How to address this hangar rash my plane came with

[M20 Ogler]

My plane came with hangar rash on both outboard trailing edge corners of the ailerons. Can this be repaired with out having to reskin or replace the ailerons? 

[MikeOH]

That's just 'patina'

My question is, what is hanging from the rafters??

[Vance Harral]

We also bought an airplane with "hangar rash" on the ailerons, though after looking at it for years and years I came to the conclusion it was most likely the result of a ham-fisted attempt to rig them by bending the trailing edges with incorrect tools.  Ours was along the inboard trailing edges, not out at the outboard tips like yours.  Yours looks, frankly, worse.  The skin of that port side aileron appears to be cracked, and would make me nervous.

In our case, we flew the airplane that way for a long time.  But things came to a head when we needed to replace an aileron control arm bracket due to wear.  The bracket is fastened to the aileron leading edge with a conventional bolt and nut, but the nut is inside the aileron, and there is no way to get a wrench on it without partially de-skinning the aileron.  We took the airplane to Beegles for that work.  The guys at Beegles looked at our ailerons, said they weren't entirely sure they were legally airworthy in the shape they were in (while acknowledging the airplane had been flying for years that way and that it was matter of opinion), and recommended a full re-skin, which we did.  We now have much nicer looking ailerons, though the paint doesn't match (in fairness to Beegles, our existing paint is awful, more than the usual challenge to match).  The cost was a little spendy, but not earth shattering.  I think it was $2-3K, but this was several years ago, so the exact amount we paid isn't really relevant to what you'd pay today.

Based on our experience, I'm pretty confident the guys at Beegles would recommend a re-skin of your ailerons.  That's not to say someone else might have a different idea, but I can't imagine what it would be.  I've seen trailing edges of various surfaces repaired with patches, including - for better or worse - elevators and flaps.  But never ailerons in my experience, and never in any case at the corner as is shown in your photos.

If you do have the ailerons re-skinned, I'd advise replacing that control arm bracket as well.  Again, they do wear after 40+ years, and there is no way to replace them without a partial de-skin.

[Shadrach]

I have similar rash on my right aileron from a cabinet door blowing open during pushback. I was quoted $3500 to reskin it back in 2016. I passed. When the plane gets repainted, I will address it then.

[Jerry Pressley]

used ailerons are cheap compared to reskin.  available from quite a few places

[MikeOH]

10 minutes ago, Jerry Pressley said:

used ailerons are cheap compared to reskin.  available from quite a few places

^^^^.  THIS. ^^^^

Early in my ownership 'experience' I pushed my plane into a storage rack in my hangar and mangled the elevator (it doesn't take much!) I bought a used elevator for $800 (about 6 years ago)...with shipping, painting, balancing, R&R, it was about $2K mistake.  (Storage rack is no longer there)

[phxcobraz]

I’d think something like that could be bent back with a sheet metal pliers to be inline with the rest of the aileron. 
I have some rash on my right wing, was there when I bought it. Clearly someone hit a runway light or sign. It’s never really affected anything and so I’ve just left it until it gets painted at some point. 

[M20 Ogler]

1 hour ago, MikeOH said:

That's just 'patina'

My question is, what is hanging from the rafters??

Giant RC plane I spent way to much $ on before I decided to start flying the real thing 

[tony]

4 hours ago, Shadrach said:

I have similar rash on my right aileron from a cabinet door blowing open during pushback. I was quoted $3500 to reskin it back in 2016. I passed. When the plane gets repainted, I will address it then.

I had a similar event on my elevator, I just waited for a used one to become a available.  Then when I got the airplane painted, I swapped it out.  

[Shadrach]

12 minutes ago, tony said:

I had a similar event on my elevator, I just waited for a used one to become a available.  Then when I got the airplane painted, I swapped it out.  

That is my plan. While I dislike it, it’s cosmetic only and low on my list of priorities.

[M20F]

This is the gas can to have   
 
4 fit easily in the baggage compartment of a Mooney for tankering cheap gas, not that I would know.  

[ArtVandelay]

I’d think something like that could be bent back with a sheet metal pliers to be inline with the rest of the aileron. 
I have some rash on my right wing, was there when I bought it. Clearly someone hit a runway light or sign. It’s never really affected anything and so I’ve just left it until it gets painted at some point. 

The metal is torn on the one pictured and the other looks like there’s putty?

[A64Pilot]

5 hours ago, M20 Ogler said:

Giant RC plane I spent way to much $ on before I decided to start flying the real thing 

Giles 202? I had a 1/4 scale Great Planes, best flying big airplane I ever had.

On the Mooney, gently try as much as is realistic to reform the material, knowing that if you try for perfection you’re likely to crack it, paint it and ignore it. But I would spot paint it to prevent corrosion if nothing else.

Some things cost way more to fix that it’s worth, this is one of those. 

[M20 Ogler]

3 hours ago, A64Pilot said:

Giles 202? I had a 1/4 scale Great Planes, best flying big airplane I ever had.

Slick 540

[Jerry Pressley]

Have a few good ones.  Also Fox has some. Don't know why aileron skins new are sooo expnsive

[MikeOH]

On 8/10/2024 at 2:25 PM, M20F said:

This is the gas can to have   
 
4 fit easily in the baggage compartment of a Mooney for tankering cheap gas, not that I would know.  

@M20F

"Not that you would know" but the description for that 'can' says it's NOT for gas!

 

[dkkim73]

1 hour ago, MikeOH said:

@M20F

"Not that you would know" but the description for that 'can' says it's NOT for gas!

 

 

I wonder... When some of the CARB standards were appied, a lot of excellent gas cans suddenly became "no longer gas cans" and you were instead directed to buy flimsy, overpriced plastic cans with ludicrously complicated theoretically-vapor-reducing designs. 

A lot of good cans were suddenly no longer approved. E.g. the Sceptre plastic cans used by the military among others.  

I got the impression that some cans sold as "not for fuel" could easily and safely be used for fuel, but others not. The whole thing was a great example of unintended consequences of well-meaning regulation. So it might be worth some legwork on materials, etc. 

my 2 cents

 

 

[M20F]

1 hour ago, dkkim73 said:

 

I wonder... When some of the CARB standards were appied, a lot of excellent gas cans suddenly became "no longer gas cans" and you were instead directed to buy flimsy, overpriced plastic cans with ludicrously complicated theoretically-vapor-reducing designs. 

 

This would be the case.  It is an excellent disperser of animal feed as well though. 

[Shadrach]

3 hours ago, MikeOH said:

@M20F

"Not that you would know" but the description for that 'can' says it's NOT for gas!

 

And here’s one that should definitely not be used for diesel…

 

 

[MikeOH]

5 hours ago, M20F said:

This would be the case.  It is an excellent disperser of animal feed as well though. 

However, I'd avoid its use for 'animal attractants' when carried in your airplane

[dkkim73]

6 hours ago, M20F said:

This would be the case.  It is an excellent disperser of animal feed as well though. 

Perhaps for the  preferred diet of the rake-tailed greatwing North American bugsmasher? 

[Pinecone]

Funny the a jug from VP Racing FUELS, cannot be used for fuel.

That I said, I have a couple of red ones with UL94 (due to longer storage life) for my generator and snow blower.  And several clear ones in my hangar with 100LL.

[M20F]

14 hours ago, dkkim73 said:

Perhaps for the  preferred diet of the rake-tailed greatwing North American bugsmasher? 

@Marauder fills these with sugar to attract a special beast. 

[1980Mooney]

On 8/10/2024 at 9:57 AM, M20 Ogler said:

My plane came with hangar rash on both outboard trailing edge corners of the ailerons. Can this be repaired with out having to reskin or replace the ailerons? 

Back on topic.  I know that you got plenty of recommendations to reskin or buy a used aileron, rebalance and repaint with quotes of over $3k from experiences about 8 years ago.  I am sure that it will cost you much, much more now.  If you have piles of money to burn then that makes great sense - I know many will say "no biggie" and "if that is an issue for you then you probably should not be owning a plane".  But why make this a few $ thousand problem when it should only be a few $ hundred.

I had a similar situation when I purchased my J about 25 years ago.  Before it had wingtips it suffered rash on the outboard tips of the ailerons.  My A&P at the time, an old-timer that started with Boeing in Wichita in the 50's, was a wizard in aluminum.  He repaired/rebuilt all the cracked up aluminum gliders in Houston at the time.  He straightened the tip out and put on a small doubler.  Rebalanced.  At the time the painting was just a touch-up.  Rocket Engineering did not have a problem with it when they installed the IO-550A and wingtips.  I don't baby my plane and I fly as fast as I can as often as I can - frequently at Vne.  People can wring their hands over a repair like this but it is not an issue.

Save your money for something that matters.

[Mark89114]

Nice repair.  Looks good to me.

I too also don't use the yellow and red cans as pictured for any type of fuel.  That would clearly be dangerous.