Need advice on nav lights

[Glen Davis]

I have a 1989 M20J. It has strobes on the forward wing tips, which also contain a green and red nav light. On the trailing edge of the wind tip are my white NAV lights. They are not LED, they are old-fashioned incandescent bolts. One of them works, and the other one is intermittent. I can only get it to work by holding the bulb and bulb socket in my hand and wiggling it slightly. See photo. That leaves me to believe that the problem may not be in the socket, but actually in the wiring behind the sock. But that’s hard to get to as I would have to remove the entire wing tip. Has anyone had any experience with this and any positive results you can share. I’ve included a couple of pictures  for your reference. Is there a modern Whalen or some other company replacement for this trailing edge white wing tip light. I would prefer not to have to spend thousands of dollars for an entire new wingtip lighting system just because one incandescent light isn’t working. Does anyone possibly have this socket which holds the incandescent light that they’d be willing to sell me?

[Fly Boomer]

36 minutes ago, Glen Davis said:

Does anyone possibly have this socket which holds the incandescent light that they’d be willing to sell me?

I don't have the numbers, but some of the sockets (and maybe lamps) have been discontinued, and replacement requires a different socket and lamp combination.  Someone with the details will be along shortly.

[warren.huisman]

Swap bulbs and make sure the issue follows the socket and not the lamp.


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[PT20J]

That looks like the bi-pin bulb/socket which is obsolete. There are no LED replacements. The porcelain socket looks discolored. Did it get glue or something in/on it. That metal clip should have .020 safety wire through the holes tightened just enough to hold the bulb without cracking the glass.

If the socket or wiring is bad, best to replace it with the newer wedge base bulb/socket which may still be available. 

[PT20J]

If it’s a bad bulb, search eBay for a Whelen H35W28V.

[Mark89114]

No advice on the socket issue, but I had to replace mine and the same problem sort of.  Details are a little fuzzy so bear with me.

The wires were too short and inaccessible so we had to run new wires further downstream in the wing.

Now it is coming back to me....the canon plug was failing and is inaccessible, looks like factory hooks it up and then rivet the wing tip in space, we simply moved a new canon plug down further in one of the access holes.  I agree seems ridiculous to buy a new light set up for a $15 bulb mechanism.   

[Slick Nick]

8 hours ago, PT20J said:

If it’s a bad bulb, search eBay for a Whelen H35W28V.

I just bought a half dozen of these NOS Whelen from a guy on eBay. I thought my MSE had been converted to the A508-28 spec but my serial number falls just short. If I wasn’t able to find the bulbs, I was going to convert to the newer sockets that utilize the A508 bulbs. 

It’s interesting to note, the form factor of the H35W28V bulb is exactly the same as a traditional 9005/9006 automotive bulb, just without the base. I pulled one apart and it fit like a glove in the socket. Of course, it would blow because it’s only rated for 12V, but perhaps there’s something out there, with that form factor, which would make for a cheaper replacement and be good for 28V. I suppose you could also wire in a resistor that would drop the voltage down to enable the use of a 14V bulb once these are truly obsolete and sold out. 

[Slick Nick]

8 hours ago, Mark89114 said:

No advice on the socket issue, but I had to replace mine and the same problem sort of.  Details are a little fuzzy so bear with me.

The wires were too short and inaccessible so we had to run new wires further downstream in the wing.

Now it is coming back to me....the canon plug was failing and is inaccessible, looks like factory hooks it up and then rivet the wing tip in space, we simply moved a new canon plug down further in one of the access holes.  I agree seems ridiculous to buy a new light set up for a $15 bulb mechanism.   

What serial number is your airplane? Looks like after 24-3221 they changed the plug design according to the IPC. 

[Glen Davis]

24-3103

 

[Pinecone]

One issue with swapping those to LED is that, at least on some aircraft, they are part of the dimming circuit for the annunciator.  So you end up with it always dimmed.

I replaced my nav lights and strobes with Whelen Orion 650 LED units.  With adding one wire, the tail strobe is also a nav light, so the wing tip lights are not actually required.  But mine are operational.

[Slick Nick]

On 11/12/2024 at 7:14 AM, Pinecone said:

One issue with swapping those to LED is that, at least on some aircraft, they are part of the dimming circuit for the annunciator.  So you end up with it always dimmed.

I replaced my nav lights and strobes with Whelen Orion 650 LED units.  With adding one wire, the tail strobe is also a nav light, so the wing tip lights are not actually required.  But mine are operational.

I run with my nav lights on all the time, I hated how the annunciator dimmed during daylight hours with the nav lights on, so I just grounded the third wire on the back of the switch to a ground lug on the panel, and voila permanent bright "GEAR DOWN" annunciator. Being green, it's not that distracting at night either even on full brightness.

[Yetti]

That's a halagon bulb.   You can get them at HomeDepot.   Make sure it is 12volts.  They have 120 and 12V.     take the bulb and make sure the pin spacing is the same.    You may be able to find a ceramic socket in a lamp they sell or order some off amazon.   First step would take a VOM sick the leads in the pin sockets and wiggle to make sure the wire is good.   See the rust on the rivet on the socket.   Probably the same with the light pin contacts.

[Glen Davis]

Mine is 28 volt but the Home Depot Socket idea is brilliant.  Is that in the aviation section, near paint?