How to Attach Battery Minder plane simply

[larryb]

It all depends on the charger and voltage. The pic below is from a Concord Lifeline battery manual. You can always just charge with the float voltage. It'll take longer for a full charge but the battery will eventually get there and you can leave it charge as long as you want. I generally use a bench power supply where I can set a particular voltage and max current.  I usually use 13.8V or 27.6V. 

 

The Battery minders do measure temperature and adjust the voltage accordingly.  

 

 

 

 

 

[tmo]

23 hours ago, EricJ said:

I can't find my notes from the seminars, which were about five years ago, but they were both pretty adamant about not using automotive minders.

Did you believe them? I wouldn't, especially WRT flooded batteries, but probably not for the GEL ones either. But I'd believe you. I mean, we're pushing <1C, do we really need to push it differently than a car does? I kind of doubt our voltage regulators are that precise, and flying often is said to be the best way to keep them batteries healthy.

[EricJ]

1 hour ago, tmo said:

Did you believe them?

Why wouldn't I?   It was a technical seminar, not a sales meeting, and the rationales and explanations made sense to me, and I'm an electrical engineer.   Both the Concorde and the Gill reps were consistent about it, so I've no reason to doubt the veracity of their positions.    Neither company sells minders.

[A64Pilot]

On 10/26/2023 at 2:03 PM, PeteMc said:

I'd also be curious what the difference is.  I've now got power, so a battery minder may be in the future.  

Pending how much I fly, not sure if it would be worth it or not.  

 

Not much

On flooded batteries believe it or not but the acid used in aircraft batteries is stronger as in more acid vs water in the mix. Specific gravity is higher. Do not service your flooded battery with acid from the auto parts store, heck take that to its logical conclusion and don’t put a flooded battery in your aircraft, ever. Eventually there will be corrosion.

On the Concorde VR RG SLAB, there is essentially no difference between their Aircraft battery and their ground use Lifeline battery.

The Battery Tenders I use meet Concorde’s Absorption voltage and float voltages. “Desulphation” chargers unfortunately are snake oil, I wish they weren’t but they are.

The only way to partially reverse sulphation is with an equalization charge, which is an intentional monitored overcharge and you really, really need to remove the battery from the aircraft to do one, and tiny float chargers can’t produce enough current to accomplish one either. If we could reverse sulphation then a lead acid battery would last decades.

What minders, tenders etc accomplish is by maintain the battery at float voltage, they greatly slow sulphation accumulation and significantly increase a batteries life. 99% of batteries die from sulphation, it’s rare for an internal short etc. to occur, but those are part of the 1%.

There is some fire risk with ANY charger, heck with anything electrical. Only you can decide if the benefit is worth the risk. I float my batteries.

[A64Pilot]

On 10/27/2023 at 11:33 AM, larryb said:

It all depends on the charger and voltage. The pic below is from a Concord Lifeline battery manual. You can always just charge with the float voltage. It'll take longer for a full charge but the battery will eventually get there and you can leave it charge as long as you want. I generally use a bench power supply where I can set a particular voltage and max current.  I usually use 13.8V or 27.6V. 

 

The Battery minders do measure temperature and adjust the voltage accordingly.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

Nit picking but to be precise you’re supposed to monitor the battery temp and not air temp, reason is as a battery is charged the temp increases. These minders don’t measure battery temp, but honestly it probably doesn’t matter much when your only 1.5 amp charge.

Often the neg terminal of the battery is where the temp is measured.

We lived aboard and cruised a Sailboat for three years. and I got real deep into battery banks, first because they are exceedingly important, running refrigeration, navigation and every modern convince and secondly good batteries out in the Caribbean don’t exist at any price and cheap ones are very expensive. I had a 660 AH Lifeline bank, today I wouldn’t consider anything but LifePo4. I had multiple, redundant charge sources.

The battery tenders I use are within .1V of Concordes spec absorption and float voltages, and your correct we don’t really need three stage chargers to be battery tenders, we only need float voltage, because it’s in the name, they are maintainers, not chargers  

Technically the Lifeline battery manual isn’t what we are supposed to go by as we have Aviation batteries, but in truth as the Lifeline and Concorde Aircraft batteries are essentially identical and the Lifeline manual is MUCH more comprehensive, in my opinion it really is the one we should be referencing

[PeteMc]

4 hours ago, A64Pilot said:

“Desulphation” chargers unfortunately are snake oil, I wish they weren’t but they are.

Sorry to hear that.  I have know "of them" for years, but never did much research since I never had power.  I'll probably go back to my trickle charger to just warm the battery and hope I'm flying enough that a Minder wouldn't matter anyway. 

[A64Pilot]

6 hours ago, PeteMc said:

Sorry to hear that.  I have know "of them" for years, but never did much research since I never had power.  I'll probably go back to my trickle charger to just warm the battery and hope I'm flying enough that a Minder wouldn't matter anyway. 

Float chargers will significantly increase a batteries life, but those that advertise pulsing high frequency or whatever to desulphate don’t do anything extra if you will, but they usually sell for a higher price because of course they say they have an additional feature.

I’m only saying don’t pay extra for a charger with a desulphation cycle, not saying float chargers don’t work, because they do.

Old fashioned trickle chargers often are bad for a battery because they don’t control voltage very well and if left on continuously can over charge a battery, which will lead to electrolyte loss, you can add water to a flooded battery but you can’t to an AGM. You can eventually dry out a Concorde even though it it is a recombinant gas battery meaning it recombines hydrogen and Oxygen to create water.

I don’t know how though, always meant to ask but never have.

I guess all I had to do was Google it

https://www.eastpennmanufacturing.com/wp-content/uploads/Guide-to-VRLA-Batteries-1927.pdf