a gear puck...come on people it is complete BS created by the FAA.

There are superior formulations of rubber/plastic 50 years later, but no one will go through regulatory hurdles to make a competitive product for less. Because of regulations and testing for a certified little piece of rubber...

B.S.

Chew on that while at dinner with your wife.

Then there are bike tires. My tubeless bike tires are $90 each.

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[Yetti]

and yet you can get a $3 tube and put in a Kenda who1esa1e tire for $27.00   But if you think the $90.00 tire makes you go faster that is OK too.

[cnoe]

I'd like to see Lord's sales numbers on these. IIRC there were about 10,000 M20s manufactured. Most use the same disk. If half those are still flying (anybody know?) then we're talking about a fleet of ~5,000. If the average replacement time is 10 years (another assumption) then we're talking about 500 planes buying 11 disks each every year. That's 5,500 disks a year X probably $75 each wholesale for a gross sales of $412,500 per year. That's if your market share is 100%.

 

Considering all the costs involved it's not something I'd quit my day job to start up, but for an idle retiree it might be worth looking at.

 

And after considering it more fully overnight, I realize that it's not "durometer" that's the controlling factor; it would be compressibility and rebound to consider (which I still believe could be easily tailored with urethane).

 

I imagine when my time comes (in the next couple of years) I'll be buying the stock disks like everybody else. And I'll tell my wife to ask Clarence why we're not going out to dinner that week.

[Shadrach]

Then there are bike tires. My tubeless bike tires are $90 each.

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Are you a competition rider or just a weight weenie?  Given your taste for tonnage, it surprises me that you'd worry about saving what 120gr per wheel?  I ride Viittoria Rubinos with latex tubes. Puncture resistant if not light at >400gr per axel.  What do I care, I only ride for the exercise!

[MyNameIsNobody]

Speaking of donuts, I need one to sit on after riding 15 miles on my vintage TREK 7900. Must be from being a big ball Mooney driver :-)

[bonal]

you can approach this from the cheap bastard philosophy lets say there getting old but still serviceable so you replace half the pucks on each leg and then however many years later the other half. Get a rotation going kind of like financing your landing gear.

[RobertGary1]

I put new mounts on this year when I replaced the engine. Lord's engine mounts run around $700. But it comes with the FAA paperwork that makes everyone happy. If I manufactured such parts I'd charge for the FAA hassle as well. I'm not into donating my time for such things.

 

-Robert

[ArtVandelay]

I put new mounts on this year when I replaced the engine. Lord's engine mounts run around $700. But it comes with the FAA paperwork that makes everyone happy. If I manufactured such parts I'd charge for the FAA hassle as well. I'm not into donating my time for such things.

-Robert

Capitalist !

If you are a real CBs, y'all would jack your plane up to take the weight off, they would last much longer.

[Marauder]

Are you a competition rider or just a weight weenie?  Given your taste for tonnage, it surprises me that you'd worry about saving what 120gr per wheel?  I ride Viittoria Rubinos with latex tubes. Puncture resistant if not light at >400gr per axel.  What do I care, I only ride for the exercise!

 

Just keeping up with the Jone's. I ride a lot and the tubeless are nice for self sealing.

[Guest]

Makes me glad the Piper only used shock discs on the prototype Comanche then put on oleos for production. Two "O" rings at 1$ each and a quart of hydraulic oil sure seems cheap, leaving money for dinner with the family.

Clarence

[Hank]

Makes me glad the Piper only used shock discs on the prototype Comanche then put on oleos for production. Two "O" rings at 1$ each and a quart of hydraulic oil sure seems cheap, leaving money for dinner with the family.

Clarence

Right up until your cylinder(s) develop a leak. Away from home. On a weekend.